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wave goodbye

Italian translation: diedero l\'addio

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
English term or phrase:waved goodbye (poetic)
Italian translation:diedero l\'addio
Entered by: Kristel Kiesel
Options:
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07:54 Dec 22, 2010
English to Italian translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature
English term or phrase: wave goodbye
The context is from a poem about immigrants to America from Umbria:

I seek their faces
the ones that surrounded me in love
the ones that waved goodbye
to the hills of my grandfather's Italy
that left behind their lives
and crossed the twentieth century

From another translator:

cerco le faccie
di chi mi circonda con amore
quelli che ti salutano
sulle colline dei miei nonni italiani
che lasciarono le loro vite indietro
e attraversarono il ventesimo secolo

The client prefers to keep the tenses more consistent with the English, and prefers not to use "ti" as the object of "salutano," either, since there was no such pronoun in the original.

How do you wave goodbye to hills in Italian? Is there a good figurative way to say this?
Kristel Kiesel
United States
Local time: 03:45
diedero l'addio alle colline
Explanation:
The object here is the hills, not a generic "tu", so I think you should make it clear. Also, I think it's ADDIO rather than ARRIVEDERCI.

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Note added at 17 mins (2010-12-22 08:11:09 GMT)
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PS: All the verbs should be translated in the past (except 'seek') , so not 'circonda' ma 'circondava(no)', etc.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 38 mins (2010-12-22 08:32:37 GMT)
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Yes Kristel, you are absolutely right!

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Note added at 53 mins (2010-12-22 08:47:37 GMT)
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Kristel, yes, absolutely: if you use "salutava" it means it's a repeated action while it happened only once, you can only say 'addio' once! So I'm definitely with you on that, use the passato remoto for 'wave goodbye' and the imperfetto for 'circondava'. Using the present would be a serious mistake, as it clearly refers to the past. The only present verb is 'seek'. Hope this helps :-)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 days (2010-12-28 08:28:06 GMT) Post-grading
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Thank you, Kristel, I'm always glad to help! I love literature, and one day I hope I'll be able to translate it as well - don't take me wrong, I love translating other texts too, but literature is my dream! :-)
Thank you again and Happy New Year from Italy :-)
Selected response from:

Sara Maghini
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:45
Grading comment
Grazie, Sara! I chose this one based partially on peer agreement, and partially on the beautiful sound and suitable meaning of the words. They will fit very nicely into this poem. Thank you, also, for responding to all my questions. Other suggestions for the rest of the poem are being taken into account, as well. I thank you all for the helpfulness of your comments.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +7diedero l'addio alle colline
Sara Maghini
4 +3che dissero addio alle colline
Alessandra Martelli
3 +3si separavano (per sempre) dalle /si congedavano dalle / salutavano per sempre /
Laura Cattaneo
4dissero (a forza) addio
BdiL
3 +1salutavano con la mano (le colline)
Paola Battagliarini
3 -1danno l'arrivederci
Alice Tesconi


Discussion entries: 4





  

Answers


10 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
danno l'arrivederci


Explanation:
dare l'arrivederci

Alice Tesconi
Italy
Local time: 09:45
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Sara Maghini: Più che un arrivederci è un addio, e il tempo è il passato remoto, non il presente ;-) RISP: figurati, non servono scuse :-))
1 hr
  -> Hai perfettamente ragione...sorry!
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13 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
che dissero addio alle colline


Explanation:
che dissero addio alle colline / che salutarono le colline

The action of waving goodbye here it is not towards a person, but towards the hills itself (reminds a bit of the "Addio ai monti" which can be found in the "Promessi sposi", when Lucia waves goodbye to the places she has been lived in since she was born), so this would be:

I seek their faces
the ones that surrounded me in love
*coloro che salutarono/dissero addio
alle colline dell'Italia etc.*

Hope this helps!

Alessandra Martelli
Italy
Local time: 09:45
Native speaker of: Italian
PRO pts in category: 27
Notes to answerer
Asker: Grazie, Alessandra. "Salutarono le colline" was my instinct, too.

Asker: @Barbara: agreed. There have been some beautiful suggestions made here. As for the need for editing, I am working on that to an extent, though I am certainly limited since I am not a native speaker. I have cleaned up as much of this as I can, including misspellings, mistranslations, erratic tense changes (also a problem in the English original), and a couple of skipped lines for which I have given a literal and provisional translation. I have given it my best, but the client knows that the translation will need work beyond what I can provide. The next person to work on these poems will certainly be a native speaker.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Ada Gianfreda: preferisco "che dissero addio alle colline"
2 hrs

agree  Barbara Carrara: con Ada. Mi pare che tra le proposte sia la quella più adatta alla composizione. Kristel: this really needs a thorough editing.
3 hrs

agree  Science451
3 hrs
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13 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
salutavano con la mano (le colline)


Explanation:
NB the plural of faccia is facce

Paola Battagliarini
Italy
Local time: 09:45
Native speaker of: Italian
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thank you for the correction! I just discovered that every draft contains that misspelling!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Giuseppe Bellone: Questa conserva il movimento della mano che tanto spesso vediamo nei film sugli emigranti. :)
1 hr
  -> Grazie MisterBeppe

neutral  Sara Maghini: MisterBeppe, secondo me però si rischia di aggiungere un significato che non è detto ci fosse...e di dare un'immagine di "bambini che fanno ciao ciao con la manina"...non so, mi sembra che tolga poeticità, ma i gusti sono gusti ;-)
1 hr
  -> Ciao Sara, è certamente questione di gusti, ma a me il movimento della mano dà un'idea di spaesamento, di persone che si trovano in una situazione (il dover emigrare) più grande di loro..solo un'impressione personale ovviamente!
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14 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
si separavano (per sempre) dalle /si congedavano dalle / salutavano per sempre /


Explanation:
qualche idea
aggiungerei il concetto di *per sempre* al posto di *arrivederci* perché si tratta di un viaggio senza ritorno

Laura Cattaneo
Italy
Local time: 09:45
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: That is a very useful suggestion. I will run it by the client. I think he will like it, too.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Claudia Caboi
28 mins
  -> grazie Claudia

agree  Elena Zanetti
1 hr
  -> grazie Elena

agree  Zerlina
4 hrs
  -> grazie mille
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
waved goodbye
dissero (a forza) addio


Explanation:
Noto che altri colleghi hanno fatto osservazioni preziose all'asker e, per brevità e fidente nelle capacità dell'asker, traduco (tutto).

Cerco le facce
di quelli che mi circondarono d'amore,
di quelli che dissero (*) addio
alle colline di quell'Italia del nonno
e abbandonarono la loro esistenza
per tramutarla al ventesimo secolo.

(*) = "a forza" non c'è letteralmente nel testo-fonte ma c'è nel senso della poesia, nella tristezza del gesto di andar su e giù con la mano in un gesto "stordito" dal rimpianto.

Once again, I'd like to stress that, contrary to appearence, what comes before (and, with lesser strength, after) would help, IMHO.

Enjoy your job, Kristel! Maurizio


    Reference: http://www.treccani.it/Portale/elements/categoriesItems.jsp?...
BdiL
Italy
Local time: 09:45
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Italian
PRO pts in category: 14
Notes to answerer
Asker: Grazie, Maurizio! Your observations are always helpful.

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

15 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +7
diedero l'addio alle colline


Explanation:
The object here is the hills, not a generic "tu", so I think you should make it clear. Also, I think it's ADDIO rather than ARRIVEDERCI.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 17 mins (2010-12-22 08:11:09 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

PS: All the verbs should be translated in the past (except 'seek') , so not 'circonda' ma 'circondava(no)', etc.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 38 mins (2010-12-22 08:32:37 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Yes Kristel, you are absolutely right!

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 53 mins (2010-12-22 08:47:37 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Kristel, yes, absolutely: if you use "salutava" it means it's a repeated action while it happened only once, you can only say 'addio' once! So I'm definitely with you on that, use the passato remoto for 'wave goodbye' and the imperfetto for 'circondava'. Using the present would be a serious mistake, as it clearly refers to the past. The only present verb is 'seek'. Hope this helps :-)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 days (2010-12-28 08:28:06 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thank you, Kristel, I'm always glad to help! I love literature, and one day I hope I'll be able to translate it as well - don't take me wrong, I love translating other texts too, but literature is my dream! :-)
Thank you again and Happy New Year from Italy :-)

Sara Maghini
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:45
Works in field
Native speaker of: Italian
PRO pts in category: 58
Grading comment
Grazie, Sara! I chose this one based partially on peer agreement, and partially on the beautiful sound and suitable meaning of the words. They will fit very nicely into this poem. Thank you, also, for responding to all my questions. Other suggestions for the rest of the poem are being taken into account, as well. I thank you all for the helpfulness of your comments.
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thank you, Sara, this is helpful. I was not a fan of the "tu," either! Besides I think that "tu" is used generically much more often in English than in Italian - am I right? I felt like this "tu" in Italian wanted to refer to someone specific, but there isn't any "you" at all in the poem.

Asker: "Tu" together with the present tense also seems to impart a dreamlike state, when really this poem is describing events in a community's history.

Asker: Thanks, Sara! Now can you tell me if I have to use the passato remoto with "wave goodbye"? To me it only makes sense, since the two verbs following it happened later, and they both used the passato remoto. I have every intention of using "circondava" rather than "circonda."

Asker: Well, this is wonderful. I thought perhaps I was being too picky, but apparently I was not. I felt very much at odds with "circonda", "tu" and "salutano." Thank you for the very thorough explanation and the great suggestion for translation. Knowing my client, he may be looking for something that describes a silent action rather than speech. I know he wants to reflect the affection that the immigrants had for their homeland. We'll see what he decides.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  missdutch: scorre lirica e armoniosa; però non ne posso più di "votarti";-)
33 mins
  -> hahaha, mi fai sempre ridere, missdutch!! Grazie mille, ancora una volta! Ti farò un regalo per Natale, dai! Un testo da revisionare?? lol

agree  Maria Francesca Gangemi
1 hr
  -> Grazie Francesca!

agree  Giuseppe Bellone: Bella per la sintesi. :)
1 hr
  -> Grazie MisterBeppe :-)

agree  SYLVY75
3 hrs
  -> Grazie SYLVY75!

agree  Science451
3 hrs
  -> Grazie Science451!

agree  Zerlina
4 hrs
  -> Grazie Zerlina!

agree  Acubens
7 hrs
  -> Grazie Acubens!
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