toidy-toid and toid

English translation: Thirty-third and Third Avenue (New York)

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

English term or phrase:	toidy-toid and toid (New York accent)
Selected answer:	Thirty-third and Third Avenue (New York)
Entered by:	María Teresa Taylor Oliver

17:46 Aug 26, 2005

English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature
Region (source): English (United States)
Region (target): English (United States)

English term or phrase: toidy-toid and toid

I'm reading a Nelson DeMille novel about a New York policeman who is recovering from gunshot wounds on the North Fork of Long Island.

This passage describes how John, the cop, is riding in a car with another cop, a woman, who is driving.

Suddenly, the woman says, apropos of nothing:

-We're approaching toidy-toid and toid.

And the cop responds:

-I do *not* speak with that kind of accent. I do *not* find that amusing.

-I hear ya.

By the way, this cop is kind of a joker (I love DeMille's characters, they're always fun to "get to know").

I suppose she's making fun of his NY accent, and the only thing I can think of it's that it means "thirty-third", but I'd like to be sure.

Thanks!

María Teresa Taylor Oliver KudoZ activity Questions: 1071 (1 open) (3 without valid answers) (21 closed without grading) Answers: 2099 Panama
Local time: 04:40

Thirty-third and Third Avenue

Explanation:
Yes, you're right. It's a Brooklyn accent.

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Note added at 11 mins (2005-08-26 17:57:56 GMT)
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I stand corrected:
---
New Yorkers have the Irish to thank for their now famous "toity-toid ohn toid". A Hofstra University professor, Francis Griffith, attributes New Yorkese speakers' habit of interchanging the diphthong "oi" with "er" to Gaelic language.
The general notion is that each borough has a distinct accent. This would mean that there is a Brooklyn accent, as opposed to Bronx accent; and that there is a Manhattan, a Queens and a Staten Island accent.

This means that there is no such thing as Bronx accent or a Brooklyn accent. The variations in New York accent is actually more a result of the ethnic roots of the waves of immigrants that settled in the city, starting with the Dutch, the Irish, the Italian and the European Jews . All these influences ganged up and gave New York its distinctive accent. So New Yorkese speakers either have an Italian-American, Irish-American or Yiddish-American accent.

http://www.nyc24.org/2003/issue3/story5/page2.html

Selected response from:

Kim Metzger
Mexico
Local time: 03:40

Grading comment

Oh my God, I'm so sorry, I'd forgotten I had this question open!! Thank you all for you excellent answers and references!! :) By the way, this is the first question I grade while using the new layout, so I apologize in advance if I do something wrong!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED

4 +21

Thirty-third and Third Avenue

Kim Metzger

5 +9

33rd and 3rd

tazdog (X)

4 +2

intersection of Thirty-third and Third streets

Anne Spitzmueller

Answers

7 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +9

33rd and 3rd

Explanation:
That's what it means.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 mins (2005-08-26 17:55:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

OT: See ADS-L archives for "Thirty-Third and Third" or "toidy toid 'n toid"--ed.):
http://listserv.linguistlist.org/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0406C&L=ad...

tazdog (X)
Spain
Local time: 11:40
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16

7 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +21

Thirty-third and Third Avenue

Kim Metzger
Mexico
Local time: 03:40
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 277

Grading comment

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Nick Lingris

2 mins

agree

JaneTranslates

5 mins

agree

Enza Longo

8 mins

agree

Refugio: The oi may be Irish but the th to t conversion is more Yiddish or Italian. Truly an amalgam there in Brooklyn.

17 mins

agree

gtreyger (X)

18 mins

agree

Anna Maria Augustine (X)

34 mins

agree

sporran

1 hr

agree

jennifer newsome (X)

1 hr

agree

Alfa Trans (X)

1 hr

agree

jccantrell: Nyuk, nyuk, nyuk, spread out! Watch out for the fingers in the eyes from Moe of the Three Stooges!

3 hrs

-> I guess the only kids who know about my favorite boys are the ones who studied ancient history.

agree

JCEC

5 hrs

agree

Elizabeth Lyons: This was a good one. It is also very close to a Jersey City accent.

7 hrs

agree

Robert Donahue (X)

7 hrs

agree

Nanny Wintjens

7 hrs

agree

ahmadwadan.com

11 hrs

agree

KathyT

12 hrs

agree

Vicky Papaprodromou

14 hrs

agree

Saiwai Translation Services

15 hrs

agree

awilliams

19 hrs

agree

bigedsenior: It is also heard in the Bronx.

22 hrs

agree

airmailrpl: -

2 days 12 hrs

13 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +2

intersection of Thirty-third and Third streets

Explanation:
intersection of Thirty-third and Third streets

Back at that Brooklyn accent, the standard example is the pronunciation "Toidy- Toid and Toid" for the intersection of Thirty-third and Third streets. In truth, this particular "sound" is nearly extinct in New York. This sort of speech was so mercilessly parodied in movies, radio and TV that it came to be stigmatized as a badge of low breeding and lack of sophistication. Ironically, in an attempt to correct their pronunciation of "oi" in phrases like "Toidy-toid," many New Yorkers carried the process too far (a process linguists call "hypercorrection"). Today it's common to hear Brooklynites pronounce the word "toilet" as "terlet," and while you Bostonians may "boil" an egg, in Brooklyn they "berl" it.

Reference: http://www.word-detective.com/back-m.html

Anne Spitzmueller
Germany
Local time: 11:40
Native speaker of:

German

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English translation: Thirty-third and Third Avenue (New York)

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