Is there any other tool co calculate my earnings than CATCount?
Thread poster: Martin König

Martin König  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:23
Member (2007)
English to Czech
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Sep 9, 2014

Hi, I have quite an issue with it. I have downloaded the CATCount and loaded it with data, but the output does not satisfy me. I simply do not believe the calculations.

Do you know any other tool how to calculate one's earning with use the Trados Repetitions and percentages etc, please?

Or maybe somebody could tell me what I am doing wrong with the CATCount / how to work with the "Total CATCount:" number.

Desperately lost,
Martin


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Partha Sarathi Satpathy  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 14:53
English to Hindi
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Why not use the old faithful excel? Sep 9, 2014

It is easy to get this done using MS Excel or any other spreadsheet program.

Fuzzy Match||Word Count||Fuzzy Rate ||Effective Count (Word Count x Fuzzy Rate)

Take the total of all "Effective Count" and it will give the chargeable word count.



[Edited at 2014-09-10 01:07 GMT]


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Martin König  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:23
Member (2007)
English to Czech
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Excel? Sep 9, 2014

Hi Partha,

Thank you for your contribution. The thing is I would never use words "old faithful" in connection with Excel.
I hate it from all my heart and really sincerely, which results in fact I have no idea how to do it nor even start. Such a jerk I am, really.


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Philippe Etienne  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 10:23
Member
English to French
Calculations are right Sep 9, 2014

Martin König wrote:
...I have downloaded the CATCount and loaded it with data, but the output does not satisfy me. I simply do not believe the calculations....

Your "Trados matrix" may be flawed.
CATCount works with .csv files generated by "old Trados" (v.2007 and older), I don't know if new Trados generates compatible .csv files. With other CAT tools, you can insert the analysis results manually.

Try with a decent grid like this:
100%/reps: 20% of full rate (or a fifth, or your rereading rate)
85-99% match: 60% of full rate (using fuzzy matches retrieved in a CAT tool, you should save AT LEAST 40% of the time needed to translate from scratch)
0-85% match: 100% of full rate (no significant difference between reworking a 70% fuzzy match and translating from scratch)

Suppose a Trados analysis with 1000 "no match", 500 85-99% matches and 1000 100% matches:
With the grid above, the resulting "wordcount" (aka "weighted wordcount") is:
1000*100% + 500*60% + 1000*20% : 1500 "weighted" words, compared to 3000 "actual" words.

In other words:
If you translate that text with a CAT tool in less than half the time you would need to translate it without CAT tool, then your grid is ok and you have some slack to pay back your CAT tool investment.
If not, you lose money using a CAT tool.

For CAT tool users, invoicing is based on "weighted wordcount" multiplied by FULL word rate.

Real-life sample: analyse in old Trados, resulting .csv file thrown at CATCount, CAT matrix already set for the customer
Match types: Words: Percent: Equivalent words:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perfect Match 0 0 0
Context Match 0 0 0
XTranslated 0 10 0
Repetitions 1432 20 286,4
100% Matches 282 20 56,4
95% - 99% 6 60 3,6
85% - 94% 17 60 10,2
75% - 84% 133 100 133
50% - 74% 450 100 450
No Match 3038 100 3038
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Total words = 5358
CATCount = 3977,60

I will charge 3977.60 words at my base rate.

Philippe


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Partha Sarathi Satpathy  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 14:53
English to Hindi
+ ...
Missed punctuation :) Sep 10, 2014

Martin König wrote:

Hi Partha,

Thank you for your contribution. The thing is I would never use words "old faithful" in connection with Excel.
I hate it from all my heart and really sincerely, which results in fact I have no idea how to do it nor even start. Such a jerk I am, really.


Dear Martin,

Sorry for missing the punctuation. It should have been "Old Faithful"... knowing that how reliable Microsoft products have been


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Martin König  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:23
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English to Czech
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TOPIC STARTER
...so it works and I got it right...? Sep 10, 2014

Hi Phillipe,

Thank you.
I just need to assure myself I do it the right way, thank you for your patience.
So, if I have following agreement (for 15601 words):

Repetitions 10% (273 words)
100% 10% (14020 words)
95% - 99% 20% (1303 words)
85% - 94% 40% (3 words)
75% - 84% 60% (1 word)
50% - 74% 60% (1 word)
No Match 100% (0 words)

I shall put these numbers into CATCount, enter the wordcount from Trados (have Studio 2014, so probably need to enter everything manually), and the resulting Total CATCount is the number I shall multiply by full rate.
This is the thing I somehow figured out, but the resulting number does not seem much real (1692,3).
Too much of 100% matches, I know, I know...


My last two question are:
- Context Match and 100% matches - Trados gives out these two items separately, but I probably have to add them together?
- The first box in CATCount, the "XTranslated", what does it mean, please? The Context Match?

Thank you for your patience with me.

Martin


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 10:23
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
The number you get is correct Sep 10, 2014

Martin König wrote:

So, if I have following agreement (for 15601 words):

Repetitions 10% (273 words)
100% 10% (14020 words)
95% - 99% 20% (1303 words)
85% - 94% 40% (3 words)
75% - 84% 60% (1 word)
50% - 74% 60% (1 word)
No Match 100% (0 words)

...The resulting number does not seem much real (1692,3).


Yes, the number seems too low, but it is correct. I just manually checked it:

10% x 273 words = 27,3 weighted words
10% x 14020 words = 1402 weighted words
20% x 1303 words = 260,6 weighted words
40% x 3 words = 1,2 weighted words
60% x 1 word = 0,6 weighted words
60% x 1 word = 0,6 weighted words
100% x 0 words = 0 weighted words

Total weighted words: 27,3+1402+260,6+1,2+0,6+0,6+0 = 1692.3


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Philippe Etienne  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 10:23
Member
English to French
Sustainable Trados grids and abuse Sep 10, 2014

Martin König wrote:
...This is the thing I somehow figured out, but the resulting number does not seem much real (1692,3).
Too much of 100% matches, I know, I know...

Which means, if you usually translate 2500 words a day (say 7 productive hours), that you should need a bit less than 5 hours (1700/2500*7) to do that job.
Or 3000 words/hour.
Since it's mostly 100% matches, your standard rereading capacity (and making the odd edit) should be 3000/words/hour. Is it?
Put another way, your reviewing rate is a tenth of your translation rate. Is it?

AFAIC, I either don't charge 100% matches and don't even look at them, or I charge an editing rate. Midway rates mean that you don't have time to reread them properly, but you bear responsibility for any mistakes you missed.
Martin König wrote:My last two question are:
- Context Match and 100% matches - Trados gives out these two items separately, but I probably have to add them together?
- The first box in CATCount, the "XTranslated", what does it mean, please? The Context Match?

I think Trados used "Xtranslated", which meant Contextmatch for SDL, before the SDL-Trados merger. There is usually nothing to do on those segments (no issue with context) if the translation memory is properly maintained.

In my language combination, the discount matrix you gave is a typical example of abuse, with a special gold medal prize with honors on the 50-74%-match bracket, whose leverage is consistently useless. However, with this grid, you offer a 40% discount. "Luckily", there are almost no fuzzies, so it is not as bad as it could be. In this job, you only have to be a superfast rereader of 100% matches to earn your bread.

I hope I have given you a clear, relevant and eye-opening view of what a discount grid entails and what it means for your wallet. In other words, don't accept any grid that prospects offer you, because some of them are just unsustainable.
For non-arithmetics-type people, the smoke screen of CAT discounts is just another possible way to decrease even further your standard hourly rate, without your necessarily noticing it, since you may base your earning capacity on your base rate. It is crucial to know what discount grid percentages actually mean.

Philippe


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Christel Zipfel  Identity Verified
Member (2004)
Italian to German
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Repercussion of discounts Sep 10, 2014

I downloaded years ago an Excel sheet from the profile of a valuable colleague for the comparison of the final price of a translation with and without discounts.

I compiled it just for fun and out of curiosity (personally, I don't give any CAT discounts except for larger repetitions, at my own discretion) and was horrified: the overall rates and price of a translation dropped dramatically.

I saw that in order to earn the same amount with and without discounts, one should charge one and a half time ones rates if he/she is applying discounts. In other words, a rate of 10 cents at 30/30/60% in my hypothetical example (for 100% matches, repetitions and up to 95%, everything else being paid in full, which would be still much more convenient than what I normally see) became 6,7 cents overall or, if you want to get the same amount, you need to charge 14,9 cents for your full word price! I won't dare to think how much it would be if one gave discounts even for less than 95% matches! Of course, the exact values depend on the number of words and the percentages of fuzzies in a given text.

The assumption that reductions for fuzzies are proportional to the time you save is in my opinion a tall story. You save some time, sure, but not that much to compensate a considerable loss of earnings!

By the way, I believe that everything under 90% matches which is not paid in full means that you probably are not paid appropriately for your time and so you are a loser here, unless your word rate is high enough to compensate this loss. You can use the TM for context research, but nothing else. In my last translation, I had a number of fuzzies of 80% and each time, I had to rewrite totally the short sentence!

I agree that the grid you posted here anyway is a typical example of abuse, well said, Philippe!


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Martin König  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:23
Member (2007)
English to Czech
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Thank you, Samuel! Sep 10, 2014

Sad, but true.
Now I have to at least try to determine what is the Xtranslate box in CATCount for, and it would be over.

Many thanks for your hard work!


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Martin König  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:23
Member (2007)
English to Czech
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TOPIC STARTER
Just noticed two other answers Sep 10, 2014

Thank you both, Christel and Philippe.

I just needed to check/assure I understand the CATCount good, but thank you anyway.
This was very special project of about 400.000 words and I would not even consider it, if there was a slightest hint of abuse.

(However, I would love to have the Excel sheet, to be honest.)

Thank you everybody!


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