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"Sözlük-oluşturma" soruları: KudoZ sorularının yeni bir şekli
Thread poster: Enrique

Enrique
Local time: 11:53
SITE STAFF
Sep 12, 2008

KudoZ sorularının yeni bir şekli şu anda beta aşamasında olarak mevcut: Sözlük-oluşturma soruları.

Bu yeni soru türünün ilk amacı, belirli bir dildeki belirli bir terimin en iyi çevirisinin ProZ.com topluluğu tarafından beraberce bulunmasını sağlamak ve bu terim ile çevirisini Creative Commons "Etiket" lisansı ("CC-by") altında açıkça erişilebilir güvenilir bir sözlük içine dahil etmektir.

Yeni formatın ikinci bir amacı ise şu anda az sayıda soru sorulan dil çiftleri ve alanlarda KudoZ katılımı (ve beraberindeki diğer yararlar - ağ oluşturma, öğrenme ve profesyonel farklılaşma) için fırsat sağlamaktır.

Sözlük-oluşturma soruları çok sayıda eşsiz yapısal özelliklere sahiptir, bunlar:
  • tanımlar ve örnek cümlelerin dahil edilmesi
  • kimlerin cevap verebileceği konusunda muhtemel kısıtlamalar getirilmesi
  • cevap vermek için sabit bir sürenin olması
  • en iyi cevabın meslektaşlar tarafından seçilmesi


Sözlük-oluşturma soruları, formatı değişmeyecek olan geleneksel "yardım" türü sorularla paralel olarak sürdürülecektir.

=== Kısaca, yeni formatın avantajları ===

Sözlük oluşturma konusunda, yeni "Sözlük-oluşturma" türü sorular "yardım-esaslı" sorulara göre aşağıdaki avantajlara sahip olacaktır:

  • Zaman baskısı azaltılmıştır.
  • Terimlerin çevirileri, belirli kombinasyonda uzmanlaşmış yerli çevirmenler tarafından sunulacak ve değerlendirilecektir.
  • Bağlam, hem kaynak hem de hedef dilde, daha eksiksiz olacak, böylece daha yararlı bir referans oluşturacaktır.


http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english_to_turkish/business_commerce_general/2813125-cash_flow.html

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english_to_turkish/tourism_travel/2813140-occupancy_rate.html

http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english_to_turkish/computers_general/2813146-buffer.html

Saygılarımla,
Enrique Cavalitto


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Ali Bayraktar  Identity Verified
Turkey
Member (2007)
English to Turkish
+ ...
in English? Sep 12, 2008

Can you also put a link to your original post? I mean in English.

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Enrique
Local time: 11:53
SITE STAFF
TOPIC STARTER
No English post yet Sep 12, 2008

M. Ali Bayraktar wrote:

Can you also put a link to your original post? I mean in English.



Hi Ali,

There is no general announcement in English yet, the glossary-building KudoZ are being released a language pair at a time.

Regards,
Enrique


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Ali Bayraktar  Identity Verified
Turkey
Member (2007)
English to Turkish
+ ...
Email Notifications Sep 17, 2008

Is there any dashboard for glossary-building questions?

I can't receive email notifications.


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Cagdas Karatas  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 17:53
English to Turkish
Dashboard Sep 17, 2008

KudoZ>Dashboard>General Preferences>Asker Type

If you toggle all users, you will receive notifications of all questions including GB questions. Another option is to toggle GB questions, which is the last in sequence.


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Enrique
Local time: 11:53
SITE STAFF
TOPIC STARTER
New approach to fields of expertise Sep 22, 2008

Hi all,

In the last questions we are moving in the direction of filtering notifications and access to the questions to users who have declared the corresponding field among the "expert" fields in their profiles.

A new feature about to be released will be that of the "related fields". This means that a question will have a specific field of expertise but may have related fields that will be also included in the filter (notifications and access to the question).

For instance a question with primary field "telecommunications" may also be related to "computers: software" and to "Computers: systems, networks"

This will be only relate to notifications and access (and in the future to searches in the glossary), but the points will be assigned to the primary field.

Another novelty will be that when a profile owner adds a new "specialty" or "working" field of expertise, then (s)he will be blocked for 3 days to participate in glossary-building questions that are filtered by that particular field of expertise. This aims to preventing users from modifying their profiles in order to "follow" the specialties requested in the questions.

Regards,
Enrique


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Cagdas Karatas  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 17:53
English to Turkish
Objection Sep 23, 2008

Firstly, I apologize for writing in English.

Enrique wrote:

Another novelty will be that when a profile owner adds a new "specialty" or "working" field of expertise, then (s)he will be blocked for 3 days to participate in glossary-building questions that are filtered by field of expertise. This aims to preventing users from modifying their profiles in order to "follow" the specialties requested in the questions.



I am well aware that specialization in translation is a concept that ProZ staff has faith in. One can easily notice around the site that some classifications, categorizations, distinctions are made according to specialty fields.

However, I am one of those who have doubts about the possibility of specialization as a proven (or dogmatic) concept that could serve as a determinant of translators' rights to undertake certain tasks (be offered jobs, answer translation questions, or other things I cannot think of at the moment).

With this post, we see that ProZ staff is about to introduce a novelty (?) regarding Glossary Building questions. Firstly, I would like to present my interpretation of the novelty: "Hey, you changed your specialty fields. I got you tricky boy!"

Could you please explain what use is it to restrict translators from answering questions? I say answering questions. I believe it to be a normal (absolutely normal) human behavior. As far as well-educated and contemporary individuals (that is how I feel) are concerned, answering questions is an act that is based on consciousness and self-confidence.

Let us think for a while about the main reason for introducing such novelty: specialized translators will do best (provide the best answers) in their specialty fields. I am very sorry but this is not true. I remember answering plenty of KudoZ questions in fields that are thousands of mile away from my educational discipline, Language and Literature. I will not keep it long. Specialization is a broad, broad, broad topic.

Here is a summary of Çağdaş Karataş's KudoZ History, which, in my opinion, presents a solid reason for you to reconsider imposing field limitations.

Tech/Engineering 155 (How come?)
Bus/Financial 112 (How come?)
Other 111
Law/Patents 104 (How come?)
Medical 72 (How come?)
Art/Literary 71 (Hey, here it is!)
Social Sciences 40 (How come?)
Marketing 24 (How come?)
Science 23 (How come?)

I hope what I mean is clear.

Thank you in advance for your understanding.

With respect


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Enrique
Local time: 11:53
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Being a specialist is not irrelevant Sep 23, 2008

I also apologize for porting in English.

Of course a specialist in language and literature can earn points and provide reasonable answers to questions about Engineering and Medicine, but it is the belief of ProZ.com staff that in order to build a quality glossary it makes sense to rely for these questions on translators who specialize in Engineering and Medicine respectively.

Regards,
Enrique


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Ali Bayraktar  Identity Verified
Turkey
Member (2007)
English to Turkish
+ ...
What about peer_comments - Peki ya "peer_comment'ler Sep 23, 2008

If the question is not in your specialty field, you are not allowed to provide an answer: that's right, I am absolutely agree with this.

But those who are not allowed to answer the questions still have a right to provide peer_comments. Doesn't it look like a kind of contradiction? You have put this restriction in order to get "best knowledge from specialists" but how one can provide his/her comment if s/he is not specialized on the subject?


Kısaca Türkçesi: Shortly in Turkish:

Böyle bir uzmanlık alanı kısıtlaması normal, ancak bu sorulara verilecek peer_comment'lerde kısıtlama yok. Bir kişi uzmanlık alanı olmadığı bir alanda diğerlerine nasıl fikir bildirebilir ki?


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Özden Arıkan  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 16:53
Member
English to Turkish
OT: Forum dili / About forum language Sep 23, 2008

Herkese merhaba,

Konu dışına çıktığım için kusura bakmayın, ama bu açıklama gerekli oldu. Yukarıda değinilen 7.7 no.'lu forum kuralının metni şöyle:
Her forumun kendi dili kullanılmalıdır. Her forum için belli bir yazışma dili belirlenmiştir ve mesaj gönderirken olabildiğince bu dilin kullanılması gerekir. Başka bir dilin belirtilmediği forumlarda yazışma dili İngilizcedir.


Enrique'nin Türkçe okuyup yazamaması, ayrıca gelen ve gidecek olan her mesajı çevirtmenin zorluğu, bu "olabildiğince"yi aşıyor. Mesajını iki dilde birden yazma nezaketi gösteren olursa tabii ki takdir edilir, ancak bu da zamanla zorlaşacak bir şey ve kimsenin özür dilemesine gerek yok.

Her ne kadar bu projede şu anda sadece EN ve TR olsa da, diğer dillerle çalışan arkadaşlar konuyu takip etmede zorlanırsa lütfen burada belirtsinler. Veya, herhangi bir nedenle Türkçe yazmayı tercih eden olursa lütfen rahat rahat yazsın. El birliğiyle çevirir, bir şekilde yardımcı oluruz.

Teşekkürler.


__________________________________________________________

Hello everyone,

Sorry for straying, but I think this is necessary to explain. Here is the text of Forum Rule 7.7 referred to:

A forum's designated language should be used. A working language is defined for each forum, and this language should be used to the extent possible when posting. Where not otherwise specified, English is the working language.


It is neither possible for Enrique to read & write Turkish, nor to have every Turkish message translated. Therefore, using this forum's designated language in this case is beyond the "extent possible." Of course, those kind enough to post in two languages would be appreciated, but this is also something to get difficult in time, and no need for apologies here.

EN and TR are the only pair involved in this project right now, but still, if those working with other languages have difficulty at following the topic or if anyone prefers to post in Turkish for any reason, please feel free to do so and we'll try to help as best we can.

Thanks!


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Özden Arıkan  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 16:53
Member
English to Turkish
I agree with this suggestion Sep 23, 2008

M. Ali Bayraktar wrote:
But those who are not allowed to answer the questions still have a right to provide peer_comments. Doesn't it look like a kind of contradiction? You have put this restriction in order to get "best knowledge from specialists" but how one can provide his/her comment if s/he is not specialized on the subject?


It is even more important in Glossary-Building questions as the glossary will be built entirely based on peer comments. In fact I'm going to repeat my very unpopular suggestion about peer comments in general: for these questions, make it mandatory to enter an explanation/justification for "agree"s, too.


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Cagdas Karatas  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 17:53
English to Turkish
Not satisfied Sep 23, 2008

Enrique wrote:

Of course a specialist in language and literature can earn points and provide reasonable answers to questions about Engineering and Medicine, but it is the belief of ProZ.com staff that in order to build a quality glossary it makes sense to rely for these questions on translators who specialize in Engineering and Medicine respectively.



Sorry, Enrique. I feel your reply is just a way of settling once and for all; however, this issue requires further consideration in my humble opinion. I read the points suggested by my colleagues below and it made me become more doubtful about healthiness of the current Glossary Building System.

Here is my final suggestion. I think this is the only fair solution: (Forgive me if this is not the right place for questioning site policies or making suggestions but just tell me if it is not and I will seek other ways. I request that you share our opinions with the rest of the site staff.)

Everyone should be allowed to answer any question he/she likes to answer. Believe me that would cause nothing other than creating more alternatives (a more crowded page view). I really cannot understand why you or some other people are disturbed by people voluntarily answering questions. That is pointless. I want to contribute to the site, share my knowledge or the findings of my research, earn the points that I deserve. Why am I being restricted? On the other hand, I believe the limitation should be imposed concerning people who provide agrees, neutrals and disagrees because they are the only tools of grading GB questions.

Regards...


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Enrique
Local time: 11:53
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TOPIC STARTER
You are right, of course Sep 23, 2008

M. Ali Bayraktar wrote:

If the question is not in your specialty field, you are not allowed to provide an answer: that's right, I am absolutely agree with this.

But those who are not allowed to answer the questions still have a right to provide peer_comments. Doesn't it look like a kind of contradiction? You have put this restriction in order to get "best knowledge from specialists" but how one can provide his/her comment if s/he is not specialized on the subject?



Thanks a lot for pointing to this bug, already solved. Of course you are right, the restrictions apply to both answering and peer grading.

Regards,
Enrique


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Enrique
Local time: 11:53
SITE STAFF
TOPIC STARTER
Focus on quality Sep 23, 2008

Çağdaş Karataş wrote:

Everyone should be allowed to answer any question he/she likes to answer. Believe me that would cause nothing other than creating more alternatives (a more crowded page view). I really cannot understand why you or some other people are disturbed by people voluntarily answering questions. That is pointless. I want to contribute to the site, share my knowledge or the findings of my research, earn the points that I deserve. Why am I being restricted?


In the traditional "help" KudoZ the objective is providing help to the asker, and in that case speed and alternatives are desirable.

Glossary-Building KudoZ aim to quality, and in this case it was decided to limit participation based on considerations of language pair, native language and field(s) of expertise.

Regards,
Enrique


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"Sözlük-oluşturma" soruları: KudoZ sorularının yeni bir şekli

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