Handling source segments with Bolt & using QuickPlace
Thread poster: MikeTrans
MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 15:53
Member (2005)
Italian to German
+ ...
Jun 30, 2011

Hello,


my problem is very straight-to-the-point when seeing it onscreen, alas more complex when writing it down. Don't hesitate to re-ask me about details. Thank you!

In Studio 2009 SP3 I'm often working with projects containing, I would say, Word documents of normal formatting with characters, characters in Bold, grafics inserted, little grafics to represent icons in sentences, but no multi-columns. In fact, Studio is so kind to show me only the sentences with Bolt and non-Bolt characters when opening the file for translation.
And my problem starts right here:

Any time when a source sentence contains non-Bold & Bold characters of the same font, when I start typing in the target, then the font changes, not being identical to the font of the source segment. I have then always to select parts of the sentences and use QuickPlace to adjust the right fonts.
All this takes long, and I'm afraid that I'm not using the right method.

But one should expect to see the non-Bold font of the source when starting to type by default, not a 2nd or 3rd one. How do you archieve this? When the source doesn't contain any bold, then, no problem, typing in the target will immediately start with the 'right' font. The same when I copy the source to target and then overwrite, but this is not always handy.

The only relevant part I found in the general Settings (Tools > Options) was the Editor > Font Adaptation. My settings are:

8/12, 8/12 for the Adapt Font Sizes activated;
Adapt Text Colors activated;
Microsoft Sans Serif for German (my target for the translation).

I have the feeling that I miss something or I don't use QuickPlace as I should, else there would be a 'simple' step I oversee.

How do you handle sentences containing Bolt and how is QuickPlace used at its best?

Thank you very much for your comments & feedbacks!

Mike


[Edited at 2011-06-30 19:29 GMT]


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Emma Goldsmith  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 15:53
Member (2010)
Spanish to English
Show tags Jun 30, 2011

If you can't see the tags then I think you probably have the wrong setting when you go to Tools>Options>Editor>"formatting display style". I set it to "show all formatting and tags".
Also, you can experiment with toggling the WYSIWYG setting (it looks like a newspaper icon in the translation toolbar at the top.
HTH


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MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 15:53
Member (2005)
Italian to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
trying out immediately... Jun 30, 2011

Hi Emma,
thanks very much for your prompt reply. I'll try out this, also going indepth in the Online Help about the menus youv'e mentioned.
Thanks,

Mike


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MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 15:53
Member (2005)
Italian to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
More tags, more work... Jun 30, 2011

Emma,
I've made the changes you suggest and I see more tags now: those which define the fonts. However it doesn't change anything for the processing of the sentence, it's even worse, as you must manually open/close all tags with CTRL-Down (QuickPlace). Or do I miss something?

I must say here that I'm only familiar with the methods used in MemoQ, where you are just done by selecting the words and make them bolt, or in DVX where you must press a key (F8) between the bold expressions, in Fluency, you almost don't deal with tags at all.
What I'm saying is: the part of the sentence which doesn't contain special formatting is (and should be) always recognized as is. No need to tell it to the program.
I can't believe Trados is so much different, and this explains my question above.

In the meantime I go indepth in the manual, but I would still highly welcome any feedback.
Greets,
Mike

P.S.
Would a special filter for the document do the trick and avoid handling with tags when not necessary?

[Edited at 2011-06-30 22:16 GMT]

[Edited at 2011-06-30 23:16 GMT]


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:53
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
Font adaptation is JUST what you see on your screen Jul 1, 2011

A very general remark, not addressed to anyone in particular:

When working with CAT tools please forget about the "usual" way of formatting.
ALL CAT tools use tags to format text, however some of those tools (like Studio) do pretend the formatting is done similar to how it happens in Word. This is only partially true.
While you indeed can use shortcuts like CTRL+B for bold, the effect applied is not always exactly the same as in the source.
The only way to see how formatting is really applied in the document is showing only tags and NO formatting at all. This way you get a clean document, where only the tags need to be placed in correct positions to format the target. If you then show also the full tag text in Studio (one of the biggest advantages of Trados software at all, which nearly no one pays attention too - but try to identify tags in MemoQ for example...) you can exactly see what the tag does. You can read, that it for example applies Times New Roman bold 12 point. And also you can see, that all formatting tags are pairs, ie you have a starting tag like <b> for BOLD and </b> to stop bold formatting.
There are also special effects in text, which not always need to be used, like "spacing".
You will certainly see tags with the word "spacing" - you can delete such tag pairs. The pair always starts with a tag with the word "spacing" and ends with /cf or /fc, depends on the source software.
Learning how to deal with tags makes the usage of all CAT tools very easy.

Now to your special case: show tags and formatting.
Copy source to target. Place the cursor in front of a tag and start typing. Observe what happens. Now place the cursor behind the tag and start typing - check the difference. Maybe this will make it more clear to you.

Why Studio is so different from MemoQ? In fact it is not. But the concept of Studio is much more flexible, allowing you to play around with tags in a way MemoQ will not allow. You can delete tags, change their order and move them to a different location. As long you do not leave orphaned tags (for example delete the <b> tag from the bold pair <b> </b>), but delete the tags in pairs, and never delete functional tags like field, bookmark or similar, Studio will produce target. MemoQ however will not allow you to delete even a single tag in a Word 2003 file.

[Edited at 2011-07-01 20:46 GMT]


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MikeTrans
Germany
Local time: 15:53
Member (2005)
Italian to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
But: why are some sentences not showing tags ... Jul 1, 2011

... making my work much easier? Why is then not EVERY sentence filled with an opening and ending tag ? I suppose they take the information from the previous sentence.

Thank you for your detailed response, Jerzy. Unfortunately I didn't see your answer before posting the same problem by giving a specific example to make my point more clear. Would it be too much asking you to take a look at the example sentence given in this topic below and tell me if those many tags are really necessary to handle all? Thank you very much!

The topic in question is:
http://www.proz.com/forum/sdl_trados_support/202334-too_many_tags_for_fonts_after_importing_in_studio_2009.html

Mike


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