vanzelfsprekendheden (zie * in context)

English translation: self-evident truths

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Dutch term or phrase:vanzelfsprekendheden
English translation:self-evident truths
Entered by: Luuk Arens

18:42 Sep 6, 2010
Dutch to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - Social Science, Sociology, Ethics, etc. / Hoffman's TOPOI-model
Dutch term or phrase: vanzelfsprekendheden (zie * in context)
Onder "Ordening"

Analysekader: Wat kun je je afvragen?
-Wat is ieders zienswijze en logica?
-Wat is ieders invalshoek, belang of loyaliteit?
-Wat is ieders referentiekader: waarden en normen?
-Wat zijn ieders * vanzelfsprekendheden *?
-Wat is gemeenschappelijk? Wat zijn de verschillen?
-Wat is de invloed van de heersende beelden, waarden, normen, opvattingen en betekenissen in de sociale omgeving op ieders zienswijze en logica?
Luuk Arens
Mozambique
Local time: 03:33
self-evident truths
Explanation:
What are every person's self-evident truths

ik begrijp "vanzelfsprekendheden" hier als wat iemand zonder meer als waar ziet
dat hoeft geen vooroordeel te zijn

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2010-09-06 22:56:53 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hi textpertise,

To be honest, I was not thinking of patients when I posted my answer. I was thinking of persons like you and me :-). So let's talk a bit about you and me, more specifically about our personal self-evident truths and (basic) assumptions/things taken for granted.
Now I wonder, what are my self-evident truths and what are the things I take for granted or my basic assumptions? Can I differentiate between them? I don't think I can on the level of definitions but I can perhaps on the level of how things sound.

this is the level of definitions so it appears:

Noun 1. self-evident truth - an assumption that is basic to an argument
- basic assumption, constatation
- supposal, supposition, assumption - a hypothesis that is taken for granted; "any society is built upon certain assumptions"

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/self-evident truth

Well?

To me, the difference between "my self-evident truths" and "my basic assumptions" is that "my self-evident truths" sound just a little bit more true to me :-) There may be a little bit less doubt involved.

I don't think, you wil claim that each of your self-evident truths just concerns something you believe that is true but isn't true?Something may really be a self-evident truth to you, I suppose.

We are talking here about your and my "vanzelfsprekendheden", that is, we are talking here about your and my self-evident truths or basic assumptions if you like.

Not each self-evident truth is necessarily a preconceived notion. However, all truth is subjective or personal even if absolute.
When is something true? When it is true to you. But can we know the truth?

"For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known."

You more or less forced me to find out what context the question actually relates to. This seems to be it:

Hoffman (2002) heeft een systeemtheoretische benadering van interculturele communicatie en neemt als uitgangspunt de algemene systeem- en communicatietheorie zoals die is bewerkt door de Interactie Academie in Antwerpen (Steens, 1993). Interpersoonlijke communicatie vanuit een systeemtheoretische visie wordt door Baert (1991) als volgt omschreven: “uitwisseling van visies van en omtrent personen en onderhandeling over de zinvolheid of de mogelijke betekenis van deze visies. Deze uitwisseling is een interpersoonlijk gebeuren ingebed in een ruimere gemeenschapsdialoog binnen de samenleving.” Communicatie gaat dus niet alleen om de verbale en non-verbale taal, maar ook om de achterliggende (cultureel bepaalde) betekenissen. Daarnaast is de communicatie ingebed in een ‘ruimere gemeenschapsdialoog’. Deze gemeenschapsdialoog zit verdisconteerd in de sociale representaties van mensen. Sociale representaties zijn “collectief gedeelde waarden, beelden, praktijken, ideeën en betekenissen ofwel de VANZELFSPREKENDHEDEN die gedeeld en gecreëerd worden met andere mensen” (Zeegers, 1988; Hagendoorn, 1991; Schabracq, 1992; Verkuyten e.a., 1993; Van Dijk, 1993). Ieder individu neemt deel aan de totstandkoming en instandhouding van deze sociale representaties. Ieder individu gaat ook uit van diezelfde representaties. In de verschillende sociale systemen kunnen echter verschillende sociale representaties heersen.

http://www.expertisepunt.be/files/NEXT coaching - Omschrijvi...

Whether we are talking about some self-evident truth or basic assumption, is a question that each person needs to answer for himself.
In the end, I think both options are possible and the specific context needs to decide which option to choose.

Finally, we are talking here about:

Wat zijn ieders vanzelfsprekendheden

We seem to be talking about every person's personal "vanzelfsprekendheden"

I choose to read it as:

ik begrijp "vanzelfsprekendheden" hier als wat iemand zonder meer als waar ziet
dat hoeft geen vooroordeel te zijn
Selected response from:

Barend van Zadelhoff
Netherlands
Local time: 02:33
Grading comment
Thank you all for your suggestions and feedback.
Best,
Luuk
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +2self-evident truths
Barend van Zadelhoff
3 +2things taken for granted/assumptions
Textpertise
3taken for granted
Verginia Ophof
Summary of reference entries provided
Wilfred Bion's basic assumptions
Kitty Brussaard

  

Answers


8 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
taken for granted


Explanation:
what do people take for granted - consider self-evident

In traditional logic, an axiom or postulate is a proposition that is not proved or demonstrated but considered to be either self-evident, or subject to necessary decision. Therefore, its truth is taken for granted, and serves as a starting point for deducing and inferring other (theory dependent) truths.


    Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom
Verginia Ophof
Belize
Local time: 19:33
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Tina Vonhof: Answer is right but the scientific explanation is not appropriate here.
1 day 2 hrs
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10 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
things taken for granted/assumptions


Explanation:
There may be a more official term for this.
The things that a person assumes to be natural or self-understood, but may not necessarily be so. Thus I have added the alternative of assumptions.
If I get time later, I shall try to find support for this answer or to find the official terminology if it exists, but am under time pressure just now - apologies.

Textpertise
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 12

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Kitty Brussaard: Spot on :-) 'Basic assumptions' or 'taken for granted assumptions' seem to be the more 'official' terminology. See also my reference comment.
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Kitty

agree  Tina Vonhof
1 day 2 hrs
  -> Thank you, Tina!
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9 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
self-evident truths


Explanation:
What are every person's self-evident truths

ik begrijp "vanzelfsprekendheden" hier als wat iemand zonder meer als waar ziet
dat hoeft geen vooroordeel te zijn

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2010-09-06 22:56:53 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hi textpertise,

To be honest, I was not thinking of patients when I posted my answer. I was thinking of persons like you and me :-). So let's talk a bit about you and me, more specifically about our personal self-evident truths and (basic) assumptions/things taken for granted.
Now I wonder, what are my self-evident truths and what are the things I take for granted or my basic assumptions? Can I differentiate between them? I don't think I can on the level of definitions but I can perhaps on the level of how things sound.

this is the level of definitions so it appears:

Noun 1. self-evident truth - an assumption that is basic to an argument
- basic assumption, constatation
- supposal, supposition, assumption - a hypothesis that is taken for granted; "any society is built upon certain assumptions"

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/self-evident truth

Well?

To me, the difference between "my self-evident truths" and "my basic assumptions" is that "my self-evident truths" sound just a little bit more true to me :-) There may be a little bit less doubt involved.

I don't think, you wil claim that each of your self-evident truths just concerns something you believe that is true but isn't true?Something may really be a self-evident truth to you, I suppose.

We are talking here about your and my "vanzelfsprekendheden", that is, we are talking here about your and my self-evident truths or basic assumptions if you like.

Not each self-evident truth is necessarily a preconceived notion. However, all truth is subjective or personal even if absolute.
When is something true? When it is true to you. But can we know the truth?

"For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known."

You more or less forced me to find out what context the question actually relates to. This seems to be it:

Hoffman (2002) heeft een systeemtheoretische benadering van interculturele communicatie en neemt als uitgangspunt de algemene systeem- en communicatietheorie zoals die is bewerkt door de Interactie Academie in Antwerpen (Steens, 1993). Interpersoonlijke communicatie vanuit een systeemtheoretische visie wordt door Baert (1991) als volgt omschreven: “uitwisseling van visies van en omtrent personen en onderhandeling over de zinvolheid of de mogelijke betekenis van deze visies. Deze uitwisseling is een interpersoonlijk gebeuren ingebed in een ruimere gemeenschapsdialoog binnen de samenleving.” Communicatie gaat dus niet alleen om de verbale en non-verbale taal, maar ook om de achterliggende (cultureel bepaalde) betekenissen. Daarnaast is de communicatie ingebed in een ‘ruimere gemeenschapsdialoog’. Deze gemeenschapsdialoog zit verdisconteerd in de sociale representaties van mensen. Sociale representaties zijn “collectief gedeelde waarden, beelden, praktijken, ideeën en betekenissen ofwel de VANZELFSPREKENDHEDEN die gedeeld en gecreëerd worden met andere mensen” (Zeegers, 1988; Hagendoorn, 1991; Schabracq, 1992; Verkuyten e.a., 1993; Van Dijk, 1993). Ieder individu neemt deel aan de totstandkoming en instandhouding van deze sociale representaties. Ieder individu gaat ook uit van diezelfde representaties. In de verschillende sociale systemen kunnen echter verschillende sociale representaties heersen.

http://www.expertisepunt.be/files/NEXT coaching - Omschrijvi...

Whether we are talking about some self-evident truth or basic assumption, is a question that each person needs to answer for himself.
In the end, I think both options are possible and the specific context needs to decide which option to choose.

Finally, we are talking here about:

Wat zijn ieders vanzelfsprekendheden

We seem to be talking about every person's personal "vanzelfsprekendheden"

I choose to read it as:

ik begrijp "vanzelfsprekendheden" hier als wat iemand zonder meer als waar ziet
dat hoeft geen vooroordeel te zijn


Barend van Zadelhoff
Netherlands
Local time: 02:33
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 8
Grading comment
Thank you all for your suggestions and feedback.
Best,
Luuk

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Frank van Thienen (X): this is the proper terminology in this context, IMHO
14 mins
  -> Thank you, Frank.

agree  Halyna Smakal
1 hr
  -> Dank je wel, Halyna.

neutral  Textpertise: Where you and I differ is that, IMHO, in therapy "vanzelfsprekendheden" are not necessarily truths. They are what the patient believes to be truths and part of the therapy is in examining these assumptions
1 hr
  -> Hi Textpertise, see my added note.
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Reference comments


1 hr
Reference: Wilfred Bion's basic assumptions

Reference information:
Wilfred Ruprecht Bion (Mathura (India), 8 september 1897 - Oxford (Engeland), 8 november 1979) was een Britse psychiater en pionier op het terrein van de groepsdynamica. (...)
Met de term basic assumptions verwees Bion naar onderliggende aannames over hoe het er in een team of organisatie aan toe gaat en zou moeten gaan. Het zijn de routines en stille vanzelfsprekendheden die in onze bovenkamer de kleur van het behang hebben aangenomen. Als gevolg daarvan blijven ze in ons denken grotendeel onbewust en zijn ze in onze gesprekken nauwelijks hoorbaar. Maar juist doordat ze buiten beeld blijven, kunnen ze vaak ongehinderd de gang van zaken in sociale systemen ontregelen. Relatieve buitenstaanders met een geoefend oog en oor, zoals groepstherapeuten of consultants, kunnen een sociaal systeem in zulke gevallen voor het moeras behoeden, door hun observaties en interpretaties hardop kenbaar te maken aan de groep als geheel.
http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilfred_Bion

Een andere goede optie is de term 'taken for granted assumptions' (cf. also Schein). Het kan hierbij zowel om individuele of gemeenschappelijke vanzelfsprekendheden/aannames gaan.

Kitty Brussaard
Netherlands
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 16
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