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The basics, support
Thread poster: Yngve Roennike

Yngve Roennike  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:57
Swedish to English
+ ...
May 27, 2005

I am just starting working with Trados, version 6.5, and needed a quick tutorial, if someone would kindly assist me a bit, since reading manuals/animated tutorials may be time-consuming and a deadline is looming.

I am finding that my production is dropping by at least half in terms of speed of what I am used to without Trados, incidentally, pretty ironic isn?t it.

My processor has a memory of 512 megabytes, and so I don?t understand why things are moving so slowly. Perhaps MTE extract patch release III which would not install due to an alleged absence of the program to be patched, is part of the reason.
Right now I have it set so that the text to be translated is present in the input field, which allows me to use my electronic dictionary to copy to and paste from. It often takes several seconds just to move to the next field Set/Close next Open, and cursor movement is inhibited.

How do you backtrack to a previous input field? Get previous placeable cannot be it, since nothings happens when I click on that button in the bar. I need to go back and revise, i.e., I need previous open/get. Is there not such a button available for swift navigation, just like there is a next open/get?

I sometimes forgo these input fields completely and simply go back and change whatever needs changing. At times this hangs up the process, and I have to do a Fix Document maneuver.

I do still use the global search and replace feature, to save time when inputting translations. Do any of you use that method also, and what are the potential consequences of this in the Trados environment.

I?ll stop here. If someone could assist in a helpful manner, I?d appreciate it.


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Gillian Searl  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:57
Member (2004)
German to English
Frustrating isn't it May 27, 2005

but perfectly normal! When you first start using Trados your productivity goes down because you need to think like the people who wrote the blessed program.

Are you working in normal view in word? That usually speeds up the delay. If you work in print layout view word repaginates each time it goes to the next segment.

There is no "go back to previous segment" button. You have to close, click on the segment and open. I hope the next version will include that. You can go back and change without the input fields - there's usually no problem with that, except for the first character in the sentence. To edit that it makes sense to "open" the segment otherwise you can seriously mess up the coding. Global seach and replace is fine.

Hope that helps
Gillian


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Yngve Roennike  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:57
Swedish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Appreciate your quick comment. May 27, 2005

Interesting. I am working in normal and not print layout, and I see the pagination occurring when I use print layout.
Is your input and navigation speed affected in the way I described above? This seems completely unworkable. When I spoke with someone at Trados, they said many use one gig in terms of RAM memory. Maybe that's is what's really needed.

Sometimes the Get button does not grab the entire sentence, what might be the reason for this, and is there something that can be done about it. For example the last word could be left dangling and appearing in a new input field.

I am utterly perplexed. This was supposed to be of tangible benefit, I must be missing something, surely (?).

Gillian Noameshie wrote:

but perfectly normal! When you first start using Trados your productivity goes down because you need to think like the people who wrote the blessed program.

Are you working in normal view in word? That usually speeds up the delay. If you work in print layout view word repaginates each time it goes to the next segment.

There is no "go back to previous segment" button. You have to close, click on the segment and open. I hope the next version will include that. You can go back and change without the input fields - there's usually no problem with that, except for the first character in the sentence. To edit that it makes sense to "open" the segment otherwise you can seriously mess up the coding. Global seach and replace is fine.

Hope that helps
Gillian



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Gillian Searl  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:57
Member (2004)
German to English
Dangling words May 27, 2005

You need to check for soft returns (shift return). Are you using "show hidden text"? That will show them up. Other reasons may include colons etc. There is a way to change the segmentation rules but that's beyond me. Maybe Ralf Lemster or one of the other experts can help you out with that.

I promise when you get used to Trados it does get easier and your productivity will go up - it's the learning phase that is hard. Keep going!


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jmadsen  Identity Verified
Local time: 18:57
Quite easy ... when you know how ;-) May 27, 2005

Forget the toolbar and the menu. Simply use the shortcuts:

Place the cursor in the sentence to translate.
Press Alt+Home to open the segment.
Press Alt+Num+ to close current segment and open the next segment or
Press Alt+End just to close the segment.

These three commands are used 90% of the time.

If you want to edit a previous segment, place the cursor in that sentence and press Alt+Home. Edit and close.

To restore the segment to source, press Alt+Delete.
To insert source text in target, press Alt+Insert.
To insert source text in target automatically, select Options>Translation Memory Options>General>Copy source on no match.
To search the memory (Concordance), hightlight the relevant word(s) and press Alt+Up arrow.

You might want to turn off Term Recognition (if it's on):
Crtl+R (or Options>Term Reconition). That'll speed things up.

I have 512 MB RAM, and it works like a charm.

This will get you started. You'll quickly get used to the shortcuts. Then speed will definitely pick up. If you need other tips, let me know.

Jørgen

[Edited at 2005-05-27 08:17]

[Edited at 2005-05-27 13:29]


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xxx00000000
English to French
+ ...
SDLX May 27, 2005

I don't want to rub it in, but you should try SDLX. Your Trados wouldn't be entirely wasted because (1) it would enable you to honestly tell customers you have it, (2) you could use it to pretranslate files in such a way that you could hand in genuine Trados uncleaned files and (3) you'd know for a fact that you're not missing anything except freezes and opaque error codes.

You can try the full version of SDLX for one month. You'll notice right away that it is much less demanding on your system.

http://www.sdl.com/products-translation/products/products-freelance.htm

Best,
Esther (Trados 6.5, SDLX 2004)

[Edited at 2005-05-27 07:19]


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 19:57
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
Macro for jumping to last segment May 27, 2005

There is a macro which can be installed under Trados that lets you jump to the former segment. Its written by Yves Champillion, the creator of Wordfast. You can download it there.
Regards
Heinrich

PS: Maybe you should try to use TagEditor with your wordfiles. I haven't tried it, but there was some discussion about it here.

[Edited at 2005-05-27 07:29]


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Dr. Janos Annus  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 18:57
Member (2005)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
RAM size does not semm to be a problem May 27, 2005

I have 256 MB RAM only with Pentium III, and I have no problem with Trados speed. There must be something else. Virus, lots of errors in the Registry and some other reasons may slow down.
The segmentation rules you can change in Workbench, File, Setup... just study it a little bit and then you will figure it out. You can make it custom, e.g. when you have a listing of expressions, you can set the segment to a comma, or other characters.


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xxxBrandis
Local time: 18:57
English to German
+ ...
should try out Fusion May 27, 2005

Hi! it is very similar to Trados, only lot easier, especially your learning curve, you´d up and running within 30 min (depending upon your system resources and the type of file you are currently processing). Resouces can be found at proz.com, and it gives you full functionality for a certain period (I think 15 days, earlier it used to be 90 days). And above all it is very transparent, ie., you can see the content of your TM and what is happening at that particular moment as you work, additionally all the future add-ons are for free.
Rgds,
Brandis


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Antoní­n Otáhal
Local time: 18:57
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
Depends on the source of the orignal file - a few tricks May 27, 2005

When the original was created in a non-standard way, there may be some "hidden layers" slowing down the segment-to-segment step

Quite often it is sufficient to open the doc file in Open Office and save as a Word file from there. Usually it strips it of some of the hidden load and the Trados translating goes faster.

Another trick is to analyse, export sergments (99% or lower) to a rtf, translate this rtf (you should have the original file printed, or open on another monitor for reference) - this translation goes smoothly - and go to "fuzzy translating" the original file from the TM afterwards.

Antonin


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Michele Johnson  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 18:57
German to English
+ ...
Virtual memory issue? May 27, 2005

Yngve, I also recently installed Trados but I am not having the problems you mention. Interestingly, I only have 256 MB RAM, but it works just fine on my PC - no delay as you describe, even with many other programs open and running.

What operating system are you using? If you look at Task Manager (Ctrl-Alt-Del + Task Manager), is Trados eating up all your resources/CPU time? Could it have something to do with virtual memory? This is really not my area of expertise but perhaps others can help you here. I have read that optimizing virtual memory will often make programs run better/faster. Here is some background information:
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/question684.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_memory

Also:
http://www.proz.com/post/37500#37500
http://www.proz.com/post/901#901
(where Fiona recommends that you can increase it to about 700 MB when having 256 RAM).

On XP, I set virtual memory under Control Panel: System: Extra: Performance (sorry, these are English translations of my German version of XP, yours may be called differently).

Any virtual memory experts out there? Could this be the problem?


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Yngve Roennike  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:57
Swedish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Term recognition be gone! May 27, 2005

This is great stuff.

Actually, I did manage to work out these short cuts before.

Turning off term recognition has sped up things quite a bit, but still could be just a tad faster, i.e., when I'm typing is still a blind affair, i.e., there is a great delay before characters actually appear on the screen, and then sometimes they fail to appear altogether. I don’t know about you guys, but I think this is a sad situation! I wonder what term recognition does that could justify this deceleration.

I do have the source text inserted as default. That way you can highlight a word and quickly access an electronic dictionary which will then paste the translation back into Word. However, this task switching operation is again much slower as without Workbench, and can stall considerably, even with Term Recognition turned off!

Other acceleration tips are greatly appreciated.

Here is another poser:

Can you work outside these entry fields while Workbench is stilll running? Sometimes just placing your cursor somewhere else in the document and doing some editing without accessing this entry mode is a lot faster and efficient. Does it sabotage what Trados is trying to do?


Thanks.



[quote]Jørgen Madsen wrote:

Forget the toolbar and the menu. Simply use the shortcuts:

Place the cursor in the sentence to translate.
Press Alt+Home to open the segment.
Press Alt+Num+ to close current segment and open the next segment or
Press Alt+End just to close the segment.

These three commands are used 90% of the time.

If you want to edit a previous segment, place the cursor in that sentence and press Alt+Home. Edit and close.

To restore the segment to source, press Alt+Delete.
To insert source text in target, press Alt+Insert.
To insert source text in target automatically, select Options>Translation Memory Options>General>Copy source on no match.
To search the memory (Concordance), hightlight the relevant word(s) and press Alt+Up arrow.

You might want to turn off Term Recognition (if it's on):
Crtl+R (or Options>Term Reconition). That'll speed things up.

I have 512 MB RAM, and it works like a charm.

This will get you started. You'll quickly get used to the shortcuts. Then speed will definitely pick up. If you need other tips, let me know.

Jørgen

[Edited at 2005-05-27 08:17]



[Edited at 2005-05-27 18:02]


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Yngve Roennike  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:57
Swedish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Virtual memory usage is about 46 percent or so according to task manager! May 27, 2005

and I've tried closing as many programs running in the background as possible.

Thank you for the links, I'll get to them when I get the time to do so.

Yngve

Michele Johnson wrote:

Yngve, I also recently installed Trados but I am not having the problems you mention. Interestingly, I only have 256 MB RAM, but it works just fine on my PC - no delay as you describe, even with many other programs open and running.

What operating system are you using? If you look at Task Manager (Ctrl-Alt-Del + Task Manager), is Trados eating up all your resources/CPU time? Could it have something to do with virtual memory? This is really not my area of expertise but perhaps others can help you here. I have read that optimizing virtual memory will often make programs run better/faster. Here is some background information:
http://computer.howstuffworks.com/question684.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_memory

Also:
http://www.proz.com/post/37500#37500
http://www.proz.com/post/901#901
(where Fiona recommends that you can increase it to about 700 MB when having 256 RAM).

On XP, I set virtual memory under Control Panel: System: Extra: Performance (sorry, these are English translations of my German version of XP, yours may be called differently).

Any virtual memory experts out there? Could this be the problem?


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Yngve Roennike  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:57
Swedish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Pretranslate? May 27, 2005

Thank you Esther, but please define pretranslate, is it the same as rough translate. Just a bit more specificity would be nice.

Yngve

Esther Pfeffer wrote:

I don't want to rub it in, but you should try SDLX. Your Trados wouldn't be entirely wasted because (1) it would enable you to honestly tell customers you have it, (2) you could use it to pretranslate files in such a way that you could hand in genuine Trados uncleaned files and (3) you'd know for a fact that you're not missing anything except freezes and opaque error codes.

You can try the full version of SDLX for one month. You'll notice right away that it is much less demanding on your system.

http://www.sdl.com/products-translation/products/products-freelance.htm

Best,
Esther (Trados 6.5, SDLX 2004)

[Edited at 2005-05-27 07:19]


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Gillian Searl  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:57
Member (2004)
German to English
Pretranslate = Translate May 27, 2005

Yes, I'm sure Esther meant "Translate", as in automatically, which you do in workbench.

Working outside the fields? Do you mean inserting target language text without a source text? Yes, you can do that but you have to work with "Show hidden text" to make sure you don't mess the coding up. As long as the Trados codes are intact you can do anything you want to the document. The only question is why you would want to? But I'll leave that one up to you.
Gillian

[Edited at 2005-05-27 16:05]


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