Translation of the Ukrainian 'sourzhyk' into foreign languages
Thread poster: Ivan Petryshyn

Ivan Petryshyn
English to Italian
+ ...
Nov 25, 2008

The widely used in Eastern Ukrainian Regions variation OF THE LANGUAGE ADOPTED THE NAME OF 'SOURZHYK', very similar to the word 'surrogate', a mixture of Ukrainian and Russian, recently researched by the Italian scholar, my friend, Dr. Salvatore Del Gaudio is a specific and difficult case.

The most essential features of the jargon/ or Pigin Ukrainian, or Ukrorussian are:

1. on the phonological level-

- approximation, adaptation and accomodation;

2. on the grammatical level-

- grammatical concordance and specific government

3. on the lexical level-

- the nearly equal usage of both, the Ukrainian and the Russian wordstocks

- usage of the realia not easily rendered into Ukrainian

- erroneous/ false translation 'friends' lexemes that make it sound funny or even out-of-place for a Ukrainian hearing

4. on the stylistic level-

- insertion of set-phrases, metaphors, aphorisms, quotations

- usage of marked lexical units making the speech more expressive and more colorful (acc. to the users perception)

- exotic and expressive patterns usage

- colloquial, pragmatic usage of the language resources (considered often as a pattern of low educated speech).

Rendering the 'sourzhyk' into English and Italian is not easy at all:

a/ only those who know both Ukrainian and Russian, the two cultures, literatures and social realia could really evaluate and appreciate/discern the specifics of the 'Ukrorussian';

b/ the translation of the speech is very much possible if one implements the resources of other languages, e.g., as it happens in Spanglish or Franglais; the specifics of English would prompt a certain possibility of employing German or Dutch insertions, to render the 'sourzhyk's' 'coloryt';

c/ when translating into Italian, there could be used the language resources of Spanish/and French to make the language fact more vivid and expressive.

Below, are provided the possible variants of the Ukro-Russian transcribed words and phrases in the Ukrainian alphabetical order, taken from a Book of a well-known Ukrainian writer.

A

1. a razvye zapadentsi nye khotyat? = Engl. and how about *westerniks, they don't need it? = It. riguardante gli *ovestini, non nelo vogliono?

2. ana takaya zhe maya, kak i tvaya, prosta! = she is as much meine as yours, got it? = lei e' cosi' la mia como la tuia, loco!

3. abaldyeyesh tut= one can loose one's Kopf= uno si puo' diventar un minchione; si puo' perder la cabeza!;

B

1. buly nazvani imyenami tryokh katov= were by the names of the three Ka'tzen genommen= eran state nominate dai nomi di tre's gattos

V

1. vam komnatu chi otdyel'nu?= do you need a dwelling or ein Separatwohnung?= lei vuole una camera o una isolada?

2. vy zh v kursye...= you know it, nicht wahr?= lo sapete, verdad?

3. vyeshat= to loegen, = mentire

4. variant chiki-chiki = a magic bullet, just the ticket;= una variante bien fatta

5. vsyo durne= alles McFly; =todo e' sciocco

E

1. eto mene ne volnuye= I don't care about dat,= non mi inetessa nemmeno

2. eta samaye= that's het, how do you call dat?= un coso, come si fa?

Z

1. zakhodi= hereein! = advanti!

YE

1. ye plyashka 'soukharika'= I have a flask of smash,= ho un vetro del frantumo

K

1.kushaty ne khachu= non voglio manger;=I don't want to eten

2. korispondyent= Korrespondent;= correspondant

M

1. moloty yerundu= nonsense zu sagen;= dire sciocchezze/stupidagine//dir dei pezzi pazzi

2. marynarsha= a party woman;= la damma di compagnia

3. maladoy chyelovyek= hey, my man!= giovanotto, gonzello! bello!

4. meni nada zavdatok= Ich brauche a deposit;= dovete faire un deposit affitto

5. meni nada Klavu= Klava is the one ich bin looking foer;= la Klava, la cerco/je suis qua per Clava

6. madam= Meine Frau; Mevrauw, Mesdame, ma belle

N

1. na vulytsi etava vasheva= on the how-do-you-call-him street,= sulla strada di Come-lo-chiamate

2. naydyotye myenya zdyes'= you'll find me hierr;= mi troverete aqui/ici

3. nu, paka!= OK, au revoir!= bene, por hora!

4. nikakoho oholoshennya ya nye daval!= I submit keine ad nicht!= non ho pubblicato ninguna pubblicidad!

5. nu, eto vsyo ravno!= dat is all die solche!= e' lo mismo!

6. nichyevo!= gut enough!= bastante bene!

nu, da!= well, ja!= mais, si'!

P

1.pro tse dazhe vyechorka pisala= even the Nachtrichtungen wrote about dat= anche nel Periodico della Noche cene scriveva

2. pampushechka=*plumpy,=*paffuttita

3. poynyav?= capisc'?= hai entendido?

R

1. razvye vy nye slyshali?= didn't U hear 'bout dat?= no ne l'avete sentita?

2. razryeshitye pryedstavittsa= permitez-moi to be introduced= alstsublieft, che io mi entroduire

S

1. slukhay, ty, parakhod i chyelovyek!= hey, you, de steamer and de Mann*;= senta tu, "piroscafo e l'uomo!"*

2. staraya portupyeya!= my old Weib!= mia veija donna!

T

1. teper, vsyo klyovo= jetzt, all's cool;= mo', tutto es bello

2. tvoya holova teper skhozha na ryepku= you head resembles now un navet(turnip);= mo', la tua teste asomiglia un navet

3. ty teper, yak krokodil'chik= you now look like ein Krokodil;= adesso, assomigli a un cocodrillo

U

1. u mene tut yes't' odyn adresok= I have a nice Adresse in here;= ho un bel indirizzo aqui

KH

1. khroushchovka= a Khrushchov-era flat; = un appartamento all Kruscev

2. khotya, postoy!= aber, hold on!= pero', espera!

3. khmyr'= yack; schmo; tizio, vikingo (dipende dal contesto/situazione)

CH

1. chyevo stoish, sadis'= warum do ye stand, take a Platz= ?porque' stai a piedi?-sentati!

SHCH

1. shche kofe?= un po' ma's del caffe'?= some more Kafe'?

2.. shtob vy znali...= so dat you kennenkoenen;= che vosotros sappiate
Ivan Petryshyn Chicago, IL Ukraine- USA 09/20/08 6:49 pm


[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2008-11-25 22:01 GMT]


 

Vladimir Dubisskiy  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 05:42
Member (2001)
English to Russian
+ ...
i did not get it, sorry Nov 25, 2008

Very long posting with German and Italian rendering... why?

Surzhik is hardly a new language development; pretty well studied and described. There are relevant publications.


 

Feinstein
Germany
Local time: 12:42
German to Russian
+ ...
Може Nov 26, 2008

... я не туди зайшов? Чи це вже дурний тон - на українському форумі спілкуватися українською мовою?

 

Ivan Petryshyn
English to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
on the comments on the 'sourzhyk article' Nov 26, 2008

As to the remarks of Mr. Dubisskiy, I would like to say that I didn't even try to undermine the fact that there are publications on the matter, but, on the other hand, I wanted just to demonstrate the possibility of translating it into other languages. If you did not get it, please, kindly inform me what it was that created the difficulty for your understanding.
Dr. feinstein might have been right that it could be desirable to write in Ukrainian, but, I (so sorry) had no access to the Ukrainian alphabet, so I did my best. Actualyy, a translator/interpreter should not be so sensitive as to the language: all the languages are equal ( as I put it, the Bible had been translated into all the languages of the world), so, why to get offended? My native language is Ukrainian and I have all the rights to say that I know it not worse than the respected translators.
Sincerely, Ivan Petryshyn
Z povahoyu, Ivan Petryshyn
S uvazhyeniyem, Ivan Petryshyn
Con ossequi, Ivan Petryshyn
Z najlepszymi z'yczeniami, Ivan Petryshyn
Groessen Ihnen, Ivan Petryshyn


 

Vassyl Trylis  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:42
English to Russian
+ ...
Це діло тонке... Dec 4, 2008

Якщо розглядати суржик як лінгвістичну категорію, то справді треба занурюватися в наукові розробки (яких доста), і проблема не в тому, як його назвати. Суміш вона суміш і є - до речі, первісно у селян це слово означає суміш жита з пшеницею, і дуже це гарно кладеться й на мову: всі мовні функції зберігаються, а все ж таки це не мова, а покруч, ціна її, як і зернового суржику, нижча.

На практичному рівні все значно цікавіше. Попри страшні прокльони, заборони й заперечення, ігнорування й висміювання, суржик уже пару століть чіпко тримає пальму першості серед українських діалектів-сленгів-жаргонів-кокні-... за кількістю живих носіїв. Я стверджую, що сьогодні (і вже давно) це єдина жива мова в центральній та східній Україні. Друге діло, що вона не впорядкована, але той, хто її знає і здатен оцінити, вИзнає, що, наприклад, "русинській" до суржика, як свині до неба.

Раджу знайти в Інтернеті статтю О. Донія "Хай живе суржик!" - че не найрозумніше, що я чув або читав про суржик у своєму житті.

А щодо всі мови рівні... Я не буду коментувати цієї вкрай сумнівної тези, але аргумент п. Петришина настільки веселий, що важко залишитись байдужим. Квитанції до сплати податків та рахунків теж видаються всіма мовами світу й роздаються всім громадянам ще ретельніше, ніж Біблія, але чи свідчить це про рівність???


 

Vladimir Dubisskiy  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 05:42
Member (2001)
English to Russian
+ ...
different Jan 18, 2009

I did not get the reasons for posting it here... I mean you did not say anything new, the issue is well researched and documented, plus it does not look you want to discuss anything.
There are countless possibilities of translating surzhik, as well as Jarnisms, slang words etc. into various languages, so what?
That's what I did not get.


quote]Ivan Petryshyn wrote:

As to the remarks of Mr. Dubisskiy, I would like to say that I didn't even try to undermine the fact that there are publications on the matter, but, on the other hand, I wanted just to demonstrate the possibility of translating it into other languages. If you did not get it, please, kindly inform me what it was that created the difficulty for your understanding.


Z povahoyu, Ivan Petryshyn
S uvazhyeniyem, Ivan Petryshyn
Con ossequi, Ivan Petryshyn
Z najlepszymi z'yczeniami, Ivan Petryshyn
Groessen Ihnen, Ivan Petryshyn
[/quote]


 

mk_lab  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 13:42
Member (2004)
English to Russian
+ ...
Суржика вистачає у будь-якій мові Jan 20, 2009

The widely used in Eastern Ukrainian Regions variation OF THE LANGUAGE ADOPTED THE NAME OF 'SOURZHYK'

Суржика вистачає у будь-якій мові. Перш за все цим страждає доввгостраждальна американська. Спеціальна назва для американського суржику - це sheet speaking

[Edited at 2009-01-20 14:43 GMT]


 


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