un rez de chaussée plus bas que l'étage

English translation: keep it vague

20:20 Apr 19, 2009
French to English translations [Non-PRO]
Construction / Civil Engineering / description of a building
French term or phrase: un rez de chaussée plus bas que l'étage
Il présente un rez de chaussée plus bas que l'étage qui renferme les appartements et les pièces de réception. L'arrière du bâtiment, donne sur une terrasse avec degrés. Côté arrivée, la porte est couronnée d'un fronton courbe.

Describing Château Arbanats in Gironde.
Sorry, my brain is not working - is there something unusual about the groundfloor?
Mark Nathan
France
Local time: 12:08
English translation:keep it vague
Explanation:
Either this is simply poorly written (a RdC is always "lower than" = "below" a (n upper) floor") or it is cleverly written to give a false impression.

If we assume that "plus bas que" means "below", as logic tells us it should, we can imagine reception halls etc. with a fine aerial view over the French garden, fountains, etc. or whatever surrounds this chateau.

On the other hand, if "plus bas que" means its literal "lower than", then maybe the chateau has split-level flooring, with, in addition (?) a front entrance level higher (or lower) than the rear-entrance level (ceci expliquant cela), the result being (possibly) that the reception area you are paying a great deal of money for is not as elevated as you might have thought.

Then again, maybe "bas" refers to the ceiling height, so while upon entering the building it might seem low and dingy, once you get to the reception level you find it's high-ceilinged and luminous.

I'd have thought the entrance level would have a high ceiling, but anything is possible (especially if the owners reserve part of the place for their own use and, even if they rent out the luxurious reception halls, make people use the dark and dingy service entrance ...)

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Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:09:44 GMT)
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If you look at the house in the picture here
http://www4.culture.fr/patrimoines/patrimoine_architectural_...
it does indeed appear that the RdC has less headroom than the upper floor.

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Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:16:15 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

1st def. in Larousse Lexis :
1. BAS, BASSE ... 1. (après le nom) Se dit de ce qui a peu de hauteur ou d'intensité, de ce qui est incliné vers le sol : Ce qui frappait d'abord dans cette longue salle basse et voûtée était un singulier aspect de propreté et d'ordre (Gracq) [= dont le plafond est peu élevé]

The fact that the dictionary felt the dont le plafond est peu élevé explanation was necessary suggests that the meaning is not immediately obviously even to the most native French speaker.

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Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:17:42 GMT)
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Ily thinkly myly fingersly arely losingly controllly.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 hrs (2009-04-20 11:22:09 GMT)
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Your picture: Yup, similar to, but on a grander scale than, that farm cottage in Brittany above.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 hrs (2009-04-20 11:27:14 GMT)
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I wonder for how much longer we'll be able to say things like "native French speaker" without being accused of racism (of making snide comments about African francophones). There's a UN conference on that sort of thing right now, I understand.
Selected response from:

Bourth (X)
Local time: 12:08
Grading comment
Thanks everyone
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +1keep it vague
Bourth (X)
4a lower-ground-floor
Catherine CHAUVIN
4a ground floor below the first floor/upper story
swanda
4a g/f smaller in height than...
axies
3a main floor below ground level
Marco Solinas
3What is presumably the rez-de-chaussée is the first floor, and the rez-de-chaussée is terrace-level
MatthewLaSon
3basement floor
bowse123 (X)
3a recessed entrance level
Julia Ryder


Discussion entries: 8





  

Answers


15 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
a main floor below ground level


Explanation:
It sounds as if the main floor is partialli dug below ground lavel. A sort of half basement, we would say in North America

Marco Solinas
Local time: 03:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 88

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Shankaran Viswanathan: It appears that the house is built on a slope, the back side is the rdc giving out to the terrace.
2 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
a lower-ground-floor


Explanation:
Citation de Dick Francis (écrivain anglais) : "Caroline lived in what she described as a lower-ground-floor apartment".

C'est très courant en GB et aussi aux USA. On y accède par un demi niveau d'escaliers.

Catherine CHAUVIN
France
Local time: 12:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 11
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
What is presumably the rez-de-chaussée is the first floor, and the rez-de-chaussée is terrace-level


Explanation:
Hello,

That's my 2 cents.

terrace-level = below ground

I hope it helps.


MatthewLaSon
Local time: 06:08
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 119
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
un rez de chaussée plus bas que l\'étage
a ground floor below the first floor/upper story


Explanation:
*

swanda
Local time: 12:08
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 46
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7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
basement floor


Explanation:
,

bowse123 (X)
Local time: 06:08
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in EnglishEnglish
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14 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
a g/f smaller in height than...


Explanation:
It could be referring to the height of the RdC. The fact that the RdC is not or was not constructed to std regulations. "plus bas que l'étage..." is a comparison as I see it.

axies
Australia
Local time: 19:38
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in PortuguesePortuguese
PRO pts in category: 34
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
keep it vague


Explanation:
Either this is simply poorly written (a RdC is always "lower than" = "below" a (n upper) floor") or it is cleverly written to give a false impression.

If we assume that "plus bas que" means "below", as logic tells us it should, we can imagine reception halls etc. with a fine aerial view over the French garden, fountains, etc. or whatever surrounds this chateau.

On the other hand, if "plus bas que" means its literal "lower than", then maybe the chateau has split-level flooring, with, in addition (?) a front entrance level higher (or lower) than the rear-entrance level (ceci expliquant cela), the result being (possibly) that the reception area you are paying a great deal of money for is not as elevated as you might have thought.

Then again, maybe "bas" refers to the ceiling height, so while upon entering the building it might seem low and dingy, once you get to the reception level you find it's high-ceilinged and luminous.

I'd have thought the entrance level would have a high ceiling, but anything is possible (especially if the owners reserve part of the place for their own use and, even if they rent out the luxurious reception halls, make people use the dark and dingy service entrance ...)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:09:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

If you look at the house in the picture here
http://www4.culture.fr/patrimoines/patrimoine_architectural_...
it does indeed appear that the RdC has less headroom than the upper floor.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:16:15 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

1st def. in Larousse Lexis :
1. BAS, BASSE ... 1. (après le nom) Se dit de ce qui a peu de hauteur ou d'intensité, de ce qui est incliné vers le sol : Ce qui frappait d'abord dans cette longue salle basse et voûtée était un singulier aspect de propreté et d'ordre (Gracq) [= dont le plafond est peu élevé]

The fact that the dictionary felt the dont le plafond est peu élevé explanation was necessary suggests that the meaning is not immediately obviously even to the most native French speaker.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2009-04-20 11:17:42 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Ily thinkly myly fingersly arely losingly controllly.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 hrs (2009-04-20 11:22:09 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Your picture: Yup, similar to, but on a grander scale than, that farm cottage in Brittany above.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 hrs (2009-04-20 11:27:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I wonder for how much longer we'll be able to say things like "native French speaker" without being accused of racism (of making snide comments about African francophones). There's a UN conference on that sort of thing right now, I understand.

Bourth (X)
Local time: 12:08
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4135
Grading comment
Thanks everyone
Notes to answerer
Asker: http://www.tourisme-aquitaine.fr/fr/hebergement.asp?m=3&sitPageRet=patrimoineCulturel.asp&sitTable=sitPatrimoineCulturel&codeLangueSit=fr&idLangue=1&numPage=94&idFiche=PCUAQU033FS000RB

Asker: I found this - which even has the text I am translating - and appears to suport the lower ceiling height theory.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  David Goward: I wondered if it meant "floor-to-ceiling height" too. Looks like Mark's going to have to spend a night there purely in the interests of research.
1 hr
  -> Undoubtedly too late now, but proof that you should always negotiate "une nuit au château" into your translation contracts. I know someone who negotiated a week's free skiing when translating a resort site ...
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18 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
a recessed entrance level


Explanation:
You know how they tell you to pick the first answer to a test question that you think is right, because your gut instinct reacts right away...well, this is the impression I got at first read.

I encountered many buildings in France (none of them chateaux unfortunately) where you must go down a step or two, or three, to get inside the "main floor".

The debate here is interesting, and the lower ceiling idea indeed seems valid as well...but if it turns out to be the floor (underfoot) that is "plus bas", I wanted to offer you the "recessed" wording.




Julia Ryder
United States
Local time: 03:08
Native speaker of: English
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