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matériellement vérifiables

English translation: based on verifiable facts

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15:22 Nov 22, 2013
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
French term or phrase: matériellement vérifiables
This is taken from a court of cassation decision on the content of letters of dismissal:

"Les griefs contenus dans le courrier de licenciement doivent être précis et matériellement vérifiables".

Thanks!
Jane RM
France
Local time: 15:23
English translation:based on verifiable facts
Explanation:
The French is not very logical: it is not the grievances that should be verifiable, but the facts on which they are based.

Selected response from:

Tim Webb
France
Local time: 15:23
Grading comment
perfect, thanks
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
3 +6based on verifiable facts
Tim Webb
4 +2physically verifiable
James Emery


  

Answers


45 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +6
based on verifiable facts


Explanation:
The French is not very logical: it is not the grievances that should be verifiable, but the facts on which they are based.



Example sentence(s):
  • That Mr. Laber’s conclusions were not based on verifiable facts may have been colored by his eagerness to terminate Mr. Hare’s employment rather than by findings of fact after a reasonable investigation

    Reference: http://mn.gov/bms/documents/awards/20120521%20CHS.pdf
Tim Webb
France
Local time: 15:23
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 63
Grading comment
perfect, thanks

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  writeaway: yes, that's what I'd use as well. it even makes sense in the context and it is also one of the definitions of matériellement (in this sort of context)
1 hr

agree  James Emery: I like this too.
1 hr

agree  Gallagy
2 hrs

agree  AllegroTrans
3 hrs

agree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: A simple practical solution. The term "veracity" is a possible alternative, but that means turning the sentence around.
19 hrs

agree  Lorraine Dubuc
22 hrs
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22 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
physically verifiable


Explanation:
14,000 results on google for this, and would appear to make sense.




--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2013-11-22 17:18:11 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

How about "there must be hard evidence to support the reasons given for dismissal"..... ?

James Emery
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:23
Native speaker of: English

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  writeaway: can you show that one of the 14,000 hits actually backs the translation? it does seemingly make sense but backing an answer in legalese is always a good idea. looking at how the French is used, I have my doubts
7 mins

neutral  mchd: dans ce cas, matériellement ne veut pas dire physiquement// les conséquences d'un manquement (par ex. erreur d'enregistrement de commande) sont des preuves tangibles.
14 mins
  -> Compris, mais je vois mal comment il pourrait en être autrement dans ce cas, à moins qu'il s'agisse de fournir des justificatifs écrits...... pas évident quand on doit prouver qu'un acte a été commis ou pas.

agree  philgoddard: I think materially would be slightly better, as in supported by tangible evidence.
1 hr

agree  Gallagy: with Phil, and with "hard evidence..."
2 hrs

neutral  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: "Physically verifiable" is not sufficiently legalesy for the context. "Hard evidence" does not necessarily imply first-hand facts, which the original does imply. "Evidence" suggest the existence of facts, the original requires the facts to be verifiable.
19 hrs

neutral  Lorraine Dubuc: on parle davantage de preuves tangibles 'physically vérifiable' est trop littéral et probablement peu usité.
22 hrs
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Voters for reclassification
as
PRO / non-PRO
Non-PRO (2): philgoddard, Gallagy


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