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07:56 Feb 5, 2018
This question was closed without grading. Reason: No acceptable answer
Italian to English translations [PRO] Art/Literary - General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters / Character-based fiction
Italian term or phrase: infrattati in un luogo di perdizione
This is in response to a question regarding how this person's relationship had gone when he was with a particular girl.
“Come vuoi che sia andata. Male. Era tutto sbagliato, fin dall'inizio. L'ho conosciuta per caso, una sera in discoteca. Dopo due ore eravamo già infrattati in un luogo di perdizione.”
I am would have thought "infrattati" would imply things went well, but "perdizione." would indicate otherwise.
I perused the previous postings and, considering your clarification about the bushes, I believe your translation ""we were hiding behind the bushes on the road to hell" has a great impact. Concise, metaphorical to the point, and grasps the undertone that "luogo di perdizione" is (better: becomes) such for what the two are doing, not because it was designed to favo(u)r perdition. Your translation has the sorry wink in it that the original bears. "Sorry" because I feel that the speaker is now not fully happy of the consequences of his haste. But it's sadly known that men have a bicipital nature and too often the wrong head takes the lead. (I'm a male, I confirm.)
Far from me deciding that you should kick the bushes out of the pic. Besides, I'm quite incompetent with UK jargon. In this respect, thanks for pointing out that the same bucolic metaphor applies in British English as it does in my native language. Just a question, does it really imply a "sexual" undertone? Of course this is not always the case even in Italian, it could be that "si sono infrattati per giocare a poker", hardly would mean anything sexual. Unless it were the strip variant. It would be a personal gift if you'd let me know how you managed it in the end. Con amicizia, buona traduzione. Maurizio
Thank you for info, was very interesting. I can see how "bushes" are not relevant in Italian, but I am translating this for an English readership (i.e. into UK English). The English readership would understand bushes to mean a place where one would hide as it is a British metaphor. So I don'[t understand how it could be incorrect here for use in the English version.
Q. D'you know who the patron Saint of lovers is? A. San Frattamo. (S'anfrattamo = We are going to hide behind the bushes to...).
As I said in my agree to Lisa Jane the metaphorical sense long won over the literal one both for infrattarsi and imboscarsi. And not even just to have sex. As imboscarsi has long meant (specially in the army) to hide from corvees, duties, fighting etc., it came to be a synonym for infrattarsi (for both acceptions) as infrattarsi was primarily used meaning to hide in (or: behind) the bushes to "have sex". Therefore ci si infratta (one hides away) even in the cellar, in an elevator, in an attic, in a vehicle, in a change room, in a bathroom stall, on a mountain top, in a train car compartment, in an office storeroom, behind a desk, behind a screen, in your parents' room, wherever. But I suggest that the BUSHES be left out of this particular translation. In English it won't fit. My native Italian opinion, of course. Maurizio
@Lara I have lost the sense of continuity of this post, don't think it means brothel but rather road to H. or to perdition so please make use freely of whatever I wrote before in this discussion thread.
I used 'bushes' because in the second part of the context posted, there is 'uno di quei posti dove le coppiette vanno in macchina a scopare' so there is the idea that they went somewhere to hide to romp so most probably not in a corner of a nightclub
I like using bushes as they end up sounding quite good with "on the road to..", if the client accepts my suggestion. I will be flagging up the idioms in a comment when I send this "FINAL!!" section in to her in a few days.
But if she does not like it, I guess I may have to post a new question, or keep this one open!
but it can be done with or without bushes, they are not a necessary requirement;) The term is used more widely nowadays to say go off with one's lover to a corner or a place where it's a bit more private
infrattarsi or infrattati as here is to have a roll in the hay here -http://dizionari.corriere.it/dizionario_inglese/Italiano/I/i... Maybe un luogo di perdizione is because he regretted it as things later turned out as they broke off the relationship. I don't think you can translate luogo di perdizione literally as 'place of ill-repute' you but have to find something which clicks with what follows
infrattato is jargon for "hidden behind a bush" to have some sexual activities. It can be everywhere actually, even a hotel room. In this case the text doesn't specify but says it was a luogo di perdizione possibly because of the guilty feelings they feel
By the way, the girl here was about to get married and in the end the speaker was rejected and dropped when she eventually walked up the isle with her new husband.
Automatic update in 00:
5 hrs confidence:
tucked away in a place of ill repute
Explanation: I read it that way but I could also read it metaphorically, as perdition being the road that the relationship is on. So I could also see a case for something like "tucked away on the road to perdition", indicating that they're hidden away somewhere, doing things they shouldn't be, but recognizing the hopelessness of the situation given her impending marriage.
Anthony Mazzorana United States Local time: 22:32 Meets criteria Specializes in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 8