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Misleading advert? 34,501 words translated in 10 hours by only one translator
Thread poster: Yasutomo Kanazawa

Yasutomo Kanazawa  Identity Verified
Japan
Local time: 18:48
Member (2005)
English to Japanese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you Laurent Nov 25, 2009

Laurent KRAULAND wrote:

Yasutomo Kanazawa wrote:
I wonder if there are any of the English native speakers who received the same ad in English. I'm curious what the tagline says originally in English (I could make a good guess, but still) and would like to compare it to other language(s).

Would anybody be kind enough to do that?


No problem, Yasutomo, here it is - for some strange reason, I always receive bilingual (FR/EN) emails from that source:

34 501 mots. 10 heures. Un traducteur. Cela vous paraît impossible ? - 34,501 words. 10 hours. One translator. Sound impossible?


So, it seems that I guessed correct, and the taglines that I've seen so far give me the impression of misleading advertisement.
A bit off-topic, but in my country, this kind of ad is not allowed. For example, especially in the cosmetics or the stocks market, the use of the words "absolutely" and "never" are forbidden, as in "you'll absolutely lose 5 kilos in 10 days using the XX method for losing weight" or "if you buy this certain stock, you will never regret it". Of course, in the latter case, unless you're cheating doing insider trade, that's a different story. Everybody is different, and I believe most of the forum followers are CAT users, so they all know what's behind it, but to a non-user who has no clue about any CAT tool, that person might really believe and adds credibility that the tagline is true, especially done by a certified person, Ms. Greenfield. If this was done by some Joe off the street, people may think that he's one of the shills employed by that CAT tool company.


 

Enrico C - ECLC  Identity Verified
Taiwan
Local time: 17:48
English to Italian
+ ...
Possible but only with almost all 100% matches Nov 25, 2009

I did about 15.000 words a day (6 hours of work or so because after i got too tired to keep focus on those) with a TM created and then maintained by myself (hence reliable to the point of allowing me to just do open/close segment with TagEditor) with 2007 Suite.
But the reason why i could do that is that those segments (Excavators) were as follows:
1) Same segments had been previously amended and improved over many and many manuals during a 2 years period so i got to the point of kno
... See more
I did about 15.000 words a day (6 hours of work or so because after i got too tired to keep focus on those) with a TM created and then maintained by myself (hence reliable to the point of allowing me to just do open/close segment with TagEditor) with 2007 Suite.
But the reason why i could do that is that those segments (Excavators) were as follows:
1) Same segments had been previously amended and improved over many and many manuals during a 2 years period so i got to the point of knowing every single segment also in manuals of over 150.000 words
2) Huge parts of the manuals were technical specs and lots of numbers
3) Amount of new words/fuzzies from a manual to the other was never higher than 3000 words, OR LESS.

It goes alone IT CANNOT BE DONE WITH NEW WORDS and IT CANNOT BE DONE WITH TOO MANY FUZZIES (Which often require a high level of concentration and waste of time)

Hence, it's just a misleading advert created by a smart marketing team. I am sure the 34000 words are true (they must be true because they know they could have legal issues otherwise).....maybe they just "forgot" to say they were almost all 100% matches and so all what she had to do was the boring open/close segment stuff.

That's it

I got the email as well, in both Italian and English and didn't believe any of what i read....especially knowing how marketing works.........like any translator can imagine....marketing is marketing...we even translate those things so we should be aware about the tricks of it
Collapse


 

Grzegorz Gryc  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:48
French to Polish
+ ...
Chuck Norris... Nov 25, 2009

Jabberwock wrote:

I found this particular passage curious:

"I just completed a 34,501 word project in 10 hours thanks to AutoSuggest™, Context Match and the other nifty time-saving features within SDL Trados Studio 2009 SP1. That’s without having much of anything in the pre-existing TM!"


No problem, folks.
Chuck Norris does it twice in one round-house kick.

Cheers
GG


 

SDL Community  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 11:48
Member (1970)
English
Some Clarifications on this Quote Nov 25, 2009

Dear all,

I have read this thread and the various posts within it, and I think it is appropriate to put some clarification around this to avoid any further inappropriate and unnecessary personal comments towards a fellow Professional.

The quote was this.

I just completed a 34,501 word project in 10 hours thanks to AutoSuggest, Context Match and the other nifty time-saving features within SDL Trados Studio 2009 SP1. That’s without having much of anything in the pre-existing TM!


This quote is based upon the translator working on a large Excel file that contained many repetitive segments. A large percentage of these segments became Context Matches in the Translation Memory as the translation progressed and because of the additional checks that Studio makes to ensure the accuracy for these types of matches the translator was able to accept them without question as they were automatically confirmed as a result of Auto-Propogation. This means that only a smaller number required attention and as it was possible to add terms to the Termbase on the fly, that were also repetitive, the AutoSuggest feature was able to use these in addition to other strings offered in this way and reduce the amount of typing and as a result complete the work faster.

All of these things would not have been possible with previous versions of the software.

I hope this provides the clarification you are looking for and removes the need to have to question the integrity of the translator who has provided a perfectly valid quote because of the success she is having in making use of SDL Trados Studio 2009.

If any of the users on this thread would like to make more use of these features themselves, or would like to know more about them please feel free to contact me either through this forum or directly (pfilkin@sdl.com) and I will be very happy to help.

Kind regards

Paul Filkin
SDL Trados Technologies


 

Aguas de Mar (X)
No, it does not Nov 25, 2009

SDL Support wrote:

I hope this provides the clarification you are looking for and removes the need to have to question the integrity of the translator who has provided a perfectly valid quote because of the success she is having in making use of SDL Trados Studio 2009.

Kind regards

Paul Filkin
SDL Trados Technologies


As I mentioned before, I am not questioning so much the veracity of the ad, but the person who made the statement. I find it a very delicate situation that one of ATA's presidents endorses one specific brand of CAT tool (in an ad for which she probably received compensation), and I would really like to see some ATA authority post here or in their ATA magazine to this regard.


 

Aguas de Mar (X)
I agree... Nov 25, 2009

Charlie Bavington wrote:

There is a great deal of supposition there. And if we want MG to come in and explain herself, I think we should refrain from bandying about too many assumptions and allegations. There is, clearly, a lot omitted from the original description of the task as described, but that does not make it "not true".


I agree with you Charlie, that we should be very careful, stop making assumptions, and hope to very soon read postings from either MG or any other ATA executive here.

I personally have not seen the ad and have no confirmation that the quote belongs to MG. But I believe that the ATA and its executives should also be very careful about the activities into which they engage. I do not think it is appropriate for an ATA executive member to participate in an ad (regardless of whether she received compensation or not) and endorse a specific CAT tool, as it might be construed as an endorsement of the ATA to that particular translation service provider (even if the add carried a disclaimer to this effect).

These are the type of practices that, even though not strictly forbidden, come too close to what could be considered unethical, and which an association like the ATA should try to avoid, if it wants to retain what is left of the credibility it still has among the translators/interpreters' community.

As an ATA member, I find this promotion of a particular CAT tool by an ATA executive member to be unacceptable and disturbing, and I believe I am not alone.

[Edited at 2009-11-25 12:18 GMT]


 

Grzegorz Gryc  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:48
French to Polish
+ ...
Where the truth lies... Nov 25, 2009

SDL Support wrote:

I have read this thread and the various posts within it, and I think it is appropriate to put some clarification around this to avoid any further inappropriate and unnecessary personal comments towards a fellow Professional.

The quote was this.

I just completed a 34,501 word project in 10 hours thanks to AutoSuggest, Context Match and the other nifty time-saving features within SDL Trados Studio 2009 SP1. That’s without having much of anything in the pre-existing TM!


This quote is based upon the translator working on a large Excel file that contained many repetitive segments. A large percentage of these segments became Context Matches in the Translation Memory as the translation progressed
quote]

Paul, I easily imagined it, but the problem is how many words she exactly translated without repetitions etc.
I translated several times 3000-5000 words in one hour but their weighted count was completely different.

When SDL puts this kind of quotation without any additional explanation, I think it's SDL itself who puts in doubt the translator's integrity.

PS.
Can we have this file for benchmarks?
Of course, it may be modded in order to preserve the client identity etc.

Cheers
GG

[Edited at 2009-11-25 12:52 GMT]


 

SDL Community  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 11:48
Member (1970)
English
Benchmarks and who's accountable Nov 25, 2009

Grzegorz Gryc wrote:
When SDL puts this kind of quotation without any additional explanation, I think it's SDL itself who puts in doubt the translator's integrity.
Can we have this file for benchmarks?
Of course, it may be modded in order to preserve the client identity etc.


Hi Grzegorz,

On a personal level, and not speaking for SDL, I find this whole thread quite amazing. First of all these are purely "soundbites" and not detailed whitepapers to allow an analysis of how well a tool performs. They are designed by SDL, and quite legitimately, to attract interest and are always based on truth. Secondly, I think anyone who tries to take a surface level comment and then analyse them in this way is really wasting their time. I imagine I could, I know you could, take an excel file that no CAT tool would handle satisfactorily, and could similarly take one to make the figures appear amazing.

In this instance, this was a real file, translated without an existing TM to leverage, and the software was able to make use of the content in this particular file in a way that was not possible with previous versions of our software.

Aguas de Marco wrote:
....... (in an ad for which she probably received compensation), .....


It is comments like this that I find extremely insulting and completely unwarranted. I can assure you that this translator received no compensation whatsoever for providing this quote. I am also amazed that ProZ are still allowing this thread to continue with such remarks.

Regards

Paul


 

XX789 (X)  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 11:48
English to Dutch
+ ...
Paul Nov 25, 2009

Paul, with that kind of reasoning, I can translate 999.999.999.999.999.999 words in 10 minutes With DéjàVuX Workgroup. Especially because the text had 999.999.999.999.999.998 repetitions.

So there you go. DéjàVuX Workgroup is way better than Trados.

I'm just trying to show how misleading your advert is.



[Edited at 2009-11-25 13:29 GMT]


 

Céline Odo  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 11:48
English to French
+ ...
To SDL Support Nov 25, 2009

Could you please clarify which version was used to be so efficient?
If I am not mistaken, the fabulous AutoSuggest feature you mentioned is not fully supported in the Freelance version of the software whereas it is native in other 2nd generation CAT tools.

I understand that this new SDL Trados software is intended to help agencies and not freelance translators.

[Modifié le 2009-11-25 13:39 GMT]


 

XX789 (X)  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 11:48
English to Dutch
+ ...
Nasty Nov 25, 2009

I am also amazed that ProZ are still allowing this thread to continue with such remarks.


Nasty isn't it. People being allowed to express their views.


 

Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 12:48
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
in 10 minutes Nov 25, 2009

Loek van Kooten wrote:

Paul, with that kind of reasoning, I can translate 999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999. words in 10 minutes With DéjàVuX Workgroup. Especially because the text had 999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.999.998 repetitions.



Loek, you are exaggerating


 

XX789 (X)  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 11:48
English to Dutch
+ ...
LOL Nov 25, 2009

You're right Selcuk. I deleted a few 9's I actually wonder whether such text would even fit in a computer's memory.

 

Maciek Drobka  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 11:48
Member (2006)
English to Polish
+ ...
Taking insults easily Nov 25, 2009

SDL Support wrote:


Aguas de Marco wrote:
....... (in an ad for which she probably received compensation), .....


It is comments like this that I find extremely insulting and completely unwarranted. I can assure you that this translator received no compensation whatsoever for providing this quote. I am also amazed that ProZ are still allowing this thread to continue with such remarks.

Regards

Paul

[/quote]

I am surprised that what Aguas said above could be taken as extremely insulting.
- Aguas said 'probably'.
- In a subsequent posting, Aguas said 'regardless of whether she received compensation or not'.
- Receiving compensation for endorsing a product if you are a well-known member of a relevant community is quite normal in my opinion.

I am amazed that anybody would want a topic closed because of a statement like this. However, with a few recent cases of the site staff closing topics on what I thought were purely arbitrary grounds, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it happened here.

Maciek


 

SDL Community  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 11:48
Member (1970)
English
So what is all the fuss about? Nov 25, 2009

Céline Odowrote:
If I am not mistaken, the fabulous AutoSuggest feature you mentioned is not fully supported in the Freelance version of the software whereas it is native in other 3rd generation CAT tools.


You are mistaken. The use of an ASD (AutoSuggest Dictionary) is fully supported in all versions of the software. The only restriction is on creating one and for this you need Professional or Freelance with AutoSuggest Creator. Currently the latter is included with Freelance anyway.

I would be interested to see which other software has this as a native feature? Some tools do handle the idea of subsegment matching in other ways, but I have not seen this feature anywhere?

Loek van Kooten wrote:
Nasty isn't it. People being allowed to express their views.


When they are aimed at an individual who is talking about her personal experience and written in such an insulting manner, then yes. I would be ashamed to post such comments. I have no problems with people expressing their views when they are worth listening to, founded or unfounded.

Loek van Kooten:
So there you go. DéjàVuX Workgroup is way better than Trados.


Well now that we are seeing a more reasoned approach to an unqualified soundbite this starts to sound more like the educated thought process of a Translation Professional. Did this really warrant three pages of posts?

Regards

Paul


 
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