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un livre sur l'Holocauste est devenu accessible à des jeunes

English translation: accessible to young peopel between 12 and 18

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16:15 Dec 4, 2000
French to English translations [Non-PRO]
General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters
French term or phrase: un livre sur l'Holocauste est devenu accessible à des jeunes
devenu accessible a des jeunes entre 12-18 ans.
Why "des" and not "aux" since the book is available to the general population between 12-18 years old? Is this a grammatical error? I understand the rules of the definite and indefinite articles. Why is this confusing me? This sentence would mean just some or a portion of this age group has access to it. Right? But I took it to mean that that this age group in general has access to it.

Thanks for your help.
Matt
English translation:accessible to young peopel between 12 and 18
Explanation:
It is quite straightforward really.

The writer has chosen "des" for a reason.

Had he chosen "aux", he would have been referring to all young people (aux = to the) between the age limits defined. As he has opted for "des" he means some of those young people within the age limits defined.

Thus the book, he believes, will be accessible to some young people within that age group, not every single 12-18 year old.

A quick word on "accessible". WHen the writer says that the book is accessible, he does not mean "available". He means accessible in the sense of "readable" and "able to be understood by". This ties in with what your instinct is telling you about "aux" and "des".

That said, whether in English (GB) we would in this particular instance go so far as making the difference which in the (French) writer's mind no doubt makes all the difference, is another matter.

I would never the less opt for saying "a book on the Haulocaust" has become accessible to young people between 12 and 18 ...", defending this option in saying that in modern English, in context, it is obvious that only some of the specific group are concerned. The "some" is understood and thus not required.





Selected response from:

Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 00:33
Grading comment
Great answer. You always give such thorough answers. You are a talented translator.

Thanks
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
nato a number of young people aged between 12-18Ana.uk
na[seconding Jon and Paul:] Why not simply write "...to some teenagers..."Heathcliff
naaccessible to young peopel between 12 and 18
Nikki Scott-Despaigne
nato certain youths aged 12 to 18Ana.uk
naaccessible to most...xxxPaul Roige
naavailable to youths 12 to 18 years old
lefoque
naYou will go nuts if you try to understand French articles.xxxJon Zuber
na"to young people between 12 and 18...!
Parrot


  

Answers


46 mins
"to young people between 12 and 18...!


Explanation:
"Des" gives rise to an ellipsis in English; as a plural indefinite article, it doesn't exist. "Aux" would make it plural definite (to the young people (of that time)).

Parrot
Spain
Local time: 00:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Heathcliff

Glen McCulley
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49 mins
available to youths 12 to 18 years old


Explanation:
No need to be confused by the à des here. While I don't know the exact grammatical rule here, I have seen this construction lots of times before.

lefoque
United States
Local time: 18:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Heathcliff
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1 hr
You will go nuts if you try to understand French articles.


Explanation:
Sure, in some cases you can easily point to a rule that tells you why one rather than another. But often you just have to have a feel for them.
By the way, I would just say "readers between 12 and 18"; "young people" or "youths" is redundant with the numbers.

xxxJon Zuber

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Yolanda Broad

Heathcliff
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14 hrs
accessible to most...


Explanation:
Bonjour: There is an infinitesimal difference which I sense lies here: Aux = à+les (not à+des). I think you're right, the text does not say all youth aged ... can have access to the book, but only a portion of them, i.e.: those who want to read it, who can afford it, who can read, who have a bookstore in town, etc. Quite subtle difference which the author stresses with the use of "à des". Unthinkable for English speakers who couldn't be bothered with such "arrogant" linguistic details, practical people as they are. Blame Latin though, all comes from there. Au revoir à des copains (just jocking, I meant "aux")... :)


    something inside me somewhere...
xxxPaul Roige
Spain
Local time: 00:33
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish, Native in CatalanCatalan

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Yolanda Broad

Heathcliff

xxxnicolas
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17 hrs
to certain youths aged 12 to 18


Explanation:
You're absolutely right. "a des" literally means "to some". I think "certain" sounds better.



Ana.uk
Local time: 23:33

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Heathcliff
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1 day 15 hrs
to a number of young people aged between 12-18


Explanation:
On reflection, I think that "a number of" sounds better.

I was thinking more in terms of the french "a certains jeunes". But then it was rather late my time!! Sorry!

Ana.uk
Local time: 23:33

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
Heathcliff
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5 days
[seconding Jon and Paul:] Why not simply write "...to some teenagers..."


Explanation:
and leave out the numbers.

Here, "some" implies the young readers with interest, means, access, etc.

Cheers, HC

Heathcliff
United States
Local time: 15:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
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5 days
accessible to young peopel between 12 and 18


Explanation:
It is quite straightforward really.

The writer has chosen "des" for a reason.

Had he chosen "aux", he would have been referring to all young people (aux = to the) between the age limits defined. As he has opted for "des" he means some of those young people within the age limits defined.

Thus the book, he believes, will be accessible to some young people within that age group, not every single 12-18 year old.

A quick word on "accessible". WHen the writer says that the book is accessible, he does not mean "available". He means accessible in the sense of "readable" and "able to be understood by". This ties in with what your instinct is telling you about "aux" and "des".

That said, whether in English (GB) we would in this particular instance go so far as making the difference which in the (French) writer's mind no doubt makes all the difference, is another matter.

I would never the less opt for saying "a book on the Haulocaust" has become accessible to young people between 12 and 18 ...", defending this option in saying that in modern English, in context, it is obvious that only some of the specific group are concerned. The "some" is understood and thus not required.







Nikki Scott-Despaigne
Local time: 00:33
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 107
Grading comment
Great answer. You always give such thorough answers. You are a talented translator.

Thanks
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




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Changes made by editors
Mar 5, 2011 - Changes made by Stéphanie Soudais:
Term askedHow does one translate the \"des\" in this sentence: Un livre sur l\'Holocauste est » un livre sur l\'Holocauste est devenu accessible à des jeunes
Field (specific)(none) » General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters


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