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Unhappy user of TO3000 (development has basically stopped)
Thread poster: Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer

Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Jul 31, 2016

Although it isn't perfect, I like TO3000, and have been using it for my invoicing now for years. However, one thing I hate is its absolutely glacial pace of development. There are a number of feature requests I asked for years, and years, and years ago (just small things, which I am sure would be very easy to add or fix), and which AIT still haven't managed to take care of. All I have heard from them for the last 2 years or so is apologies and that they are focusing on their corporate offering, Projetext 3D. Although I understand that a company like this has to focus on where the money is, competing tools (almost all of them cloud-based) are popping up like mushrooms these days (when I have a moment I will add a list of them to this post), and if they don't get their ass in gear, I think they might actually lose a lot of their freelance customer base, myself included.

As I said, although TO3000 isn't perfect, it gets the job done, which is primarily why I stick with it. That, and not wanting to go through the trouble of changing my whole system. The minute I find something better though, I am going to switch, as I don't like investing in software that has stagnated and which annoys me in small ways on a daily basis.

For example, every time I create a new job, the program insists on creating little folders called "Invoice" and "Jobs" on my computer, against my will, and there is no way to stop this from happening. Support has been aware of this problem for around two and half years, and keeps promising to fix it at some point.

Michael

PS: I asked a similar question recently @ http://www.proz.com/forum/software_applications/302093-when_will_the_new_version_of_to3000_translation_office_3d_be_released.html

[Edited at 2016-07-31 11:02 GMT]


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Manuela Ribecai  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 18:31
Member (2010)
English to French
+ ...
If you find better… Jul 31, 2016

feel free to contact me.

I also use TO3000 and love it but… I feel the same.

I had the same licence bug for 6 month before they change my key, and now the CAT count is down.
Same answer received (maybe their work on Projetext will give the solution).

Manuela


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Bruno Depascale  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 18:31
Member (2009)
English to Italian
+ ...
I stopped using this software..too complicated Jul 31, 2016

Why overcomplicating ourselves with an invoicing software?!
It's completely useless and overcomplicated. I think is much better (and faster) to do invoices manually


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Can't say that I agree with you there. Jul 31, 2016

Bruno Depascale wrote:

Why overcomplicating ourselves with an invoicing software?!
It's completely useless and overcomplicated. I think is much better (and faster) to do invoices manually



Once set up, the program saves me loads of time. I find it very handy how all I need to do is create the jobs and then collect a few of them into an invoice. All the calculations are done automatically, and the program spit out a perfect invoice for you.

I also use it to keep track of my business expenses, to see what I can get back from the tax man later on.

I also find it extremely useful that I can export an Excel file at the end of each tax year that shows all of my payments linked to invoices, etc.

And I use the "Client jobs" tab to keep track of current jobs (I'm not a fan of the clunky calendar).

So, as you can see, it is a useful program (to me at least). Just really wish they'd show it some love instead of focusing solely on its big corporate brother: Projetext 3D. Btw, just checked, and it seems AIT has been working on "Projetex 3D" since at least 2014, and still haven't released it.

Michael


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Philippe Etienne  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 18:31
Member
English to French
Happy user since 2005 Jul 31, 2016

Very handy and quick with a stable customer base. All I need to know business-wise is basically somewhere there. It's one of my core programs with Office (CD), Dragon, MemoQ, Chrome, Trados 2007, SR32, Copernic and a password manager.

When I changed countries in 2010, I asked support how I could keep all customer details and program settings while getting rid of all job-related info to start afresh with new accounting/currency, and within two days they had sent me a script that did exactly that. For free.

So far I have never seen any reason to shop for any other similar product or go backwards to Excel sheets, formulas and Word forms. TO3000 has everything I need, save maybe a few non-critical, convenience features.

Surprisingly, I have entered exactly 1500 jobs since August 2010, worth an undisclosed amount.

Philippe


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Angela Rimmer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2014)
German to English
+ ...
Bang for your buck Aug 1, 2016

Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer wrote:

Although it isn't perfect, I like TO3000, and have been using it for my invoicing now for years. However, one thing I hate is its absolutely glacial pace of development. ...

As I said, although TO3000 isn't perfect, it gets the job done, which is primarily why I stick with it. That, and not wanting to go through the trouble of changing my whole system. The minute I find something better though, I am going to switch, as I don't like investing in software that has stagnated and which annoys me in small ways on a daily basis.



But you have to admit though, for the price it certainly does a heckuva lot. That's what I tell people when they ask my opinion. I say, look, it's not a beautiful interface, it's not going to sing and dance and read you stories while it tucks you into bed. But it does a lot more than get the job done, and for a bit of software that you can basically run a business from, it is VERY cheap. In my case, it paid itself off within the first month because I saved so much time invoicing.

I do agree with you on the development. It feels like the developer moved on to other projects and left us here. But I don't know if I begrudge them that. I certainly would feel more strongly if they were charging more for the product. But at the current prices, I kind of feel like you get what you pay for -- and in this case you actually do get a lot of bang for your buck.

(Admittedly I do not have any annoying bugs with TO3000, though. The software does exactly what I ask of it. The only part of the software I don't like is the reporting function, which is not user-friendly enough to even be usable, in my opinion. But for reporting I just export to Excel and send those off to my accountant, so I'm not too bothered.)


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Yael Ramon  Identity Verified
Israel
Local time: 18:31
German to Hebrew
+ ...
not just invoicing... Aug 1, 2016

as the TO3000 is not compatible with my homeland taxation system, i hardly use it for invoicing. i do, however, appreciate its help in managing my time, reminding me of upcoming deadlines, and remembering my fees for each client.
there are many bugs, but it is still by far better than any other tool (if exists). by the way, it is always advisable to contact directly the developers, instead of complaining in PROZ. (Mikhail Sergievskiy (AIT) - support@projetex.com).

[Edited at 2016-08-01 06:47 GMT]


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Balasubramaniam L.  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:01
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
+ ...
Not perfect, but I still depend on it Aug 1, 2016

I have been using it for ages. Yes it has many warts (and I have an early version 8, which has even more warts and uglinesses - no unicode support in the text boxes, for example - so I can't type anything in Hindi in it), but it serves the purpose - invoicing, keeping track of payments, and various agency specific information such as rates, passwords, links, invoicing rules, and so on, in one place.

I have even put off upgrading to Windows10 mainly because my version of TO3000 is incompatible with it. I rated the usefuless of TO3000 above Windows10's in this matter!

When a software becomes near perfect, there is little scope for improvement and it wouldn't be worthwhile for the developers to invest in it, especially when their sales figures have plateaued for the product. And TO3000 is a tiny software aimed at a tiny niche - translators. So there is only so much it can yield for its developers in terms of income.

So I don't expect them to improve anything on it, I am quite happy with my version of it.


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I think a bit of development could actually result in higher sales of TO3000 Aug 1, 2016

Balasubramaniam L. wrote:

I have been using it for ages. Yes it has many warts (and I have an early version 8, which has even more warts and uglinesses - no unicode support in the text boxes, for example - so I can't type anything in Hindi in it), but it serves the purpose - invoicing, keeping track of payments, and various agency specific information such as rates, passwords, links, invoicing rules, and so on, in one place.

I have even put off upgrading to Windows10 mainly because my version of TO3000 is incompatible with it. I rated the usefuless of TO3000 above Windows10's in this matter!

When a software becomes near perfect, there is little scope for improvement and it wouldn't be worthwhile for the developers to invest in it, especially when their sales figures have plateaued for the product. And TO3000 is a tiny software aimed at a tiny niche - translators. So there is only so much it can yield for its developers in terms of income.

So I don't expect them to improve anything on it, I am quite happy with my version of it.

I don't really agree. I suspect that if they put some more work into developing it, and as a result, freelancers became a bit more enthusiastic about it (and therefore started ranting about to their colleagues) … they could potentially increase sales considerably. The freelance translation market might be tiny, on a global scale, but there are still quite a few of us in need of an invoicing/scheduling tool like TO3000, which is also shown by the recent proliferation of online tools.

By the way, you can save 45% on any version of TO3000 @ http://www.proz.com/tgb/ … which makes it very cheap indeed. I would definitely recommend upgrading from 8 to 11 (the current version). I'd put off Win10 for a while though, still happily on win7 myself. There seems to be no real benefits to moving to win10, plus I don't want to mess with my relatively stable combo of Dragon NaturallySpeaking 13 + win7 64-bit.

Michael


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I tried contacting the developers directly, for two years Aug 1, 2016

Yael Ramon wrote:

as the TO3000 is not compatible with my homeland taxation system, i hardly use it for invoicing. i do, however, appreciate its help in managing my time, reminding me of upcoming deadlines, and remembering my fees for each client.
there are many bugs, but it is still by far better than any other tool (if exists). by the way, it is always advisable to contact directly the developers, instead of complaining in PROZ. (Mikhail Sergievskiy (AIT) - support@projetex.com).

[Edited at 2016-08-01 06:47 GMT]


Thanks Yael,

I know. I have also already sent in a support request. Several in fact. The reason I am trying here on Proz is that companies sometimes listen when you post here because a lot of people are watching/reading. I usually start by sending the company an email or support request, or posting my question in their dedicated mailing list, but if no one listens or important bugs aren't fixed for over two years, it's time for other tactics

Michael


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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 18:31
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
I agree Aug 1, 2016

I agree. TO3000 is still hugely useful, but it's disappointing that bugs and quirks have remained untouched for years, and no features have been added for a long time.

I also agree that it's cheap. I'd rather pay five times as much in turn for a more active developer, though.

However, I still hold that AIT support is very responsive and helpful. It's the development behind them that's lagging.



[Edited at 2016-08-01 09:53 GMT]


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Alma de Kok  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 18:31
Member (2006)
Polish to Dutch
+ ...
Anycount and office 365 Aug 1, 2016

I am working with Office 365. Last fall there was an update (Office 2016) and since then Anycount doesn't work anymore. I informed support several Times about this, but I am still waiting for a change. Annoying. but basically this is the only minus I give TO3000, I am a happy user since 2007. Works fine with Windows 10.

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Volodymyr Kukharenko
Ukraine
Local time: 19:31
Member (2009)
English to Ukrainian
+ ...
Alternatives Aug 1, 2016

Hi guys,

Recently we have released the alternative solution called Protemos (www.protemos.com). It's a new online tool with similar functionality, and it is free for the freelancers. Now we are looking for the feedbacks to improve it further. So if you have any time to have a look and make your suggewstions, that would be great.


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:31
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
OK, as promised, my List of alternatives to TO3000/Projetex! Aug 1, 2016

ONLINE:

For freelancers:
Language Terminal (from the maker of memoQ) (https://www.languageterminal.com/ )
LSP.expert (https://www.lsp.expert )
OTM SOLISTA (development seems to have stalled) (http://www.lsp.net/otm-solista-project.html )
Proz.com Invoicing (beta) (https://www.proz.com/invoice/try )
BaccS (http://www.ibaccs.com )(keep an eye on this one; the developer is very responsive and eager to gain new users!)

For agencies (+ possibly freelancers):
GlobalSight (http://www.globalsight.com/ + http://www.localizationsmart.com/ )
Hercules Translation Project Management (created by Proz user TvNellen) (https://htpm.xyz/ )
MultiTrans (now belongs to RR Donnelley) (http://www.rrdonnelley.com/languagesolutions/solutions/multitrans.aspx )
OTM – Online Translation Manager (http://www.lsp.net/online-translation-management.html )
Plunet (http://www.plunet.com/en/ )
Project Translation (http://www.project-open.com/en/solutions/project-open-translation-mangement-system.html )
Protemos (www.protemos.com )
TranslationProjex (http://www.translationprojex.com/ )
Transwise (http://tranwise.com/ )
QuaHill (http://www.quahill.com/en/index.html )
Vitroff (created vy 1translate.com) (http://vitroff.com/ )
XTRF (https://www.xtrf.eu/ )
Wordbee Translator (http://www.wordbee.com/en/Products/Wordbee-Translator )

LOCAL:

For freelancers:
Gespoint Translator Professional (http://www.gespoint.com/Software/Programa-Facturacion-Impuestos-Traductores.aspx )(English page hasn't been localised yet. info only available in Spanish))
TOM Solito (http://www.jovo-soft.de/en/freelancer-translation-management/ )
TO3000 (http://to3000.com/ )

For agencies (+ possibly freelancers):
Gespoint Translator Business (http://www.gespoint.com/Software/Translation-Project-Management-Software.aspx )
TOM Agency/team Edition (http://www.jovo-soft.de/en/translation-management/ )
Projetex (http://www.projetex.com/ )

*****************************

I'll try to update the list as and when I have time.

If I've missed any, please tell me and I will add them!

*****************************
Related threads:
http://www.proz.com/forum/translation_project_vendor_management/155149-translation_project_management_which_software.html

Michael

[Edited at 2016-08-02 07:18 GMT]


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Volodymyr Pedchenko
Local time: 19:31
English to Ukrainian
+ ...
TO3000 3D and beyond Aug 2, 2016

Hello Michael Joseph,

Greetings from author of original TO3000 version (back in 1999) and now the manager of the team behind TO3000, Projetex, and AnyCount.

It's sad to hear about the inconvenience you are experiencing. I am always happy to have open dialogue and input from users of our products. TO3000 is very complex product already and was born as a result of many users suggestions and inputs. The more complex the product the more time it takes to re-test everything after adding each feature. And we cannot add each and every feature requested by some users because other users complain about user interface becoming too complicated as a result

Also, support has probably not communicated well the point that actually we are developing engine behind both TO3000 and Projetex. They both would be released one after another as soon as engine is ready. And TO3000 will have all the brand new features Projetex has except freelance and vendor management part.

About time - actually we have reached the final stage of development of Projetex 3D, TO3000 3D and AnyCount 3D. If you would like to participate in beta-testing, please, write to support@to3000.com already next week and you will be able to be among the first to check the new features, and even during beta-testing some small changes are possible so feel free to make suggestions.

Alma, we already have AnyCount 3D version which counts Office 365 version ready for release and plan to release it for September. Please, write to support@anycount.com on August 15 if you would like to check out beta version.

We have heard from many users that it is better to raise prices and increase development speed. It is not automatic process, just adding more people to the team will not make the process faster but we have already invested a big amount of time, energy and resources in increasing the team processes in a gradual and efficient way. We will see what we can do.

Other solutions really pop up like mushrooms because it is easy to make basic application but it is hard to support it over time and add features continiously. Our team needed that time to keep TO3000/Projetex engine reliable while adding new features and renovating interface. For instance, credit note feature was done in some recent version but was not up to expectations of the users. Now we have done ultimate of how it could be done but this feature alone delayed the release for 2 months, just because of it ubiquitious nature (as it is kind of payment, it's everywhere ). Thank you for your trust over the years and we do believe we will keep #1 position in the usefullness of the software for freelance translators and translation agencies, also thanks to active input from the community.

Kind regards,
Vladimir.
=========================
Vladimir Pedchenko,
AIT Software Development Team
http://www.translation3000.com


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