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pronunciation of "organized"

English translation: I don't pronounce the R

11:25 Oct 13, 2004
English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Art/Literary - Linguistics / do you say the "r"?
English term or phrase: pronunciation of "organized"
Hi all,

Could you tell me if it's wrong to say the weak "r" in the word "organized"? I'm not stressing or emphasizing the "r", it rolls off the tongue easily, but I was told it's wrong.

Also, does the difference between US/UK apply here?

Thank you!
Mikhail Kropotov
Germany
Local time: 01:56
Selected answer:I don't pronounce the R
Explanation:
In NZ English. My pronunciation of the word is something like "AW-gan-ized". I'm pretty sure it would be the same in most forms of British English.

However, I think in the States, you would say "OR-gan-ized", with the R being pronounced.
Selected response from:

Rowan Morrell
New Zealand
Local time: 11:56
Grading comment
Thank you.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED
4 +20I don't pronounce the R
Rowan Morrell
5 +7no right or wrong
MJ Barber
5 +1not pronounced in the UK, pronounced in the US/Canada
Orsolya Mance


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


4 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +20
pronunciation of
I don't pronounce the R


Explanation:
In NZ English. My pronunciation of the word is something like "AW-gan-ized". I'm pretty sure it would be the same in most forms of British English.

However, I think in the States, you would say "OR-gan-ized", with the R being pronounced.

Rowan Morrell
New Zealand
Local time: 11:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8
Grading comment
Thank you.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  nlingua
0 min
  -> Thanks nlingua.
agree  Konstantin Kisin: yep, i don't say it either (UK)
1 min
  -> Thanks for the confirmation, Konstantin.
agree  David Russi: I do (US)
1 min
  -> Thought so. Thanks David.
agree  Michael Powers (PhD): For the most part, this is true. There are certain dialects in the US in which "r" at the end of a syllable is not pronounced, such as in Boston. - Mike :)
5 mins
  -> Yes, in New England the accent is a little closer to British English than elsewhere in the States, at least I believe that's the case. Anyway, thanks Mike.
agree  Derek Gill Franßen: I agree with Michael. I pronounce it very clearly (coming from the western part of the USA).
11 mins
  -> Thanks Derek.
agree  Marie Andersson (Allen)
11 mins
  -> Thanks Marie.
agree  Anna Tomashevskaya: ['o:gənaizd], there is no R. Even if I haven't found the sign for o.
13 mins
  -> In British English, NZ English and Australian English, no, but in US English it's a little different. Anyway, thanks Anna.
agree  Julie Roy: Yes, and in Canada the "R" is pronounced, like in the US.
22 mins
  -> Good point - the Canadian accent is similar to the American. Thanks Julie.
agree  Enza Longo
24 mins
  -> Thanks enzalo.
agree  Marek Daroszewski (MrMarDar): here http://m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=organiz... you can actually have a listen to Webster's US pronunciation :)
24 mins
  -> Thanks for that, MrMarDar.
agree  Tony M: As a Brit, I never pronounce it
34 mins
  -> I don't imagine you would. Thanks Dusty.
agree  Saleh Chowdhury, Ph.D.
52 mins
  -> Thanks Saleh.
agree  Mushinha
1 hr
  -> Thanks Romina.
agree  FionaT: Indeed, in 'English English' you don't pronounce the r, but just to confuse things: I am a Brit who does pronounce the r, I'm Scottish :-)
1 hr
  -> Well, Scots do roll their Rs. Thanks for pointing that out, Fiona.
agree  tazdog (X)
2 hrs
  -> Thanks Cindy.
agree  Heidi Stone-Schaller: I think you need one more agree (someone's got to take your side)
2 hrs
  -> Thank you kindly, Heidrun.
agree  airmailrpl: if the speaker is in the south of the USA or Texas don't pronounce the R...that is correct
4 hrs
  -> Really? I though it would be stronger in the South. Or do they say something like "aw-gan-ahzed"? Anyway, thanks airmailrpl.
agree  mportal
4 hrs
  -> Thanks mportal.
agree  awilliams: http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/How-to-tell-the-ori... (don't know how reliable it is, but interesting nonetheless!)
6 hrs
  -> Thanks for the reference, awilliams.
agree  Tehani
2 days 3 hrs
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51 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +7
pronunciation of
no right or wrong


Explanation:
There is no right or wrong, only regional and class accent differences. Anybody who says that pronouncing or non-pronouncing the r is wrong is a snob. Being Irish, I pronounce it, and I wouldn't take it from anybody to tell me I was pronouncing wrongly, however, neither would I presume to tell anybody who didn't pronounce it that THEY were not speaking properly.

MJ Barber
Spain
Local time: 01:56
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  RHELLER: I definitely pronounce it (U.S.) but love to hear the King's English (or should I say the Queen's English?) and Irish accents :-)
59 mins
agree  tazdog (X)
1 hr
agree  Heidi Stone-Schaller: there's no right or wrong; but I would be interested in finding out what you think the class accent differences are. Are you referring to social classes within Ireland?
1 hr
  -> No, in England, where upwards social mobility involves losing regional accents
agree  FionaT: Absolutely
1 hr
agree  humbird: In American English it is pronounced very cearly (with minor ecxeption of some areas in the South).
4 hrs
agree  awilliams: true - I never pronounce the R but then I have a dull Hampshire accent... :-)
5 hrs
agree  Refugio: Totally agree, it is not only perfectly acceptable, but anyone who goes around correcting someone else's pronunciation is very unclassy.
6 hrs
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
pronunciation of
not pronounced in the UK, pronounced in the US/Canada


Explanation:
...but I don't think anyone anywhere would be offended by your accent, whichever way you use it!

Here is a useful extract on this issue:
"Most American dialects have not lost the non-prevocalic r. That is, "standard" American English preserves the sound of "r" in all occurrences, whereas British English only preserves it when it is followed by a vowel (see rhotic). However, this does not hold true for all American dialects nor for all British dialects; the dialects of New England and the American South both exhibit the same sound change found in southern England. This phenomenon also partially accounts for the interlocution of 'r' between a word ending in a vowel and one beginning with a vowel (e.g. "the idear of it") exhibited both in some dialects of Britain and in the Boston (USA) dialect of American English. Most other American dialects interpose a glottal stop where "r" appears in the Boston example, and appears to perform the same function of separating adjacent (non-dipthongized) vowels." (source below)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs 43 mins (2004-10-13 14:08:40 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Please note that I am fully aware of the different variations in pronunciation within the UK and the US - I have actually studied this subject quite extensively.
My headline might be too general (see my answer to Fiona), but I did use the above quote in order to elaborate it. The headline was only meant to give SirReal a point of reference rather than a detailed dialectical analysis.


    Reference: http://brandt.kurowski.net/projects/lsa/wiki/view.cgi?doc=40...
Orsolya Mance
Hungary
Local time: 01:56
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in HungarianHungarian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Heidi Stone-Schaller: I know Australians who say "the idear of it"//your headline is a bit of a generalization, but your quote makes up for it
4 mins
  -> Thanks! I know lots of Brits who do that - and some say "drawring" for drawing! :)
neutral  FionaT: It's not as simple as that. The extract you quote even says that it doesn't hold true for all UK/US dialects. See my remark above about Scottish English, which does pronounce it.
10 mins
  -> I agree with you, that's exactly why I put the quote in! Maybe I should have put "In general" in front my answer.
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