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parent's name

Spanish translation: (nombre de la) figura parental

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
English term or phrase:parent's name
Spanish translation:(nombre de la) figura parental
Entered by: Charles Davis
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21:11 Nov 16, 2013
English to Spanish translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Certificates, Diplomas, Licenses, CVs / General / Conversation
English term or phrase: parent's name
Context:
This comes from a NYC certificate of birth:
MOTHER/PARENT'S NAME: x x x
FATHER/PARENT'S NAME: x x x

I'm not sure what to do with this.
Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Dariusz Saczuk
United States
Local time: 02:46
figura parental
Explanation:
This is the only viable solution I have seen for the otherwise impossible problem of how to render "parent" without using the words "padre" or "madre".

I don't think "parent" here has anything to do with a distinction between the birth mother/father and an adoptive mother/father or stepfather/stepmother. The word "parent" legally embraces all these categories. I think it is to do with non-gendered language. This will depend on how recent this birth certificate is, but my guess is that it must be pretty recent.

There are various reports in the press about the adoption of non-gendered language in relation to parenthood in the US. Here's one about the State Department:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2011/01/u-s-passp...

The reason for this must presumably have something to do with same-sex couples having children. Both are parents; one may be a birth parent though it's possible that neither is. But if, say, a married lesbian couple register a birth of a child of whom one is the birth mother, the other is not the father; she is "parent 2".

Anyway, I believe that's what this is about, and that the only way of handling it is to find a term corresponding to parent, which could apply to either sex and implies neither. "Figura parental" could fit the bill. It's a pretty common expression.

I have to acknowledge that I got it from an answer to this previous question:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english_to_spanish/other/68066-par...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2013-11-16 22:32:53 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

So you'd put
NOMBRE DE LA MADRE/FIGURA PARENTAL:
NOMBRE DEL PADRE/FIGURA PARENTAL:

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2013-11-17 02:16:41 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

It is not that "mother/parent" or "father/parent" mean something different from "mother" or "father". The letter cited by Wolf617 begins "Dear New Mother/Parent (woman giving birth)". But we cannot conclude from this that the expression "mother/parent" means "birth mother". If you look through the whole of that document, you will see that "mother/parent" and "father/parent" are systematically used instead "mother" and "father".

So why add "parent"? Why not just put "mother" and "father"? Because, as I have said, once you have same-sex marriages (which are legal in New York State; see http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/LAWSSEAF.cgi?QUERYTYPE=LAW...$$DOM10-A$$@TXDOM010-A+&LIST=LAW+&BROWSER=BROWSER+&TOKEN=33328720+&TARGET=VIEW ), you will have same-sex married couples registering births, and that means you will have "mothers" who are male and "fathers" who are female. In this situation, the unqualified use of these normal terms, which are inherently female and male respectively, is deemed to be inappropriate, and "parent" is added to acknowledge that a "mother" or "father" could be of either sex.

Here's a legal article on the implications of this new situation on the use of the terms "mother" and "parent":

"In the same year, Alison D. asked the New York Court of Appeals to declare her the "parent" of a child whom she and her lesbian partner, the biological mother, had together raised from its infancy."
http://ilj.law.indiana.edu/articles/69/69_4_Rassam.pdf

The same is happening, by the way, in the UK. Here's a form from Scotland for a "declaration from the father/parent of a child". "Father/parent" here doesn't mean father or mother, because the mother is referred to separately lower down; it means the father or person (male or female) fulfilling the role of the father.
http://www.gro-scotland.gov.uk/files2/registration/form-27.p...

It's happening in Australia too; see section 5 of this form:
http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0007/74...

The whole point, therefore, is that to reflect this in translation a term must be found for "parent" that is not gendered. That is not true of "padre", because, despite what Wolf says, it does not mean either parent in the singular; it means "parents" in the plural ("9. m. pl. El padre y la madre"). Nor is it true of "progenitor", because that refers to a male parent; it has a female form, "progenitora".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days3 hrs (2013-11-19 00:34:50 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

For future reference: my NY Laws link doesn't work. If you want to see the statute, go to
http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/MENUGETF.cgi?COMMONQUERY=L...
Click on DOM for Domestic Relations, then on Title 1 under Article 5-A, then on 75-A: Definitions.
Selected response from:

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 08:46
Grading comment
Thank you, Charles. :-)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
3 +4figura parental
Charles Davis
4 +1nombre del padrastro/madrastraSara Ruiz
4 +1Nombre del padre/progenitor
Fernando J. de Vicente Gómez
3 +1Ver explicaciónWolf617
4nombre de los abuelos paternos/ nombre de los abuelos maternos
M Elena


  

Answers


23 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
nombre del padrastro/madrastra


Explanation:
La cosa es que según la página ésta, lo de parent se refiere a cuando la mujer se casa con un hombre o una mujer en el embarazo o después, pero no es con el padre biológico... bueno un lío, porque admiten unas cuantas opciones. Así que cualquier persona que se case con la madre no siendo el padre biológico, es el padrastro o la madrastra.


    Reference: http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/html/services/vr-add-parent.shtm...
Sara Ruiz
Spain
Local time: 08:46
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Carlos Blanco, B.Sc. in Chemistry: parent is generic and yes it includes a non biological parent that is padrastro/madrasta. I would leave as nombre de la madre/madrasta, etc. Parent also include same sex parents. I also agree with Davis so you have your pick although I like yours more
4 hrs
  -> thanks

agree  Emiliano Pantoja
19 hrs
  -> thanks

disagree  Phoenix III: This is a birth Certificate and it is about who fathered and who gave birth. Everything else is off limits.
1 day1 hr
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Ver explicación


Explanation:
En http://www.nyc.gov/html/doh/downloads/pdf/vs/VR203-web.pdf, que es un formulario para el Departamento de Salud de Nueva York, comienza diciendo:

Dear New Mother/Parent (woman giving birth)

Por lo tanto para "mother/parent's name" corresponde "Nombre de la mujer que dio a luz".

Es más complicado lo de "father/parent's name". No hay en ese formulario una descripción equivalente, pero en los datos a consignar hay una casilla para consignar su género.

Por suerte, en español al hablar de "padres" nos referimos tanto a varones como a mujeres: "sus padres son Carlos y María". En el DRAE figura, como una de las acepciones para padre: "El padre y la madre".

Por lo tanto creo que podrías usar: "Nombre de la mujer que dio a luz" y "Nombre del otro padre", sin necesidad de justificar en este renglón si se trata de un varón o una mujer.

Wolf617
Argentina
Local time: 03:46
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Phoenix III
22 hrs
  -> Gracias, Phoenix
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Nombre del padre/progenitor


Explanation:
This is a Birth Certificate. In a birth certificate you do not specify the padrastros o madrastras of anybody. You specify the parents. Exclusively. Because that document makes reference to the biological ancestors of somebody, not who is legally that person's father or mother.
I am from Spain, my aunt is a single mom and she's been ever since she got pregnant and i'm pretty sure that when my cousine was born she was forced by law to write a name under the father category but they told her she could write a fake name if she didn't want to use the father's real name.
So my answer to you is:
NOMBRE DE LA MADRE/PROGENITOR:
NOMBRE DEL PADRE/PROGENITOR:

Fernando J. de Vicente Gómez
Spain
Local time: 08:46
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Andrea Botta
22 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

17 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
nombre de los abuelos paternos/ nombre de los abuelos maternos


Explanation:
Es lo que entiendo hace referencia no a los datos de la madre o padre sino a los apellidos/nombre por parte de la madre (abuelo/abuela materna) y del padre (abuelo/abuela paternas)

Mother/parent's name = nombre de los padres maternos (abuelo y abuela por parte de madre)
Fahter / parent's name = nombre de los padres paternos (abuelo y abuela por parte de padre)

Suerte.

M Elena
Belgium
Local time: 08:46
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Spanish
PRO pts in category: 30
Notes to answerer
Asker: Nope, M Elena. This has nothing to do with the grandparents.

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +4
figura parental


Explanation:
This is the only viable solution I have seen for the otherwise impossible problem of how to render "parent" without using the words "padre" or "madre".

I don't think "parent" here has anything to do with a distinction between the birth mother/father and an adoptive mother/father or stepfather/stepmother. The word "parent" legally embraces all these categories. I think it is to do with non-gendered language. This will depend on how recent this birth certificate is, but my guess is that it must be pretty recent.

There are various reports in the press about the adoption of non-gendered language in relation to parenthood in the US. Here's one about the State Department:
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2011/01/u-s-passp...

The reason for this must presumably have something to do with same-sex couples having children. Both are parents; one may be a birth parent though it's possible that neither is. But if, say, a married lesbian couple register a birth of a child of whom one is the birth mother, the other is not the father; she is "parent 2".

Anyway, I believe that's what this is about, and that the only way of handling it is to find a term corresponding to parent, which could apply to either sex and implies neither. "Figura parental" could fit the bill. It's a pretty common expression.

I have to acknowledge that I got it from an answer to this previous question:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/english_to_spanish/other/68066-par...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2013-11-16 22:32:53 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

So you'd put
NOMBRE DE LA MADRE/FIGURA PARENTAL:
NOMBRE DEL PADRE/FIGURA PARENTAL:

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 5 hrs (2013-11-17 02:16:41 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

It is not that "mother/parent" or "father/parent" mean something different from "mother" or "father". The letter cited by Wolf617 begins "Dear New Mother/Parent (woman giving birth)". But we cannot conclude from this that the expression "mother/parent" means "birth mother". If you look through the whole of that document, you will see that "mother/parent" and "father/parent" are systematically used instead "mother" and "father".

So why add "parent"? Why not just put "mother" and "father"? Because, as I have said, once you have same-sex marriages (which are legal in New York State; see http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/LAWSSEAF.cgi?QUERYTYPE=LAW...$$DOM10-A$$@TXDOM010-A+&LIST=LAW+&BROWSER=BROWSER+&TOKEN=33328720+&TARGET=VIEW ), you will have same-sex married couples registering births, and that means you will have "mothers" who are male and "fathers" who are female. In this situation, the unqualified use of these normal terms, which are inherently female and male respectively, is deemed to be inappropriate, and "parent" is added to acknowledge that a "mother" or "father" could be of either sex.

Here's a legal article on the implications of this new situation on the use of the terms "mother" and "parent":

"In the same year, Alison D. asked the New York Court of Appeals to declare her the "parent" of a child whom she and her lesbian partner, the biological mother, had together raised from its infancy."
http://ilj.law.indiana.edu/articles/69/69_4_Rassam.pdf

The same is happening, by the way, in the UK. Here's a form from Scotland for a "declaration from the father/parent of a child". "Father/parent" here doesn't mean father or mother, because the mother is referred to separately lower down; it means the father or person (male or female) fulfilling the role of the father.
http://www.gro-scotland.gov.uk/files2/registration/form-27.p...

It's happening in Australia too; see section 5 of this form:
http://www.justice.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0007/74...

The whole point, therefore, is that to reflect this in translation a term must be found for "parent" that is not gendered. That is not true of "padre", because, despite what Wolf says, it does not mean either parent in the singular; it means "parents" in the plural ("9. m. pl. El padre y la madre"). Nor is it true of "progenitor", because that refers to a male parent; it has a female form, "progenitora".

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days3 hrs (2013-11-19 00:34:50 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

For future reference: my NY Laws link doesn't work. If you want to see the statute, go to
http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/MENUGETF.cgi?COMMONQUERY=L...
Click on DOM for Domestic Relations, then on Title 1 under Article 5-A, then on 75-A: Definitions.

Charles Davis
Spain
Local time: 08:46
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 180
Grading comment
Thank you, Charles. :-)
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thank you, Charles. This is the latest - politically correct - form.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Carlos Blanco, B.Sc. in Chemistry: I would say it does. In this new world of political correctness in which people find it offensive to be called what they are in many forms in the US it asks for parent's name instead of father's or mother's not to leave out stepparents & same sex parents
3 hrs
  -> Thank you, Carlos! I am sure that the real point is same sex parents. The word "parent" legally means a biological or adoptive parent. It does not legally refer to a stepparent unless that stepparent has adopted the child.

agree  Rosa Paredes
4 hrs
  -> Thanks, Rosa :)

agree  Mónica Algazi
13 hrs
  -> Gracias, Mónica :)

agree  Catarina Lopes
13 hrs
  -> Gracias, Ana :)
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Changes made by editors
Nov 19, 2013 - Changes made by Charles Davis:
Created KOG entryKudoZ term » KOG term


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