"Gender and Family in the Language Services Industry" report from Common Sense Advisory

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Hinara  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 21:56
Member (2011)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Say no to Marxism Sep 29, 2017

I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.

 

Kuochoe Nikoi  Identity Verified
Ghana
Local time: 04:56
Member (2011)
Japanese to English
Seems like ordinary stuff Sep 30, 2017

Hinara wrote:

I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.

That's what I feared when I read the title, but it seems like a normal survey of men and women in the language industry. I'm not interested enough to sign up to read the full results though.


 

Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:56
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Usual order of things inverted Sep 30, 2017

Kuochoe Nikoi wrote:
Hinara wrote:
I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.

That's what I feared when I read the title, but it seems like a normal survey of men and women in the language industry. I'm not interested enough to sign up to read the full results though.

I was interested to see this question:

"Should gender balance be mandatory in the hiring process?"

Everything I have seen and read about the translation and interpreting industry suggests that women are significantly over-represented. And indeed, looking at the sample, there were 1018 female respondees and 431 male respondees. That is about what I would expect.

In industries where the inverse is true and men dominate (software engineering, for example), the argument has been that this must represent anti-female discrimination of some kind, which has led to strident calls for "equality". If gender balance were to be asserted in our industry, I would think that women would stand to lose a good deal.

So how will it go? Will there be special pleading for the translation and interpreting industry when it comes to gender imbalance, along the lines that it is different because blah, blah and blah (insert the impassioned argument of your choice here), or will the issue quietly be ignored, since it is men that are currently "disadvantaged" by this gender imbalance?

Regards,
Dan


 

neilmac  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 06:56
Spanish to English
+ ...
Site rules Sep 30, 2017

Hinara wrote:

I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.


I'm pretty sure this statement breaks the site's "no politics" rule. As I didn't start the discussion, I'd just like to note that neither Marxist philosophy nor Socialism are perceived as the root of all evil worldwide. Just sayin'....

PS: This doesn't mean that I'm not equally fed up to the back teeth with "gender" issues being shoved down our throats at every opportunity. However, I don't immediately reach for my scattergun and the nearest scapegoat.

[Edited at 2017-09-30 08:15 GMT]


 

Maxi Schwarz
Local time: 23:56
German to English
+ ...
language service industry Sep 30, 2017

Being someone who works in the language service industry (as we all do here), I expected the article to be pertinent to my professional work. Every time we do a translation, we must be aware of such things. Do you select the proper "Miss" vs. "Mrs." or do you choose "Ms."? What do you do with a 1940's birth certificate where a child is identified as a bastard? What about same sex marriages and divorces (I did several recently) - what wording is used? I translated an Swiss article recently from German, where I discovered that the female form has become the generic all inclusive form for men and women. "Die Arbeiterin" doesn't mean a female worker, but a male worker is included under that term.

This is the kind of thing I expected to see under this title. As far as gender prejudice is concerned, I'm lucky to have a gender-neutral given name that people guess wrong at least half the time.icon_wink.gif


 

magdadh
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:56
Polish to English
+ ...
I also thought it would be about gender-related language.... Oct 28, 2017

Maxi Schwarz wrote:

I expected the article to be pertinent to my professional work. Every time we do a translation, we must be aware of such things. (...) What do you do with a 1940's birth certificate where a child is identified as a bastard? What about same sex marriages and divorces (I did several recently) - what wording is used? (...) This is the kind of thing I expected to see under this title.


So did I, and these cross-cultural issues are becoming more interesting and more important as the culture gaps and what I would call ''sensitivity gaps'' increase.

neilmac wrote:

neither Marxist philosophy nor Socialism are perceived as the root of all evil worldwide. Just sayin'....


Also, the issues that contemporary social justice warriors focus on (gender, sexuality etc.) have very, very, very little to do with Marx which is all about 'material left' - class and wealth - and personally I bristle every time I see socialism equalised with the pronoun frenzy.


 

The Misha
Local time: 00:56
Russian to English
+ ...
What does gender have to do with translating texts? Oct 31, 2017

The translator's gender, that is. And why, as an apparently underrepresented minority (male) in this "industry" do I not feel discriminated against? Who cares, really?

 

Kuochoe Nikoi  Identity Verified
Ghana
Local time: 04:56
Member (2011)
Japanese to English
You already know the answer Oct 31, 2017

Dan Lucas wrote:
So how will it go? Will there be special pleading for the translation and interpreting industry when it comes to gender imbalance, along the lines that it is different because blah, blah and blah (insert the impassioned argument of your choice here), or will the issue quietly be ignored, since it is men that are currently "disadvantaged" by this gender imbalance?
The latter, it seems. These "gender imbalance" questions often make me wonder how many persons of the "disadvantaged" gender even want to be in that industry in the first place. Has anyone bothered to check?

[Edited at 2017-10-31 12:17 GMT]


 

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 06:56
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Hinara Oct 31, 2017

Hinara wrote:
I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.


Can you explain (briefly) the link between the article and Marxism...?


 

TonyTK
German to English
+ ...
Say yes to well-argued criticism Nov 30, 2017

Hinara wrote:

I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.


Please elaborate.


 

neilmac  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 06:56
Spanish to English
+ ...
Nov 30, 2017



[Edited at 2017-11-30 20:13 GMT]


 

Stephanie Mitchel  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 00:56
French to English
Happy New Year to you all! Jan 2

May 2018 bring you peace and prosperity!

I'd like to interject here that the imbalance does not look to me like a 'disadvantage' to men. Traditionally 'pink-collar' jobs tend to pay less (think child care, home health care, social work, primary and secondary education, etc.) But look what happens for men in women-dominant industries: https://www.fastcompany.com/3044753/the-other-wage-gap-why-men-in-women-dominated-industries-still-earn-more

And why politicize the discussion with -isms? Gender issues are human issues.


 

Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:56
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
It has always been political Jan 2

Stephanie Mitchel wrote:
And why politicize the discussion with -isms? Gender issues are human issues.

The discussion is inherently political and has been for decades. In other industries, as I pointed out, a numerical gender imbalance that favors men has come to be seen as something to be righted - I have already mentioned software development. It is noticeable that in translation we have a prime example of an industry in which women appear to be significantly over-represented. Is this good or bad? If it is good, why is an imbalance in other industries seen as undesirable? If it is bad, should we not take be advocating steps to boost the number of men? It's a human issue, correct?

Personally, I believe in equality of opportunity, not equality of outcome, so provided the former exists I am not in favor of measures to artificially impose the latter. So no, I don't actually believe we should push for measures to encourage men specifically to enter translation.

Regards,
Dan


 

Maxi Schwarz
Local time: 23:56
German to English
+ ...
In translation Jan 3

Most of us work freelance. Hiring policies don't figure into this at all. I ended up being given a gender-neutral name and am happy to keep it that way. Clients hire me based on my professional background and the ultimate quality of my work.

 

neilmac  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 06:56
Spanish to English
+ ...
Never 'appen Jan 4

Samuel Murray wrote:

Hinara wrote:
I hope Proz doesn't jumping on the bandwagon of PC and Marxism by posting irrelevant articles such as this.


Can you explain (briefly) the link between the article and Marxism...?


I sincerely doubt it, as any links posited would likely be tenuous, if not wholly spurious.


 


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"Gender and Family in the Language Services Industry" report from Common Sense Advisory

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