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Compatible Win 7 or 8 PCs wil get forced update to Win 10
Thread poster: Fi2 n Co

Fi2 n Co  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 23:48
Member (2013)
English to French
+ ...
May 28, 2016

Hello to all, just a quick heads up.

As all translators use CAT tools, we all have computers.
If you use Windows 7 or 8 and windows updates are turned on and if your machine is compatible with Windows 10 you will get an update package on your computer that will shcedule and force the upgrade of your computer OS to Windows 10.

Windows 10 is rather good OS that can be very snappy on good machines. The main downside is if you are worried about privacy and telemetry.

So if you look forward to getting Windows 10, just get prepared so you can get better control over when and how this will happen (it takes a while and will require a high battery charge level).

If it already happened to you, you can roll back provided you did not delete the "windows old" file.

If you do not want it to happen, you can check utilities as https://www.grc.com/never10.htm or turn off windows update (not recommanded). Another way would be to go back to a system image you created prior (you can see my article here http://www.proz.com/doc/4217 ) and then install the Never 10 utility and then get your updates without the fear of getting the forced update.

This post was just a heads up. Ugrading to 10 or not is a personal choice that has upsides and downsides. If you need more infomation, there are many vidoes on Youtube about the matter and many articles will appear online as this will surely become a very hot and controversial topic.

So be prepared so that you can enjoy your translating with better peace of mind.

My bests to all,

Fi2 n Co


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Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:48
Member (2014)
French to Danish
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Never10 May 28, 2016

I just ran Never10 on Windows 7 a few days ago. It's extremely simple, and it doesn't install any software on the computer.

The explanation is that Microsoft have provided Registry entries to block Windows 10 installation but no user interface to set them. Never10 provides that interface.

It became known not long ago that Microsoft have made a sneaky change to the effect that if the user clicks on the 'close window' icon upper right in the window suggesting a Windows 10 upgrade, Windows 10 upgrade will now go ahead without the user's approval. This is malware behaviour – an 'offer the user can't refuse'.

Microsoft must be getting desperate. 50 % of the world's PCs are still running Windows 7. That can only mean many of them positively do not want Windows 10.

As for their smartphone business, it's dead in the water and has less than 1 % of the market. They've just announced massive layoffs in it, and most of the billions they paid for Nokia have been written off. It's a gigantic fiasco, and they've managed to annoy many of their PC users in the process.

Windows 7 will not support the newer, more powerful processors, so the question is, when one needs to buy a new computer, if one should move to OS X or Linux instead of Windows, since Microsoft apparently hate their PC/business users so much they'll keep dragging them through the mud for their collapsed smartphone business.

I'm aware some users like Windows 10. Good for them. But that doesn't help those of us who simply need Windows 7, just better and more stable, without data plundering, update tyranny and smartphone functionality.


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Fi2 n Co  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 23:48
Member (2013)
English to French
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TOPIC STARTER
Linux May 28, 2016

Frost: "the question is, when one needs to buy a new computer, if one should move to OS X or Linux instead of Windows,"


Linux is a great system but before making the move it is important to know that Linux has many versions (distros) and not every CAT tool can be run on it (I know Wordfast does). Microsoft Word will not run on Linux (maybe only in a Virtual Machine) but some softwares handle the same type of file like Libre Office, or Open Office and others. The formatting is sometimes slightly altered going from one to the other though.

With newer PCs coming with Win 10 preinstalled, to get Linux to install, some prior steps will have to be taken:
1st, update the BIOS
2nd Unlock the BIOS to allow installation of a different system.

Making such moves still remains very scary for most PC users, but the tutorials quality is constantly improving so some may be able to do this.

So, the computer world wll likely be stirred... I hope translators do not suffer too much from it.

My bests

[Modifié le 2016-05-28 11:39 GMT]


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Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 00:48
Member
English to Italian
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About that "Never 10" May 28, 2016

I read on that page "The name “Never 10” is a bit of an overstatement, since this utility may also be used to easily re-enable Windows operating system automatic upgrading". So, basically, the software also provides an option to completely undo the changes it made?

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Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:48
Member (2014)
French to Danish
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Never10 May 28, 2016

Yes, Never10 simply works like an on/off switch, and they do say the name "Never 10" is somehow misleading, as there is nothing permanent about it.

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Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 00:48
Member
English to Italian
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Thanks Thomas May 28, 2016

Thomas T. Frost wrote:

Yes, Never10 simply works like an on/off switch, and they do say the name "Never 10" is somehow misleading, as there is nothing permanent about it.


Thanks! Just wanted to make sure before trying it


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Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:48
Member (2014)
French to Danish
+ ...
Linux May 28, 2016

Indeed, MS Office won't run on Linux, and I'm aware the substitutes aren't 100 % compatible.

So I'm leaning more towards Apple despite the higher cost. I just don't want to waste my time messing around with bits and bytes. I've had enough of that during 20 years' IT career, and I know how long time one can spend on it. At least the time is paid when it's an occupation, but it's a complete waste in any other occupation.

Windows is beginning to look like a dead end, unless Microsoft soon come to their senses. They don't listen to users and only react when their finances and/or sales are collapsing. What Windows 10 is concerned, they must still be in denial, as their only reaction to the much lower number of migrations than what they had expected has been to try to force it upon users who don't want it. I think we're dealing with a massive case of group think.


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esperantisto  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:48
Member (2006)
English to Russian
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Double-wrong May 28, 2016

Thomas T. Frost wrote:

Indeed, MS Office won't run on Linux, and I'm aware the substitutes aren't 100 % compatible.



1. MS Office does run under Linux via wine or Crossover.
2. There is no 100% compatibility even between different versions of MSO.

Thus, both assertions are invalid.

Generally, Linux is great. Just great. And perfectly suitable for translator's work.


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Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:48
Member (2014)
French to Danish
+ ...
Wrong wrong May 28, 2016

It's not wrong that the substitutes are not 100 % compatible, so it's wrong to state that my claim is wrong on that point. That is a logical error. That B is incompatible does not imply that A is compatible. There is no relation between the two claims. That some MS versions may not be 100 % compatible does not invalidate the other claim.

As an example, one may carefully format a document to fit on one page in Word, and then it spills over onto a second page in Open Office.

Another problem with the substitutes could be the language packs, which are essential for translators. Maybe they use the Hunspell files, but for some languages they are not very good. They don't 'understand' that compound words are valid in certain languages, for example. Memsource still uses Hunspell, and the result is that for some languages, the spell check produces so many false positives that the results are essentially useless.

So what does it mean that MS Office runs on Linux via wine or Crossover? I know nothing about Linux.

Memsource runs on OS X and Ubunto, but MemoQ only runs on Windows or Windows emulation on OS X. Are you aware of a Linux solution for MemoQ too?

How much manual configuration and installation work is required on Linux compared with Windows?


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esperantisto  Identity Verified
Local time: 01:48
Member (2006)
English to Russian
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wine and Crossover May 28, 2016

Wine and Crossover are Linux packages (free and non-free respectively) that make it possible to run many Windows programs under Linux (Crossover for Mac is available too). Depending on a particular program, results vary from virtually perfect (no noticeable difference as running under Windows) to poor (a program does not install or run). The same is about configuring: sometimes you just use the defaults, sometimes you need to manually install components such as .Net etc. MemoQ 2014 runs under Crossover, although not very stable.

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Fi2 n Co  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 23:48
Member (2013)
English to French
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TOPIC STARTER
Wine, Linux and more May 28, 2016

Wine is a great tool but sometimes, some Windows programs won't run on it.
MS Office, the newer versions now run via the Windows store app system if I'm not mistaken, so I'm not sure if future and latest vesrions will run on Wine beacuse of that.

Linux is great because you ahev full control of your environment, you can get precompiled versions (some can even revive old PCs like LXLE) with many software preinstalled, and once you start using the command prompt (if you know what you are doing) you save time and tune a lot of things.
As with anything else there is a learning curve, so it takes time.

To know what translators can do with Linux, here is a good site: http://www.linuxfortranslators.org/

Off-course staying with Windows (10 in this case) will save headaches but bring some others that will probably involve tweaking.

OS X is great but Apple isn't completely opened either.

Pros and Cons everywhere so the best choice is probably the best productivity choice for each translator's situation (preferred file types of clients, own computer skills, time, hardware...)

Obviously we will have to keep on learning new skills.

All the best with that


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Łukasz Gos-Furmankiewicz  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 00:48
English to Polish
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... May 28, 2016

Thomas T. Frost wrote:

Windows 7 will not support the newer, more powerful processors, so the question is, when one needs to buy a new computer, if one should move to OS X or Linux instead of Windows, since Microsoft apparently hate their PC/business users so much they'll keep dragging them through the mud for their collapsed smartphone business.


It's true that some processors don't work on Win7 (or Win 8.1, if you're going to take that step as a compromise), but to some extent this can be circumvented in two nonexclusive ways:

1. Rather than a budget modern processor buy a dated high-end CPU from its previous owner. This includes some really powerful i7s that work on older mobos.

2. Aftermarket cooling. Air for people with several dozen bucks to burn and limited tech savvy/tinkering streak, and water for those more into it. And water is going to get simplified as relatively mainstream companies begin to tap into that market. Hybrid solutions already exist, for example.

Next:

It's probably worth noting that translators aren't going to need as much power as engineers and designers, so spending a bit more money on RAM and SSDs will help things given that raw CPU power isn't going to be critical.

This can't last forever, naturally, but it's still going to buy us a lot of time — enough time for anything really to occur — as long as Microsoft doesn't do something really desparate. But probably not desperate enough to be nuked by the EU and fed admin for it. The uncharacteristic silence of the European Commission on this can't last forever.

Meanwhile (several years) CATs are likely to be ported to Linux and Mac.


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 00:48
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
Please do not stray from the topic May 28, 2016

As the thread is about the (non)upgrading to Win 10, please do not discuss Linux here. If you wish to compare Windows and Linux please either open the new thread or use the Linux forum.

Thank you.


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Lincoln Hui  Identity Verified
Hong Kong
Local time: 06:48
Member
Chinese to English
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Win10 May 28, 2016

At some point I'll probably upgrade to Win 10, since it's not any worse than Win 8. But Microsoft's heavy-handed approach to forced upgrading is merely the newest in a long history of colossal blunders by the company.

I wonder, though, whether there's a lucrative lawsuit to be had in this. I've already heard tales of people who lost valuable work when forced upgrades kicked in, had upgrades happen in the middle of an important business meeting, or were simply unable to use their machines after the upgrade.


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Łukasz Gos-Furmankiewicz  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 00:48
English to Polish
+ ...
... May 28, 2016

Lincoln Hui wrote:

At some point I'll probably upgrade to Win 10, since it's not any worse than Win 8. But Microsoft's heavy-handed approach to forced upgrading is merely the newest in a long history of colossal blunders by the company.

I wonder, though, whether there's a lucrative lawsuit to be had in this. I've already heard tales of people who lost valuable work when forced upgrades kicked in, had upgrades happen in the middle of an important business meeting, or were simply unable to use their machines after the upgrade.


It's already quite evident how governments are cutting software companies a lot of slack with EULAs that simply wouldn't fly in any other business and quite possibly wouldn't stand in court.

By pushing it too far MS could get the European Commission and a bunch of federal suits to call the bluff.

Besides, other software companies won't allow MS to get away with it so easily.

I think the moment the first lawsuit shows up in the ECJ about being forced to accept updates, let alone upgrades, the landscape is going to change rapidally and radically.


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