KudoZ home » French to English » Law/Patents

régime français de la séparation de biens à défaut de contrat de marriage

English translation: Comments and explanation

Advertisement

Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs
(or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.
04:18 Sep 5, 2001
French to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents
French term or phrase: régime français de la séparation de biens à défaut de contrat de marriage
What's the meaning of the latter part of this para:
Monsieur et Madame XXX se sont mariés à OGWR (Pays de Galle - Grande-Bretagne) le 7 avril 1992, "sous le régime légal anglais assimilé au régime français de la séparation de biens à défaut de contrat de marriage; sans modifications depuis lors comme ils le déclarent."
bharg
India
Local time: 07:03
English translation:Comments and explanation
Explanation:
In England and Wales, marriage cotnracts are not common place. (It is possible to have one drawn up of course : http://www.confetti.co.uk/weddings/advice_ideas/finance_lega...
).The statutory provisions are such that without any agreemnt to the contrary, each party to the marriage comes to the marriage and leaves it, if he/she should so decide, with what he had before marrying. Anything he/she acquires during the marriage indiviaually is his/hers alone, what is acquired jointly is shared out 50/50%.

Under French statute however, when two people marry and do so without having drawn up a contract, each party throws his possessions into the common kitty. If the marriage should ever end, where there is no contract, each party can lay claim to 50% of the total value of the property of both.

Oversimplified, unless there is an indication to the contrary, this means that in the UK, each party keeps what he has always had, before, during and after marriage. In France, however, upon marriage, each party automatically looses half of his worldy goods to the other party, come what may. That is why contracts are common in France, less so in England and Wales. (In France, you can draw up a contract once you are married if you do not do so upon marriage. You can also opt for one « régime » and then opt for another if your circumstances change, for example). The large majority of young couples today in France, prefer to have a marriage contract where each keeps his/her own goods but where property acquired during the marriage are shared out 50/50. This puts them on an equal footing with their « contractless » English coutnerparts.

You have a château before getting married. In England, if you divorce, without a marriage contract, you will still have your château. In France, if you have no contract, upon divorcing, your ex nearest and dearest could thoeretically claim 50% of your château. If youwant to separate your property in France so that the situation is similar to that of England (and Wales), then you have to have a contract drawn up.

So, your extract means that the couple in question married under English law (which is similar to the French separation of property régime).

"Mr and Mrs XXX married in Ogwr (Wales, Great Britain) on 7th April 1992 under English law, whose statutory provisions are similar to the French (optional) régime under which the spouses’ property is separated. The spouses (Mr and Mrs XXX) have stated that there has been no amendment to that state of affairs since they married."


FRANCE :

http://www.lesechos.fr/patrimoine/guide/TRA54.html

Séparation de biens
Tous les biens et dettes sont propres. Il n'existe rien en commun aux deux époux, sauf :
· biens indivis, acquis par les époux ensemble,
· dettes contractées pour l'entretien du ménage et certains impôts communs (IR et taxe d'habitation, notamment).
ENGLAND & WALES :

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/marriage.as...

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

Legal formalities for getting married

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

documents you may need to produce

http://www.destination-uk.com/marriage.htm

General requirements

Selected response from:

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 02:33
Grading comment
Thanks for the wonderful explanation as well as the meaning of the para. Excellent to say the least.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Advertisement


Summary of answers provided
na +3French system[or regime] of separation of assets in the absence of a prenuptial agreement
Germaine A Hoston
na +1separation of propertyMary Lalevee
na +1separation as to property
CLS Lexi-tech
naComments and explanation
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
naComments and explanation
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
na -1Assimiliated to the French settlement based on separate ownership of property
Maya Jurt
na -4Prenuptial agreement without a marrriage contractBOB DE DENUS


  

Answers


16 mins peer agreement (net): -1
Assimiliated to the French settlement based on separate ownership of property


Explanation:
Lacking a marriage contract, they got married under the legal English marriage settlement act, assimilated to the French marriage settlement, which stipulates, when no arrangement is made, a marriage settlement based on separate ownership of property.

A bit complicated, but I think that explains it.

Maya Jurt
Switzerland
Local time: 02:33
Native speaker of: Native in GermanGerman, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 412

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: In legal English, the word "settlement" does not quite mean what you want it to mean used as it has been used here.
2 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

32 mins peer agreement (net): -4
Prenuptial agreement without a marrriage contract


Explanation:
separate estates by prenuptial agreement
séparation de biens

From the text it seems to mean that they were married under British law but although without a formal mariage contract,and that in either case both parties are still in agreement to keep the agreement unaltered
Déf. :in GDT
Régime matrimonial qui peut être adopté par contrat de mariage. Chaque époux conserve la propriété de tous les biens qu'il avait antérieurement ou qu'il acquiert par la suite; il les administre et en dispose librement. La séparation de biens peut aussi être demandée par la femme en cours de mariage, notamment si le mari dilapide ses biens; elle est prononcée par le tribunal de grande instance. Enfin la séparation de corps entraîne obligatoirement la transformation du régime existant en séparation de biens.


BOB DE DENUS
Local time: 11:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 409

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Gillian Hargreaves: No mention of prenuptial agreement
8 mins

disagree  Alexandra Hague: Isn't a prenuptial agreement the same thing as a marriage contract?
23 mins

disagree  Tony M: in my opinion, mises the point slightly
1 hr

disagree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: No, they say that the original state of affairs is unchanged. Not British law - Scotla,nd's system is different.
2 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

33 mins peer agreement (net): +1
separation as to property


Explanation:
in the absence of prenuptial contract

GDT translates it as "separation as to property" which seems to be the legal term.

Compagnie de notaires de Paris:
Property

The system is governed by paragraph 1 of Article 1536 of the French Civil Code, according to which "when spouses have stipulated in their contract or settlement that their property shall be held separately, each of them shall continue to administer, enjoy and freely dispose of his or her personal property".

http://www.paris.notaires.fr/gb/ip/rm_separ.html

assimilated to the French system of....

regards


paola l m








CLS Lexi-tech
Local time: 20:33
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in pair: 162

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Gillian Hargreaves: But beware the false friend in the 2nd link: "assimilé" should be translated "comparable" or something similar.
9 mins
  -> Thanks. yes, "comparable"
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr peer agreement (net): +3
French system[or regime] of separation of assets in the absence of a prenuptial agreement


Explanation:
In the absence of a premarital contract/prenuptial agreement, in French law, property that is separate before the marriage remains separate after marriage and the community of assets in the marriage is limited to assets gained during the marriage. ("la communauté de beins est réduite aux acquets." In fact this seems to be upheld reasonably strictly, in that the "acquets" do not include property inherited: if one partner inherits property after a marriage, that property belongs to that person alone. (You might want to verify this with exact passages from the "Traité Elémentaire de Droit Divil")
See "Dictionnaire Juridique Dahl," sv régime;
Gérard Cornu, "Vocabulaire juridique", sv régime.

In this case, I personally prefer to keep the term "regime" even in English, because it is more legalistic than the term system. But Dahl's "Dictionnaire juridique" seems to prefer the term "system" in speaking of matrimonial property law in France.

Source: Dahl, "Dictionnaire juridique", sv regime

Germaine A Hoston
Local time: 17:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 118

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tony M: Spot on!
33 mins

agree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: Yes, altho' I have Dahl and for UK law his terms are not always the ones used. My copy is 4 years old and looks new!
1 hr

agree  Katerina Strani-Jefferson: YES (although I have the feeling that the term prenuptial agreement soumarriage contract is sounds rather american)
3 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr peer agreement (net): +1
separation of property


Explanation:
It means that their marriage was subject to the English legal system applicable to marriages, which is regarded as identical to the French legal system of separation of property.

I would avoid the use of the word "assimilated" if I were you - another of those "faux amis"..
Hope this helps
Mary

Mary Lalevee
United Kingdom
Local time: 01:33
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in pair: 318

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Nikki Scott-Despaigne: Yep! Put shortly adn clearly. Good hint too on "assimilated" cf. Gillian's comments.
1 hr
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

2 hrs
Comments and explanation


Explanation:
In England and Wales, marriage cotnracts are not common place. (It is possible to have one drawn up of course : http://www.confetti.co.uk/weddings/advice_ideas/finance_lega...
).The statutory provisions are such that without any agreemnt to the contrary, each party to the marriage comes to the marriage and leaves it, if he/she should so decide, with what he had before marrying. Anything he/she acquires during the marriage indiviaually is his/hers alone, what is acquired jointly is shared out 50/50%.

Under French statute however, when two people marry and do so without having drawn up a contract, each party throws his possessions into the common kitty. If the marriage should ever end, where there is no contract, each party can lay claim to 50% of the total value of the property of both.

Oversimplified, unless there is an indication to the contrary, this means that in the UK, each party keeps what he has always had, before, during and after marriage. In France, however, upon marriage, each party automatically looses half of his worldy goods to the other party, come what may. That is why contracts are common in France, less so in England and Wales. (In France, you can draw up a contract once you are married if you do not do so upon marriage. You can also opt for one « régime » and then opt for another if your circumstances change, for example). The large majority of young couples today in France, prefer to have a marriage contract where each keeps his/her own goods but where property acquired during the marriage are shared out 50/50. This puts them on an equal footing with their « contractless » English coutnerparts.

You have a château before getting married. In England, if you divorce, without a marriage contract, you will still have your château. In France, if you have no contract, upon divorcing, your ex nearest and dearest could thoeretically claim 50% of your château. If youwant to separate your property in France so that the situation is similar to that of England (and Wales), then you have to have a contract drawn up.

So, your extract means that the couple in question married under English law (which is similar to the French separation of property régime).

"Mr and Mrs XXX married in Ogwr (Wales, Great Britain) on 7th April 1992 under English law, whose statutory provisions are similar to the French (optional) régime under which the spouses’ property is separated. The spouses (Mr and Mrs XXX) have stated that there has been no amendment to that state of affairs since they married."


FRANCE :

http://www.lesechos.fr/patrimoine/guide/TRA54.html

Séparation de biens
Tous les biens et dettes sont propres. Il n'existe rien en commun aux deux époux, sauf :
· biens indivis, acquis par les époux ensemble,
· dettes contractées pour l'entretien du ménage et certains impôts communs (IR et taxe d'habitation, notamment).
ENGLAND & WALES :

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/marriage.as...

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

Legal formalities for getting married

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

documents you may need to produce

http://www.destination-uk.com/marriage.htm

General requirements



Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 02:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 4431
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

2 hrs
Comments and explanation


Explanation:
In England and Wales, marriage cotnracts are not common place. (It is possible to have one drawn up of course : http://www.confetti.co.uk/weddings/advice_ideas/finance_lega...
).The statutory provisions are such that without any agreemnt to the contrary, each party to the marriage comes to the marriage and leaves it, if he/she should so decide, with what he had before marrying. Anything he/she acquires during the marriage indiviaually is his/hers alone, what is acquired jointly is shared out 50/50%.

Under French statute however, when two people marry and do so without having drawn up a contract, each party throws his possessions into the common kitty. If the marriage should ever end, where there is no contract, each party can lay claim to 50% of the total value of the property of both.

Oversimplified, unless there is an indication to the contrary, this means that in the UK, each party keeps what he has always had, before, during and after marriage. In France, however, upon marriage, each party automatically looses half of his worldy goods to the other party, come what may. That is why contracts are common in France, less so in England and Wales. (In France, you can draw up a contract once you are married if you do not do so upon marriage. You can also opt for one « régime » and then opt for another if your circumstances change, for example). The large majority of young couples today in France, prefer to have a marriage contract where each keeps his/her own goods but where property acquired during the marriage are shared out 50/50. This puts them on an equal footing with their « contractless » English coutnerparts.

You have a château before getting married. In England, if you divorce, without a marriage contract, you will still have your château. In France, if you have no contract, upon divorcing, your ex nearest and dearest could thoeretically claim 50% of your château. If youwant to separate your property in France so that the situation is similar to that of England (and Wales), then you have to have a contract drawn up.

So, your extract means that the couple in question married under English law (which is similar to the French separation of property régime).

"Mr and Mrs XXX married in Ogwr (Wales, Great Britain) on 7th April 1992 under English law, whose statutory provisions are similar to the French (optional) régime under which the spouses’ property is separated. The spouses (Mr and Mrs XXX) have stated that there has been no amendment to that state of affairs since they married."


FRANCE :

http://www.lesechos.fr/patrimoine/guide/TRA54.html

Séparation de biens
Tous les biens et dettes sont propres. Il n'existe rien en commun aux deux époux, sauf :
· biens indivis, acquis par les époux ensemble,
· dettes contractées pour l'entretien du ménage et certains impôts communs (IR et taxe d'habitation, notamment).
ENGLAND & WALES :

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/marriage.as...

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

Legal formalities for getting married

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/nsbase/registration/Marriage/Ma...

documents you may need to produce

http://www.destination-uk.com/marriage.htm

General requirements



Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 02:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 4431
Grading comment
Thanks for the wonderful explanation as well as the meaning of the para. Excellent to say the least.
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




Return to KudoZ list


KudoZ™ translation help
The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.



See also:



Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search