Coherent patterns
Thread poster: Masoud Kakoli

Masoud Kakoli
Iran
Local time: 06:29
English to Persian (Farsi)
+ ...
Jan 14, 2014

Hi!

I was reading translation theories that I came across this sentence. Can you clarify the meaning of the expression "coherent patterns" for me?

Anton Popovic, for instance, claimed that there are"two stylistic norms in the translator's work: the norm of the original and the norm of the translation" (1968/1970: 82). This seems so simple as to be obvious. Yet consider the consequence: as soon as the two "stylistic norms" are announced, multiplicity of shifts is already theorized in terms of coherent patterns.

What does it mean? Does it refer to the source text and translation text since these two texts are coherent in their own?


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Noni Gilbert
Spain
Local time: 03:59
Spanish to English
+ ...
English-English Jan 14, 2014

You could also post this as a Kudoz translation question Masoud - it might reach a greater audience.

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Masoud Kakoli
Iran
Local time: 06:29
English to Persian (Farsi)
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Help Jan 14, 2014

Noni Gilbert wrote:

You could also post this as a Kudoz translation question Masoud - it might reach a greater audience.


Thanks for your help, I'll try that later if I could not find my answer here. Can you answer the question?


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Mark Benson  Identity Verified

English to Swedish
+ ...
Perhaps best to stay here unless you just want a translation Jan 14, 2014

Masoud Kakoli wrote:

Noni Gilbert wrote:

You could also post this as a Kudoz translation question Masoud - it might reach a greater audience.


Thanks for your help, I'll try that later if I could not find my answer here. Can you answer the question?


KudoZ might not be the right place after all! If you're wondering about the meaning, and not the translation.

I understand 'coherent pattern', here, in this way:

The source is based on stylistic norms N1 and the target is based on stylistic narms N2. The shift from N1 to N2 takes place through 'coherent patterns' because of how components in both sets of norms can be isolated and described, and matched in what got called a 'coherent pattern', which would allow for future repetition (and hence 'theory status'.)

E.g. N1 contains N1a - N1z. N2 contains N2a - N2z. When these norms have been announced, it's also possible to discern a 'coherent pattern' in the 'shift' from one to the other, working your way from source to target.

I might come up with a concrete example, if I'm at all right about this.

The idea should be that if you identify these patterns for your language pair and subject, you can create a theory of translation to base your translation work on - and hopefully improve your translations.

This is an idea that was published in 1970 and if I can say anything substantial in this thread, it's that Translation Science (or whatever you call it) has been developing very fast over just a couple of decades more than half a century.

My opinion is that it's great to read and understand as much as possible of the science and theory we have about translation today, but that there's little point in attaching too much relevance to it (as something you have to know, otherwise you can't translate, as it were.)

[Edited at 2014-01-14 17:09 GMT]


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Masoud Kakoli
Iran
Local time: 06:29
English to Persian (Farsi)
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Coherent patterns Jan 14, 2014

Mark Benson wrote:

Masoud Kakoli wrote:

Noni Gilbert wrote:

You could also post this as a Kudoz translation question Masoud - it might reach a greater audience.


Thanks for your help, I'll try that later if I could not find my answer here. Can you answer the question?


KudoZ might not be the right place after all! If you're wondering about the meaning, and not the translation.

I understand 'coherent pattern', here, in this way:

The source is based on stylistic norms N1 and the target is based on stylistic narms N2. The shift from N1 to N2 takes place through 'coherent patterns' because of how components in both sets of norms can be isolated and described, and matched in what got called a 'coherent pattern', which would allow for future repetition (and hence 'theory status'.)

E.g. N1 contains N1a - N1z. N2 contains N2a - N2z. When these norms have been announced, it's also possible to discern a 'coherent pattern' in the 'shift' from one to the other, working your way from source to target.

I might come up with a concrete example, if I'm at all right about this.

The idea should be that if you identify these patterns for your language pair and subject, you can create a theory of translation to base your translation work on - and hopefully improve your translations.

This is an idea that was published in 1970 and if I can say anything substantial in this thread, it's that Translation Science (or whatever you call it) has been developing very fast over just a couple of decades more than half a century.

My opinion is that it's great to read and understand as much as possible of the science and theory we have about translation today, but that there's little point in attaching too much relevance to it (as something you have to know, otherwise you can't translate, as it were.)

[Edited at 2014-01-14 17:09 GMT]


Thanks Mark!
I agree with you ,but before reading your thread I had another I idea and after reading your thread and reading the text once again, my idea changed and I'm convinced!

So, you mean that shifts take place systematic which is based on a coherent pattern and also on the other hand, you can analyze the shifts in order to find this coherent pattern. Am I right?


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