Translation of non-standard political language
Thread poster: Lisa Melvin

Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
Aug 2, 2006

I am trying to write an essay/project on the translation of non-standard (idiomatic, colloquial, slang) language in political journalism. The data I am using is from Libération, Le Canard Enchaîné, MundoCruel.com and lanacion.com.
What translation methods would professional translators recommend?
Spanish and French in to English.


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:29
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
Why translate? Aug 2, 2006

Who needs to read this stuff in translation? Usually journalists refer to these subjects in the form of articles written by themselves. Journalists understand the source and refer the subject to their readers in their mother tongue, but no translation is envolved.
But perhaps I do not quite understand your question.

Regards

Heinrich


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xxxmediamatrix
Local time: 12:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
See here, for example... Aug 2, 2006

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

Who needs to read this stuff in translation?


www.ena.lu contains numerous translations of articles from the press - both 'standard' and 'non standard'.

Having said that, I guess this thread might be more active if Lisa gave us a few examples (links or quotes) of what she considers to be 'non standard'.

MediaMatrix


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Magda Dziadosz  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 17:29
Member (2004)
English to Polish
+ ...
Not sure I understand your project... Aug 2, 2006

Do you want to analyse translations of articles from the websites you quote? They don't seem to have any English versions.

Or you want to analyse the language used by these newspapers? In this case it has really little to do with translation, it's more about journalistic techniques.


Magda (puzzled)


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 18:29
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
I see mostly original texts Aug 3, 2006

mediamatrix wrote:

www.ena.lu contains numerous translations of articles from the press - both 'standard' and 'non standard'.


MediaMatrix


Generally, if translating for example historical articles, one would probably use adaptative technics. But I have seen also literal translations, in works of literature.
I'm currently reading "Kolme katku vahel" by Jaan Kross, translated into Finnish. This novel refers countless pieces of original texts from the 16th century, along with Krosses own inventions and creations of historical texts. The translator has to decide, what is possible to translate, what should be left untranslated and what needs explanations in the index at the end of the book.
Translations of political newspaper articles make usually dull reading when translated without adaptation. I guess French articles are much too elaborative and fancifull for non-french readers.
Interesting problem though!
Once I was sent a lot of clippings from Finnish newspapers concerning a Finnish enterprise. I had no idea what the end-customer was looking for, so I delivered a straight translation into GErman. I still wonder if my work was of any use to the client.

Regards

Heinrich

[Bearbeitet am 2006-08-03 00:37]


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Ritu Bhanot  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 17:29
Member (2006)
French to Hindi
+ ...
Journalism and Translation Aug 3, 2006

Who needs to read this stuff in translation? Usually journalists refer to these subjects in the form of articles written by themselves. Journalists understand the source and refer the subject to their readers in their mother tongue, but no translation is envolved.


well, I do such translations a couple of times every month (going up to 25 times a month i.e. 50 articles a month)... I know it sounds strange but I work as a freelancer for the French Unit of All India Radio and all work is done in English which is the language of all original works and then translated into different languages to be broadcast in those languages... and at times it's quite difficult as there is no standard vocabulary in terms of political systems and the funniest translations are regarding Cricket A colonial heritage for Indians and little understood in France... real challenge because never heard those terms in French and have to adapt to time limitation...

So this sort of projects are really helpful and we have been trying to develop some similar glossaries in order to standardise the language that's being used... old hands teach the newbees all that is required...

and of course, journalists participating in different competitions need to get their texts translated to the language of the country... so now you know who needs to read this stuff in translation ? and of course I've translated quite a few such journalistic texts for the organizations where I used to work...


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Sandra Petch
Local time: 17:29
French to English
+ ...
Hello Lisa Aug 3, 2006

Glad you found the forum I directed you to.

Sandra


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Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Non-standard political language: Spanish and French to English Aug 3, 2006

mediamatrix wrote:

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

Who needs to read this stuff in translation?


www.ena.lu contains numerous translations of articles from the press - both 'standard' and 'non standard'.

Having said that, I guess this thread might be more active if Lisa gave us a few examples (links or quotes) of what she considers to be 'non standard'.

MediaMatrix


Thank you for the link to the translations.

Basically I had to find data that would form the practical side of the dissertation/essay. I selected a couple of articles from Liberation, Le Canard, mundocruel.com and a few political cartoons from lanacion.com Argentinian newspaper.

The theoretical side of the essay is to establish to what extent and using what methods this type of text can be translated, since a lot of the references are culture-bound.

I hope that explains what I am attempting to do.

Regards

Lisa


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Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Analyse articles and select translation method Aug 3, 2006

Magda Dziadosz wrote:

Do you want to analyse translations of articles from the websites you quote? They don't seem to have any English versions.

Or you want to analyse the language used by these newspapers? In this case it has really little to do with translation, it's more about journalistic techniques.


Magda (puzzled)


Dear Magda

I have to research the articles myself and ascertain the best translation methods to render them as effectively as possible in English without too much translation loss.

Since part of my course is theoretical, I have to read up on what the experts say about different methods of translation.

I will translate parts of the articles in order to incorporate them into the essay.

Regards

Lisa


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Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks for approach to translation Aug 3, 2006

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

Thanks for your tips on what to translate and what not to translate.



mediamatrix wrote:

www.ena.lu contains numerous translations of articles from the press - both 'standard' and 'non standard'.


MediaMatrix


Generally, if translating for example historical articles, one would probably use adaptative technics. But I have seen also literal translations, in works of literature.
I'm currently reading "Kolme katku vahel" by Jaan Kross, translated into Finnish. This novel refers countless pieces of original texts from the 16th century, along with Krosses own inventions and creations of historical texts. The translator has to decide, what is possible to translate, what should be left untranslated and what needs explanations in the index at the end of the book.
Translations of political newspaper articles make usually dull reading when translated without adaptation. I guess French articles are much too elaborative and fancifull for non-french readers.
Interesting problem though!
Once I was sent a lot of clippings from Finnish newspapers concerning a Finnish enterprise. I had no idea what the end-customer was looking for, so I delivered a straight translation into GErman. I still wonder if my work was of any use to the client.

Regards

Heinrich

[Bearbeitet am 2006-08-03 00:37]


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Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Translation of political articles Aug 3, 2006

Ritu Bhanot wrote:

Who needs to read this stuff in translation? Usually journalists refer to these subjects in the form of articles written by themselves. Journalists understand the source and refer the subject to their readers in their mother tongue, but no translation is envolved.


well, I do such translations a couple of times every month (going up to 25 times a month i.e. 50 articles a month)... I know it sounds strange but I work as a freelancer for the French Unit of All India Radio and all work is done in English which is the language of all original works and then translated into different languages to be broadcast in those languages... and at times it's quite difficult as there is no standard vocabulary in terms of political systems and the funniest translations are regarding Cricket A colonial heritage for Indians and little understood in France... real challenge because never heard those terms in French and have to adapt to time limitation...

So this sort of projects are really helpful and we have been trying to develop some similar glossaries in order to standardise the language that's being used... old hands teach the newbees all that is required...

and of course, journalists participating in different competitions need to get their texts translated to the language of the country... so now you know who needs to read this stuff in translation ? and of course I've translated quite a few such journalistic texts for the organizations where I used to work...

Dear Ritu

Thanks for your encouraging reply. Your job sounds interesting.

So you really think there could be a practical purpose for establishing the best way to translate political articles with non-standard language in them?

Examples would be:
How would you translate La Rose au Poing (the socialist party emblem) for Indian culture?
Then in a satirical journal, the same term is used with the word rosse instead of rose - meaning a shrill woman. This was in reference to Segolene Royal, the French politician and possible presidential candidate. So one has to work out how to translate that so that English readers would understand the context and the humour.

Lisa





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Abdallah Hussein
Local time: 01:29
English to Arabic
+ ...
Political journlism usually requires free (argumentative) translation technique Aug 3, 2006

Lisa C Melvin wrote:

I am trying to write an essay/project on the translation of non-standard (idiomatic, colloquial, slang) language in political journalism. The data I am using is from Libération, Le Canard Enchaîné, MundoCruel.com and lanacion.com.
What translation methods would professional translators recommend?
Spanish and French in to English.




I recommend a free argumentative method of translation be used in a context of political journalism where opinions are usually expressed form personal (even probably ideological) perspective, espcially that non-standard language is used.


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Lisa Melvin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:29
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Free, argumentative translation Aug 3, 2006

Abdallah Hussein wrote:

Lisa C Melvin wrote:

I am trying to write an essay/project on the translation of non-standard (idiomatic, colloquial, slang) language in political journalism. The data I am using is from Libération, Le Canard Enchaîné, MundoCruel.com and lanacion.com.
What translation methods would professional translators recommend?
Spanish and French in to English.




I recommend a free argumentative method of translation be used in a context of political journalism where opinions are usually expressed form personal (even probably ideological) perspective, espcially that non-standard language is used.


Thank you. I will see what Newmark says about those methods; since I am not totally familiar with them.

Lisa


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