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une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer

English translation: a career as an officer specializing in submarine/underwater combat on board warships

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer
English translation:a career as an officer specializing in submarine/underwater combat on board warships
Entered by: Scott de Lesseps
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15:35 Dec 2, 2003
French to English translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering / nautical
French term or phrase: une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer
Je suis entré dans la marine française en 1979 par l’école navale, et j’ai eu une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer à bord de navires de combat.
Scott de Lesseps
United States
Local time: 19:30
a career as an officer specializing in submarine/underwater combat on board warships
Explanation:
(1) For the benefit of certain rather strident contributors to this site, I would point out that "submarine" is also (and was originally) an adjective meaning "underwater", and does not necessarily refer to the vessel known as a submarine.

(For those pedants who point out that it should mean "undersea"--you are technically right, but how far up the Seine do you think you could get any self-respecting warship?)

(2) the "à bord de navires de combat" is a little puzzling: was he an officer on board warships, or was the combat on board warships? The first makes more sense, but the latter is suggested by the syntax. I have transferred this ambiguity into the English version.
Selected response from:

Richard Benham
France
Local time: 01:30
Grading comment


Thanks Richard, and to everyone.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5 +1an officers career as a specialist in undersea warfareDundF
5navy diver specialising in underwater combat operationsJane Lamb-Ruiz
4 +1..served onboard warships as an Anti Submarine Warfare Officer
Nerzh
4a career as an officer specializing in submarine/underwater combat on board warships
Richard Benham
4a career as undersea warfare officer/officer specializing in undersea warfareDavid Sirett
4an officer's career path specializing in submarine combat
William Stein
3a career as an underwater combat officer/specialisttoubabou


  

Answers


2 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer
an officer's career path specializing in submarine combat


Explanation:
or
underwater combat (that's a form of water hockey for scuba divers, I think)

William Stein
Costa Rica
Local time: 18:30
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 1737
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5 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer
a career as an underwater combat officer/specialist


Explanation:
--

toubabou
Local time: 19:30
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 187

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  xxxBourth: Aargh, un des époux Mafart, assassins!
6 hrs
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7 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
navy diver specialising in underwater combat operations


Explanation:
in Britain, they seem to say military divers...but here it is specifically Navy, IMO

... (currently looking for some good pics). Contrary to popular belief, Navy SEALs
are not the only US special operations forces to be qualified combat divers. ...
www.specialoperations.com/Specialties/diving.html - 23k - Cached - Similar pages

SpecialOperations.Com - US Navy SEALs
... Patches" Watson; Brian Curle; Chris Caracci; Denny Johnson -Blue Caribe Dive Center; ... Jeff's
Navy SEAL Page. US Naval Special Warfare Archives- NavyFrogmen.com. ...
www.specialoperations.com/Navy/SEALs/default2.html - 28k - Cached - Similar pages
[ More results from www.specialoperations.com ]

Special Operations Navy Corpsmen
... Doc Riojas was a Hospital Corpsman Special Operations Technician (HM-8492) and
was qualified to practice medicine on US Navy Divers and SEALs and other ...
www.mi-vida-loca.com/HM8492.htm - 24k - Cached - Similar pages



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Note added at 2003-12-02 15:48:22 (GMT)
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FINAL: an officer\'s career as a Navy diver specializing in underwater [combat] operations

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Note added at 2003-12-02 15:50:43 (GMT)
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Please note: THERE IS NO SUBMARINE, THERE IS ONLY UNDERWATER.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-12-02 15:53:08 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

it\'s underwater combat; there is no mention of submarine in the French text.
... 23/12/2002 : UK MoD DPA ... She is due to be ready for operations in October 2003 ... world
leader and marks a step change in the RN’s underwater combat effectiveness ...
www.tms-sonar.com/news.php?newsid=38 - 27k - Cached - Similar pages

[PDF] Cyberpunk 2020 Reference Book v5
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
Your browser may not have a PDF reader available. Google recommends visiting our text version of this document.
... 2.2 Covert Operations Training ... http://www.node16.co.uk/ CONTENTS & LEGEND Net
Criticals ... 2.14 Underwater Combat ..... ...
www.node16.co.uk/pdfs/contents5.pdf - Similar pages

????[U]
... Urban Close Quarter Battle Range; UCS Underwater Combat System; UCS ... UK National Military
Representative,SHAPE; UKRAOC UK Regional Air Operations Centre; ...
www007.upp.so-net.ne.jp/togo/term/u.html - 27k - Cached - Similar pages



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Note added at 2003-12-02 15:55:32 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

lutte sous la mer= underwater combat

for sure!!

NO SUBMARINES mentioned IN THE TEXT.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-12-02 16:05:32 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

sorry again, no diver either!! Hah,....even I make mistakes of course..

here it is:
FINAL: as a career [Navy] officer specializing in underwater combat operations



--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-12-02 16:25:24 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Note to Nerzh:

Je n\'ai pas dit qu\'il n\'y avait pas ces gens là dans la marine. J\'ai dit que le MOT SUBMARINE n\'était pas dans le texte en français. In the French, veut DIRE, en français pas dans la marine française.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-12-02 20:27:59 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

HERE THE WAY IT IS SAID, what I said:
Searched the web for \"underwater combat operations\". Results 1 - 2 of about 3. Search took 0.27 seconds.


US Military Special Operations Forces
... In this instance, the Special Operations Force with the most training
and experience in ****underwater combat operations**** would be Navy SEALS. ...
usmilitary.about.com/library/weekly/aa032803a.htm - 53k - Cached - Similar pages

If it\'s said by the Navy Seals, that\'s how it is said. It is a general term. The text is not actually saying ASW. What\'s the matter with everyone??


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-12-02 20:34:00 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

THE TRANSLATION:
Je suis entré dans la marine française en 1979 par l’école navale, et j’ai eu une carrière d’officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer à bord de navires de combat.

I went into the French navy in 1979 through naval college and I was a career officer specializing in underwater combat operations off warships.

The ASW might very well come under what he did. He did not only do that. He did more. Anti-submarine warfare is only ONE kind of underwater operations for heaven\'s sake.

cheers

Jane Lamb-Ruiz
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in PortuguesePortuguese
PRO pts in pair: 8576

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  xxxCMJ_Trans: he's probably in a submarine !
1 min
  -> not at all...he's a diver assigned to a ship..it does not say submarine it's say sous la mer: underwater operations, probably conducted from EITHER a submarine OR SHIP

disagree  Nerzh: Dans ce cas un officier de la Marine Nationale aurait dit avoir eu une carrière de nageur de combat...et il n'aurait pas dit avoir été embarqué.
31 mins
  -> You are right, there is no nageur mais il n'y pas de sousmarin non plus. J'ai changé ma réponse dans ce sense..

agree  David Sirett: 'lutte sous la mer' = ASW
44 mins
  -> I don't think so here. It is broader than anti-submarine warfare...It's GENERAL and BROADER. ASW is very pointu.

neutral  lien: Je comprends pourquoi ils voulaient limiter les commentaires a 255 caracteres. Qu'y a-t-il d'autre a combattre en temps de guerre sous la mer a part les sous-marins ? Les pieuvres geantes ?
8 hrs
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17 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
..served onboard warships as an Anti Submarine Warfare Officer


Explanation:
or ASW officer

Nerzh
Local time: 01:30
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 28

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Jane Lamb-Ruiz: there is no anti-sbumarine warfare in the French; it's underwater combat not anti-submarine even though it probably includes that..
1 min
  -> Ah bon !!! Je croyais qu'il y avait des officiers ASM dans la Marine Nationale..

agree  David Sirett: AARGH agreed in wrong place (Jane). Yes, 'lutte sous la mer' = ASW
35 mins
  -> Merci David

agree  lien: oui, il etait officier sur un navire specialise dans la lutte contre les sous-marins
8 hrs
  -> merci - il était effectivement ambarqué en tant qu'officier ASM
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48 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
a career as undersea warfare officer/officer specializing in undersea warfare


Explanation:
"lutte sous la mer" is clearly equivalent to ASW in French military parlance (see ref. 1).
In English the broader term "undersea warfare" is also used extensively, including ASW, mines, diving operations (see ref. 2).


    Reference: http://www.recrute-officiers.marine.defense.gouv.fr/metiers....
    Reference: http://www.cotf.navy.mil/divs/40.htm
David Sirett
Local time: 01:30
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 2045
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
an officers career as a specialist in undersea warfare


Explanation:
Clearly the man hasn't served as a "diver" nor as the "frogman".

Even in French "officier spécialiste de la lutte sous la mer" sounds a bit odd.

There are 3 wide fields of action in the french as in the english/american navy:
1) anti-air warfare (AAW) "lutte anti-aérienne" [AA]
2) anti-surface warfare (ASuW) "lutte anti-surface" [ASF]
3 anti-submarine warfare (ASW) " lutte anti sous-marine" [ASM]

Clearly the man has specialised in anti-submarine warfare: he has used "sous la mer" rather than "sous-marine" to make it more easy to understand: therefore "undersea warfare" fits best: he didn't serve aboard submarines so "submarine warfare" doesn't fit. "anti-submarine warfare" is a bit too restrictive: it doesn't include some parts of "undersea warfare" as, for exemple, mine searching and clearing.




DundF
France
Local time: 01:30
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Charlie Bavington: I'm no expert but I think this is best, plus which, using "warfare" not "combat" means you can end the phrase with "combat vessels" without being repetitive.
2 hrs
  -> Yes, I see it this way, too; thank you
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
a career as an officer specializing in submarine/underwater combat on board warships


Explanation:
(1) For the benefit of certain rather strident contributors to this site, I would point out that "submarine" is also (and was originally) an adjective meaning "underwater", and does not necessarily refer to the vessel known as a submarine.

(For those pedants who point out that it should mean "undersea"--you are technically right, but how far up the Seine do you think you could get any self-respecting warship?)

(2) the "à bord de navires de combat" is a little puzzling: was he an officer on board warships, or was the combat on board warships? The first makes more sense, but the latter is suggested by the syntax. I have transferred this ambiguity into the English version.

Richard Benham
France
Local time: 01:30
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 614
Grading comment


Thanks Richard, and to everyone.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  David Sirett: "undersea" is not pedantry, simply wide usage (as is "underwater" also, of course). "Combat" seems much less frequent than "warfare" in this context. For 2), "navires de combat" is presumably to indicate service on surface ships rather than in submarines.
2 days 6 hrs
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