monnayage

English translation: subdivisions

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:monnayage
English translation:subdivisions
Entered by: Gayle Wallimann

20:23 Apr 27, 2005
French to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Music
French term or phrase: monnayage
List of contexts:
"un vers de 7 amphimacres (le 2e et le 4e étant entièrement monnayés en brèves, le 7e étant monnayé en pyrrhique plus iambe)"
"...une hexapodie cretique et une dipodie crétique (toutes avec monnayages)"
"enfin une pentapodie crétique (avec monnayages)"
"dochmiaque entièrement monnayé (dissolution des longues)"
"en y ajoutant le monnayage (déjà pratiqué par les Grecs sous le nom de dissolution), et qui sera pour moi la division en durées plus petites des longues et mème des brèves"
"epitrite presque entièrement monnayé en double croches"

It's from a musicology book written in a highly idiosyncratic (and abstruse) style. It deals with the interpretation of Greek tragedies, so you never know whether the author refers to syllables or musical notes.
Sometimes I've translated 'monnayage' as 'conversion', and 'monnayé(e)' as 'converted', but it doesn't work in all contexts.
Dictionaries were useless in this case. Could you please help me out?
Don't worry about foot names like 'amphimacre', 'pyrrhique', and 'epitrite', I know what they are and I'm perfectly confident about the translation. But it's the beastly monnayage that I don't understand! I’ve asked two musicologists, one of whom is French, and they have no idea, either. Here’s the French musicologist’s comment: “I think 'monnayage' is just a division, and conversion about values in music.”
Any indication would be much appreciated.
Ioana Costache
Romania
subdivided/subdivisions
Explanation:
Hi Ioana,
When I saw your question the first thing that came into my mind was subdivision of beats - Anna's link takes you to an illustration of the subdivision of musical note values. However I'm not entirely sure this fits your text.

I don't know whether "subdivision" would work at all in your context (I've studied feet in the past but Greek tragedies aren't my speciality!) so I'm just throwing this around as an idea. I'm afraid I'm short of time so can't look into it any more, but I found this link quite interesting - sorry if it isn't much help!:

http://library.beau.org/gutenberg/1/0/6/7/10671/10671-8.txt
The _common time_ of musicians is divided into bars, each of which
contains four crotchets, or a proportional number of their subdivision
into quavers and semiquavers. This kind of musical time is analogous to
the dactyle verses of our language, the most popular instances of which
are in Mr. Anstie's Bath-Guide. In this kind of verse the bar does not
begin till after the first or second syllable; and where the verse is
quite complete, and written by a good ear, these first syllables added to
the last complete the bar, exactly in this also corresponding with many
pieces of music;

_2_ Yet ? if one may guess by the ? size of his calf, Sir,
4 He ? weighs about twenty-three ? stone and a half, Sir.

_2_ Master ? Mamozet's head was not ? finished so soon,
4 For it ? took up the barber a ? whole afternoon.

In these lines each bar consists of a crotchet, two quavers, another
crotchet, and two more quavers: which are equal to four crotchets, and,
like many bars of _common time_ in music, may be subdivided into two in
beating time without disturbing the measure.


Selected response from:

Amy Williams
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:40
Grading comment
If only I could award more points... :)
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4coining
Anna Maria Augustine at proZ.com (X)
2 +1subdivided/subdivisions
Amy Williams
3broken down into
sarahl (X)


Discussion entries: 7





  

Answers


7 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
broken down into


Explanation:
or units used if you need a noun. HTH

sarahl (X)
Local time: 15:40
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 3
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7 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
coining


Explanation:
coining

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 10 mins (2005-04-27 20:33:56 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Here it is explained for music:


http://216.239.39.104/translate_c?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://www.b...

Anna Maria Augustine at proZ.com (X)
France
Local time: 00:40
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 4
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +1
subdivided/subdivisions


Explanation:
Hi Ioana,
When I saw your question the first thing that came into my mind was subdivision of beats - Anna's link takes you to an illustration of the subdivision of musical note values. However I'm not entirely sure this fits your text.

I don't know whether "subdivision" would work at all in your context (I've studied feet in the past but Greek tragedies aren't my speciality!) so I'm just throwing this around as an idea. I'm afraid I'm short of time so can't look into it any more, but I found this link quite interesting - sorry if it isn't much help!:

http://library.beau.org/gutenberg/1/0/6/7/10671/10671-8.txt
The _common time_ of musicians is divided into bars, each of which
contains four crotchets, or a proportional number of their subdivision
into quavers and semiquavers. This kind of musical time is analogous to
the dactyle verses of our language, the most popular instances of which
are in Mr. Anstie's Bath-Guide. In this kind of verse the bar does not
begin till after the first or second syllable; and where the verse is
quite complete, and written by a good ear, these first syllables added to
the last complete the bar, exactly in this also corresponding with many
pieces of music;

_2_ Yet ? if one may guess by the ? size of his calf, Sir,
4 He ? weighs about twenty-three ? stone and a half, Sir.

_2_ Master ? Mamozet's head was not ? finished so soon,
4 For it ? took up the barber a ? whole afternoon.

In these lines each bar consists of a crotchet, two quavers, another
crotchet, and two more quavers: which are equal to four crotchets, and,
like many bars of _common time_ in music, may be subdivided into two in
beating time without disturbing the measure.





    Reference: http://library.beau.org/gutenberg/1/0/6/7/10671/10671-8.txt
Amy Williams
United Kingdom
Local time: 23:40
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 32
Grading comment
If only I could award more points... :)

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Anna Maria Augustine at proZ.com (X)
12 mins
  -> thanks Anna :)
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