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koudelnik

English translation: oakum trader

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20:11 Jan 31, 2002
Czech to English translations [Non-PRO]
Art/Literary
Czech term or phrase: koudelnik
...ja jsem koudelnika syn...

I believe it's from an old Czech folk song. I do know how to render "koudel"-"tow" but the term for "koudelnik" seems to be elusive to all dictionaries I possess.
Lara
English translation:oakum trader
Explanation:
Although my modern dictionary says 'oakum-picker', at a time when you could still come across some in Czechoslovakia, during the first half of the 20th century, koudeldník was known to be trader in oakum, 'obchodník s koudelí'.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-01-31 23:31:53 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-01-31 23:33:36 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 03:21:21 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 10:39:51 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

[Removed name]: \"Very interesting, zenny. I believe, however, that oakum was made and sold by the same craftsman ...

That is exactly my point: the Czech definition of \'koudelník\' is \'obchodník s koudelí\', in both pre-WWII and post-WWII resources. As a matter of fact, one of them refers to the very song the asker found the term \'koudelník\' in.

I am not sure what the English really ever used as a term for such a tradesman. My suggested translation merely conveys the meaning as it was known in the Czech context at the time the trade was practiced.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 10:41:59 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

[Removed name]: \"Very interesting, zenny. I believe, however, that oakum was made and sold by the same craftsman ...

That is exactly my point: the Czech definition of \'koudelník\' is \'obchodník s koudelí\', in both pre-WWII and post-WWII resources. As a matter of fact, one of them refers to the very song the asker found the term \'koudelník\' in.

I am not sure what the English really ever used as a term for such a tradesman. My suggested translation merely conveys the meaning as it was known in the Czech context at the time the trade was practiced.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 14:54:30 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I HAVE NO IDEA WHY MY NOTES ARE BEING ADDED IN MULTIPLE COPIES ...
Selected response from:

Zenny Sadlon
Local time: 09:41
Grading comment
Great, comprehensive, many thanks once more.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5oakum trader
Zenny Sadlon
4oakum-maker[Removed name]


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


24 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
oakum-maker


Explanation:
a person who made oakum for living - loose hemp or jute fiber obtained by unravelling old ropes and then impregnated with tar - it was used to caulk seams

[Removed name]
Local time: 10:41
Native speaker of: Native in SlovakSlovak
PRO pts in pair: 12
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
oakum trader


Explanation:
Although my modern dictionary says 'oakum-picker', at a time when you could still come across some in Czechoslovakia, during the first half of the 20th century, koudeldník was known to be trader in oakum, 'obchodník s koudelí'.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-01-31 23:31:53 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-01-31 23:33:36 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 03:21:21 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I presume that as with some other ways of making a living, picking refuse to recycle material, processing it into a new commodity and selling it, could be done by the same person or company. One could argue about whether due to specialization there are three distinct occupations for each phase. I am merely reporting that according to my sources, in this case, \'koudelník\', whose title is derived from the end product, was know to be a trader in oakum. I do not know whether there were specializations whereby some collected the raw material, some processed it, some traded it, and some used as a material in a service.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 10:39:51 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

[Removed name]: \"Very interesting, zenny. I believe, however, that oakum was made and sold by the same craftsman ...

That is exactly my point: the Czech definition of \'koudelník\' is \'obchodník s koudelí\', in both pre-WWII and post-WWII resources. As a matter of fact, one of them refers to the very song the asker found the term \'koudelník\' in.

I am not sure what the English really ever used as a term for such a tradesman. My suggested translation merely conveys the meaning as it was known in the Czech context at the time the trade was practiced.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 10:41:59 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

[Removed name]: \"Very interesting, zenny. I believe, however, that oakum was made and sold by the same craftsman ...

That is exactly my point: the Czech definition of \'koudelník\' is \'obchodník s koudelí\', in both pre-WWII and post-WWII resources. As a matter of fact, one of them refers to the very song the asker found the term \'koudelník\' in.

I am not sure what the English really ever used as a term for such a tradesman. My suggested translation merely conveys the meaning as it was known in the Czech context at the time the trade was practiced.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-02-01 14:54:30 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I HAVE NO IDEA WHY MY NOTES ARE BEING ADDED IN MULTIPLE COPIES ...

Zenny Sadlon
Local time: 09:41
Native speaker of: Native in CzechCzech
PRO pts in pair: 251
Grading comment
Great, comprehensive, many thanks once more.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  [Removed name]: Very interesting, zenny. I believe, however, that oakum was made and sold by the same craftsman, which was usually the case with other crafts, such as pottery making, shoe making, basket-making, etc.
5 hrs
  -> That is exactly my point: the Czech definition of 'koudelník' is 'obchodník s koudelí', in both pre-WWII and post-WWII resources. As a matter of fact, one of them refers to the very song the asker found the term 'koudelník' in.
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