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perte sans nouvelle d'un navire

English translation: actual total loss

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:perte sans nouvelle d'un navire
English translation:actual total loss
Entered by: Elizabeth Niklewska
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10:09 Feb 21, 2008
French to English translations [PRO]
Transport / Transportation / Shipping / Shipping
French term or phrase: perte sans nouvelle d'un navire
This is in a text about an insurance concerning a lost ship

.... ce qui laisse supposer la perte totale ou sans nouvelle du dit navire.

Is there any proper shipping term to cover such an event?

"without a trace" doesn't quite fit

"unaccounted for loss" is the best I can come up with, but doesn't quite sound right
Elizabeth Niklewska
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:16
actual total loss
Explanation:
I admit that it's not a very romantic answer...

In a number of insurance texts they say something like: if the ship does not arrive at its destination and has not been heard of for three months it shall be considered missing and as such an actual total loss


Business Law
As per this section, the actual total loss occurs in any one of the ... When the ship is missing, and after a reasonable time no news of her has been ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=8121919274...
Selected response from:

Graham macLachlan
Local time: 22:16
Grading comment
Yes, this makes sense!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +4a ship lost without trace and its fate unknown
B D Finch
3actual total loss
Graham macLachlan
2unexplained (unaccounted) loss at sea
cjohnstone


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


21 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +4
a ship lost without trace and its fate unknown


Explanation:
"Lloyd's Register of Shipping and the Mercantile Navy List (British ships) for 1914 to .... A large number of vessels lost without trace, and fate unknown, ..."
www.nmm.ac.uk/server?show=conWebDoc.576&setPaginate=No - 22k

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Note added at 25 mins (2008-02-21 10:34:24 GMT)
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"Hulking was a common fate for wooden ships, especially if they had lost some ... The ship is described as `missing`, `disappeared` or `lost without trace`. ..."
www.plimsoll.org/WrecksAndAccidents/WhyAccidentsHappen/What...

"To date, over 1700 ships and planes have been alleged as having disappeared without trace or lost their crews in that particular area of the Atlantic Ocean. ..."
uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070713035749AAOUJ2n

B D Finch
France
Local time: 22:16
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 126

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  xxxBourth: "Lost without trace" certainly sounds natural to me.
5 mins
  -> Thanks

agree  James Roberts: I agree - I used to work in this field of law and I can't think of anything better.
8 mins
  -> Thanks

agree  cjohnstone: maybe unduly lengthy? but maybe you know best
19 mins
  -> Thanks - it is a bit long, but I couldn't think of a shorter formula and Lloyds is a good authority.

agree  Suzette Martin-Johnson: Also vessel. Lost without a trace
1 hr
  -> Thanks
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39 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
unexplained (unaccounted) loss at sea


Explanation:
seen this before in insurance jobs.. it is a legal term and has the advantage of being short... now not sure enough to put in 5 although here am 90% sure... colleagues will confirm or infirm!!! :)

cjohnstone
France
Local time: 22:16
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 10

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  B D Finch: The meaning is different; the lack of explanation for how the loss occurred does not mean that there is no knowledge of the ship's fate.
1 hr
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4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
perte totale ou sans nouvelle d'un navire
actual total loss


Explanation:
I admit that it's not a very romantic answer...

In a number of insurance texts they say something like: if the ship does not arrive at its destination and has not been heard of for three months it shall be considered missing and as such an actual total loss


Business Law
As per this section, the actual total loss occurs in any one of the ... When the ship is missing, and after a reasonable time no news of her has been ...
books.google.com/books?isbn=8121919274...


Graham macLachlan
Local time: 22:16
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 317
Grading comment
Yes, this makes sense!
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




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