références

English translation: reference

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02:57 Dec 14, 2016
French to English translations [Non-PRO]
Marketing - Marketing / Market Research / positionnement
French term or phrase: références
Hello again,

"La société compte plus de 700 références de clients français et internationaux"

The company is a data marketing company.


Is this simply "references"?
The company has more than 700 references of French and international clients"

Thank you.
Louisa T.
Tunisia
Local time: 14:02
English translation:reference
Explanation:
It is basically just 'reference' — it's just that we wouldn't usually express it in quite the same way in EN.

To give you the gist of it, you might like to consider it as "The company can cite more than 700 client references in France and worldwide"

I'm not suggesting this as a direct translation, you understand, but simply as an example to show you how it might be interpreted in EN.

The real problem here is more the use of the verb 'compter' — you have simplified this to 'has', but this has then led to an awkward translation. If you start off from the premise of 'counts among its faithful followers', that might then help you to take it the right way...

It is a way of saying, not that 'we have 700 customers', but 'we can quote you more than 700 satisfied customers'; ultimately it means the same thing, but puts more of a marketing spin on it (especially common in FR!) — one would naturally like to think that almost all customers would be 'references' (i.e. satisfied!)

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Note added at 15 heures (2016-12-14 18:01:43 GMT)
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For those who still don't understand the difference, might I respectfully suggest simply consulting any decent English monolingual dictionary of a professional level for clarification of the definitions of this and other terms, in order to discover the possibly subtly but all-important differences between them.

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Note added at 15 heures (2016-12-14 18:10:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Let's try and simplify it for those who don't yet understand:

a 'reference' might be described as a satisfied customer who might potentially be asked to endorse a company/product/service etc.

a 'referral' is when someone (yes, often a satisfied customer!) actively recommends a company/product/service etc. to someone else; or, the term can also be used to refer to a prospective customer who is referred in this way (cf. the equivalent usage where a GP might refer a patient to a specialist) — this is clearly a much more pro-active action than merely passively being available if needed.

I really don't know how better to explain it to make the difference any clearer.
Selected response from:

Tony M
France
Local time: 15:02
Grading comment
Thank you everyone for your tremendous help!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +3reference
Tony M
4 -1700 referrals from French and international clients
Francois Boye
3recommendations/testimonials
Verginia Ophof


Discussion entries: 9





  

Answers


8 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
recommendations/testimonials


Explanation:
suggestion

Verginia Ophof
Belize
Local time: 07:02
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Tony M: The trouble is, that sounds as if these 700 customers have actively provided a recommendation; in practice, they almost certainly haven't, but simply could potentially be asked for one if required.
5 hrs

neutral  Francois Boye: Question to Tony. M: How can these potential providers of reference exist in the abstract. In reality, those potential providers of references provided referrals in the past!
14 hrs
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18 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -1
700 referrals from French and international clients


Explanation:
https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=referrals from clients

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Note added at 12 hrs (2016-12-14 15:50:03 GMT)
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https://www.bing.com/search?q=referral base&form=EDGEAR&qs=A...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 13 hrs (2016-12-14 16:44:35 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The TLFI definition of 'référence' is close to what they call referral in the USA'


A. − Action de (se) référer à quelqu'un, à quelque chose. La référence, purement verbale, que parfois je faisais à Dieu dans mes plaidoiries, donnait de la méfiance à mes clients (Camus, Chute, 1956, p. 1528):
1. Si l'acte humain n'a pas une double référence, d'une part à l'histoire dans laquelle il s'insère et d'autre part, à une norme supérieure qui le juge, mais une seule, à savoir la première, il s'ensuit nécessairement qu'il ne peut tirer sa valeur propre que de son rôle historique. Lacroix, Marxisme, existent., personn., 1949, p. 19.

B. −
1. Action de (se) référer à quelqu'un; p. méton., ce à quoi on (se) réfère. Cet enfant [trouvé] n'a aucune référence, pas d'état civil (Barrès, Cahiers, t. 9, 1911, p. 182).Dans la période de 1860 à 1870, c'est [dans l'œuvre de Manet] une référence logique à Hals et à Goya (Mauclair, Maîtres impressionn., 1923, p. 57).Nous vivons dans un monde où les problèmes de l'existence tendent à être des problèmes précis et où le besoin de références exactes, fixes, est évidemment primordial (Aymé, Confort, 1949, p. 44).
− Au plur. Renseignements, témoignages donnés par quelqu'un sur une personne à la recherche d'un emploi, d'un logement ou souhaitant entrer en affaires, et qui attestent son comportement, ses qualités et représentent une garantie morale pour ceux auxquels elle se présente. Avoir des références. On demande un garçon de bureau d'un certain âge (...). Bonnes références (A. Daudet, Nabab, 1877, p. 56).Parfois le « principal clerc » me demandait les références fournies par mes derniers patrons (Duhamel, Confess. min., 1920, p. 92).

− Souvent au plur. Réalisations d'une entreprise, propriétés, mérites déclarés d'un produit qui attestent ses qualités. (Dict. xixeet xxes.).

− Au fig., fam., au sing. Raison, fait, motif permettant de conclure à la valeur, aux qualités de quelqu'un. Ce n'est pas une référence! Quand on a pu s'échapper vivant d'un abattoir international en folie, c'est tout de même une référence sous le rapport du tact et de la discrétion (Céline, Voyage, 1932, p. 140).

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 14 hrs (2016-12-14 17:30:20 GMT)
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Noun 1. referral - a person whose case has been referred to a specialist or professional group; "the patient is a referral from Dr. Bones"
↔case - a person requiring professional services; "a typical case was the suburban housewife described by a marriage counselor"

2. referral - a recommendation to consult the (professional) person or group to whom one has been referred; "the insurance company says that you need a written referral from your physician before seeing a specialist"
↔recommendation - something (as a course of action) that is recommended as advisable

3. referral - the act of referring (as forwarding an applicant for employment or referring a matter to an appropriate agency)
↔forwarding - the act of sending on to another destination; "the forwarding of mail to a new address is done automatically"; "the forwarding of resumes to the personnel department"

↔remit, remitment, remission - (law) the act of remitting (especially the referral of a law case to another court)


Francois Boye
United States
Local time: 09:02
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in category: 8
Notes to answerer
Asker: Yes of course! Thank you


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Tony M: A 'référence' is NOT a 'referral'! / No, even your ref. is talking about something QUITE different! ALL your examples refer to some active process of referring; a 'reference' is simply someone who MIGHT be asked for a reference if required.
2 hrs
  -> Sorry! This is what they say in this side of the Atlantic!// Please explain clearly the difference! See my last note

disagree  Daryo: too much off mark // these are NOT "referrals" it's NOT about 700 clients bringing themselves new clients to this company - these "references" are not directed at anyone in particular.
4 hrs
  -> Sorry! This is what they say from this side of the Atlantic!// See my last note//So who are the originators of these references? By the way, what's the contents of the references?

agree  Verginia Ophof
1 day 8 hrs
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
référence
reference


Explanation:
It is basically just 'reference' — it's just that we wouldn't usually express it in quite the same way in EN.

To give you the gist of it, you might like to consider it as "The company can cite more than 700 client references in France and worldwide"

I'm not suggesting this as a direct translation, you understand, but simply as an example to show you how it might be interpreted in EN.

The real problem here is more the use of the verb 'compter' — you have simplified this to 'has', but this has then led to an awkward translation. If you start off from the premise of 'counts among its faithful followers', that might then help you to take it the right way...

It is a way of saying, not that 'we have 700 customers', but 'we can quote you more than 700 satisfied customers'; ultimately it means the same thing, but puts more of a marketing spin on it (especially common in FR!) — one would naturally like to think that almost all customers would be 'references' (i.e. satisfied!)

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 heures (2016-12-14 18:01:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

For those who still don't understand the difference, might I respectfully suggest simply consulting any decent English monolingual dictionary of a professional level for clarification of the definitions of this and other terms, in order to discover the possibly subtly but all-important differences between them.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 heures (2016-12-14 18:10:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Let's try and simplify it for those who don't yet understand:

a 'reference' might be described as a satisfied customer who might potentially be asked to endorse a company/product/service etc.

a 'referral' is when someone (yes, often a satisfied customer!) actively recommends a company/product/service etc. to someone else; or, the term can also be used to refer to a prospective customer who is referred in this way (cf. the equivalent usage where a GP might refer a patient to a specialist) — this is clearly a much more pro-active action than merely passively being available if needed.

I really don't know how better to explain it to make the difference any clearer.

Tony M
France
Local time: 15:02
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 130
Grading comment
Thank you everyone for your tremendous help!

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Chakib Roula
1 hr
  -> شكرا Chakib!

agree  Carol Gullidge: I like "satisfied customers" :)
6 hrs
  -> Thanks, Carol!

neutral  Francois Boye: Your explanation is very close (you talk about satisfied customers) to the concept of referral in the USA. Do you mean that only UK English speakers can translate 'référence'?
10 hrs
  -> No, François: EN US and GB are exactly the same on this point: this is specific English marketing jargon, and even though to you the difference in EN may appear subtle, it IS important!

agree  Daryo
17 hrs
  -> Merci, Daryo !
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