This site uses cookies. Some of these cookies are essential to the operation of the site, while others help to improve your experience by providing insights into how the site is being used. For more information, please see the ProZ.com privacy policy.
Cookie settings
  1. KudoZ™ Top
  2. French to English
  3. History

boites à chefs

English translation: skull coffins

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:boites à chefs
English translation:skull coffins
Entered by: Miranda Joubioux (X)

10:06 Jul 28, 2008
French to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - History
French term or phrase: boites à chefs
Text relating to a church dating from the 16th c. and restored in the 18th c.

Elle renferme des trésors : autels du 18ème siècle dont un finement sculpté ; des statues anciennes, des tombes de templiers incrustées dans le dallage de la nef, et un ensemble de boites à chefs, reliquaires en bois situés sous le porche sud.

There is no further context or information.
This is for a "heritage" database for a tourist board.
Miranda Joubioux (X)
Local time: 11:54
skull coffins
Explanation:
Rummaging on a few word-combinations in Google Books brought me to this passage in a C19 travel book: "The small town of St. Pol de Leon boasts of one of the largest cathedrals in Brittany ; where also Mr. Weld observed the
skulls of many of the old bishops, in their strange-looking skull coffins, ranged on the ledges and cornices of the altars in tbe small chapels around the church."

Having now seen the phrase, I'm almost tempted to say "il fallait y penser" ... but that was another question.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 days (2008-08-04 10:19:43 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thanks Miranda! I'll look to see if there are any such boîtes to be found on the other side of Brittany (Morbihan) later this month.
Selected response from:

Martin Cassell
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:54
Grading comment
I like this answer, because it says what it is, so the tourist knows what to expect. However, I would like to thank Christopher for all his references and such constructive remarks. I have explained this term pretty much on the lines of your last suggestion. Thanks to everyone - Nice to see this kind of well argued, constructive Kudoz answer!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +2skull coffins
Martin Cassell
3 +2reliquary boxes (containing skulls)
Martin Cassell
4 +1reliquary chests
Helen Shiner
2 +2head reliquaries
Christopher Crockett


Discussion entries: 9





  

Answers


19 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
reliquary boxes (containing skulls)


Explanation:
This is chef=tête (latin caput).

There might possibly be a more specific EN term for these boxes but I haven't come across it ...

"Dans le déambulatoire, à droite, derrière une grille, un ensemble de 34 boîtes à chef en bois, contenant le crane de défunts"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 22 mins (2008-07-28 10:28:42 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I think it's "chiefly" a Breton thing.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs (2008-07-28 18:19:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Hmmm. First time I've ever overridden myself with a new answer!


    Reference: http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cath%C3%A9drale_Saint-Paul-Aur%...
Martin Cassell
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:54
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Melzie: http://www.chez.com/t3m/tab-guerchin-et-in-arcadia-ego.htm http://www.genealogie22.org/fr/2005-Promenade-en-Goelo-de-Pl... - head reliquary was the nearest I could think of. A 'couvre chef' for the great and good.
13 mins
  -> thanks Melzie. From what I recall from visits, they're generally relatively small, being for skull only, which is why I went for 'box' rather than 'chest'.
agree  Helen Shiner: Likewise
6 hrs
  -> thanks Helen // except that now I've suggested a different answer!
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

32 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
reliquary chests


Explanation:
This what sprang to my mind. I presume that in this case, it contains the bones/heads [skulls] of eminent people. I don't find any reference to this elsewhere on the net, so perhaps a regional thing or even just related to the church in question.

"Among the numerous objects of interest preserved here, notice a wooden reliquary chest decorated in colour..."
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=tR8gKJdBXA8C&pg=PA506&lpg...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 33 mins (2008-07-28 10:40:16 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Ok, saw Martin's suggestion after posting mine - great minds and all that!

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs (2008-07-28 18:22:48 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

A general explanation of the various kinds of reliquary can be found at:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reliquary

...if there is any need to add any further information....

Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:54
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 32

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Martin Cassell: ... se rencontrent, indeed.
6 hrs
  -> Thanks, Martin; I guess we're all right really, it's just the fine-tuning now
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +2
head reliquaries


Explanation:
Normally, reliquaries which contain a specific body part can be called by that part --there are arm reliquaries, hand reliquaries, foot reliquaries, head reliquaries, and they are usually in the form of the anatomical member they enclose. The most spectacular of those have a wood core which is covered with silver or gold:

http://www.clevelandart.org/exhibcef/ConsExhib/html/wotar.ht...

http://www.flickr.com/photos/testpatern/70916129/

http://www.mondes-normands.caen.fr/angleterre/archeo/Italie/...

http://www.metmuseum.org/special/basel_cathedral/10.r.htm

http://www.metmuseum.org/special/basel_cathedral/10.r.htm


http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Head_reliquary_Marti...

http://flickr.com/photos/xtinalamb/2314389864/

http://instructional1.calstatela.edu/bevans/Art101/Art101B-8...

http://rubens.anu.edu.au/htdocs/surveys/charlotte/byartist/d... --upper left image

http://dollybellespeepshow.typepad.com/dollybelles_peepshow/...

etc.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="head reliquary"

though a "head reliquary" doesn't have to be in the form of a head:

http://www.wga.hu/frames-e.html?/html/zzdeco/1gold/12c/14g_1...


but the pic of one of these Breton ones from Melzie's site

http://www.genealogie22.org/fr/IMG/jpg/Redimensionnement_de_...

shows that, in this region (and peculiar to it, as far as I am aware), the custom is to place the skull relic in, literally, a box.

So using "head reliquary," while literally true, might be somewhat confusing.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2008-07-28 13:01:28 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

It seems to me that, strictly speaking, "reliquary" applies to containers for the remains of *saints*, and are, typically, place on altars (or, sometimes, built into them).

However, these Breton ones seem to be repositories for the head(s) (only) of revered personages who are not saints --local fellows of notable piety, perhaps-- and are much more informally "situés sous le porche sud."

"A collection of small wooden caskets containing skulls, situated under the south porch" perhaps.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day2 hrs (2008-07-29 13:05:55 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Since "head reliquary" invokes a certain [cranialical] form which the reliquary itself takes, Martin's second suggestion, "skull coffins," would be preferable, *provided* this obscure term (who's every seen it before??) is accompanied by an explanation: "small wooden caskets containing skulls, peculiar to the region" or somesuchlike expansion.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2008-07-29 13:22:09 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Re Martin's point about the appropriatness of "the full academic footnote treatment," I agree. But the true "heritage" of any given region is nothing if not *made up* of curious customs and artifacts peculiar to that region (and, therefore, unknown to tourists alien to it).

For "...et un ensemble de boites à chefs, reliquaires en bois situés sous le porche sud" how about:

"...and, under the south porch, a collection of what we might call 'skull coffins,' curious wooden 'reliquaries' containing the skulls of revered local personages."

?

Christopher Crockett
Local time: 05:54
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 100

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Yolanda Broad
10 mins
  -> Thanks, Yolanda.
agree  Helen Shiner: Convincingly argued - you're the man to know
4 hrs
  -> Thanks, Helen. But Martin might be on to something.
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
skull coffins


Explanation:
Rummaging on a few word-combinations in Google Books brought me to this passage in a C19 travel book: "The small town of St. Pol de Leon boasts of one of the largest cathedrals in Brittany ; where also Mr. Weld observed the
skulls of many of the old bishops, in their strange-looking skull coffins, ranged on the ledges and cornices of the altars in tbe small chapels around the church."

Having now seen the phrase, I'm almost tempted to say "il fallait y penser" ... but that was another question.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 7 days (2008-08-04 10:19:43 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Thanks Miranda! I'll look to see if there are any such boîtes to be found on the other side of Brittany (Morbihan) later this month.


    Reference: http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=FAq7Fa22SB8C&pg=RA1-PA604...
Martin Cassell
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:54
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 16
Grading comment
I like this answer, because it says what it is, so the tourist knows what to expect. However, I would like to thank Christopher for all his references and such constructive remarks. I have explained this term pretty much on the lines of your last suggestion. Thanks to everyone - Nice to see this kind of well argued, constructive Kudoz answer!

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Helen Shiner: Having agreed with with all suggestions, can I say I agree with this one even more. Very evocative, even if one of the first things I found when checking up was this:http://www.gourmetsleuth.com/sugarskullsdecorating.htm !!
6 mins
  -> thanks (again) Helen. I know, some of the gHits are really lurid !!
agree  Christopher Crockett: This might work, if it were in quotes and accompanied by an explanation --it's not a commonly seen term, needless to say.
18 hrs
  -> thanks Christopher. Not sure Miranda's clients would want, or have space for, the full academic footnote treatment, though: but a little succinct exegesis might arguably be apposite [it might be worth adding a quick explanation ;-) ]
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs (or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.

Return to KudoZ list

KudoZ™ translation help

The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.

See also:
ProZ.com term search
Search millions of term translations
Close search
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search