KudoZ home » Italian to English » History

Tramandare sé stessa

English translation: perpetuate itself

Advertisement

Login or register (free and only takes a few minutes) to participate in this question.

You will also have access to many other tools and opportunities designed for those who have language-related jobs
(or are passionate about them). Participation is free and the site has a strict confidentiality policy.
18:59 Feb 5, 2012
Italian to English translations [PRO]
History / Holocaust
Italian term or phrase: Tramandare sé stessa
In un certo qual modo, anche in quella dimensione del non-essere che era rappresentata dalla (ir)realtà del ghetto, la comunità compiva, attraverso l'accettazione della selezione imposta dai nazisti, l'ultimo disperato sforzo di tramandare sé stessa, di preservarsi il più a lungo possibile proteggendo i propri caratteri più idonei alla sopravvivenza.

In a way, even in that dimension of not-beingwhich the (un)reality of the ghetto represented, accepting the selection imposed by the Nazis was the last desperate effort that the Jewish community made in order to be able to keep a hope for the future and preserve itself for as long as possible through the protection of the traits which were necessary to survival.

E' una traduzione a dir poco "letteraria". Non riesco ad esprimere il concetto di "tramandare sé stessa"!
papelito
Local time: 04:35
English translation:perpetuate itself
Explanation:
One of many possible translations.
Selected response from:

Marco Solinas
Local time: 19:35
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Advertisement


Summary of answers provided
3 +3perpetuate itselfMarco Solinas
4 +1Transcend itself
LaraBarnett
4sustain itselfGallagy
4to survive themselves
James (Jim) Davis
4to be passed down
Glinda
4to hand itself down to the future
Michael Korovkin
3to outlive itself/to outlast itself
texjax DDS PhD
2to leave a legacyKari Foster


  

Answers


7 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
perpetuate itself


Explanation:
One of many possible translations.

Marco Solinas
Local time: 19:35
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 12
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  xxxSusy Sinigag
12 hrs

agree  Isabelle Johnson: Yes I like this.
12 hrs

agree  Linda Thody
15 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

50 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
to be passed down


Explanation:
Un'altra opzione.

Glinda
Local time: 04:35
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian
Notes to answerer
Asker: ;) grazie, ci avevo pensato a dire il vero. credo che tradurrò: "perpetuate itself"

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

54 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
to survive themselves


Explanation:
It isn't quite the same thing technically, but perhaps it translates the spirit of the Italian.

James (Jim) Davis
Seychelles
Local time: 06:35
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 73
Notes to answerer
Asker: thanx. i think i'll use "to perpetuate itself"


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  texjax DDS PhD: I like this option, the only problem is that there is another "survival" at the end of the sentence.
2 hrs
  -> Hmm have you read Cicero? He explains the appropriate use of repetition in rhetoric. " .... protecting those traits most suited to that same survival"
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Transcend itself


Explanation:
This looks like a literal translation, but was the first idea I had on reading the text. I think it suits the context and is of the correct register, often being used in philosophical and academic explanations such as this.

The dictionary definitions below show its meaning both with and without object.

"Transcend
verb (used with object)
1. to rise above or go beyond; overpass; exceed: to transcend the limits of thought; kindness transcends courtesy.
2. to outdo or exceed in excellence, elevation, extent, degree, etc.; surpass; excel.
3. Theology . (of the Deity) to be above and independent of (the universe, time, etc.).
verb (used without object)
4. to be transcendent or superior; excel: His competitiveness made him want to transcend."
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/transcend?qsrc=2446

Example sentence(s):
  • "The fourth requirement is to sensitise the educational functionaries outside the schools to appreciate the need to TRANSCEND generations, while determining and understanding the needs of the schools,..."
  • "Our Mission: To nurture a unified Jewish Community that TRANSCENDS generations and neighborhoods."

    Reference: http://www.thehindu.com/opinion/op-ed/article2370016.ece
    Reference: http://www.orlandojewishfed.org/page.aspx?id=209560
LaraBarnett
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:35
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: thanx, i'm undecided. maybe i'll use "perpetuate itself" of your option ;)


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  LorraineB: with explanation and well backed up by references
3 hrs
  -> Thank you.

neutral  Michael Korovkin: Yeah, "trascendere" would have the same ("freudian":)) meaning in Italian as "transcend" in English.But in the Italian text it wasn't "trascendere":it was "tramandare",for a reason,one supposes.Non superar se stessa(transcend)ma mandar avanti se stessa,+-
11 hrs
  -> Maybe, but these Freudian type interpretations would be just as relevant in Italy, therefore what is the problem with a literal translation? i.e. If Freud and his peers were writing in Italian, I am sure they would have also said "Tramandare...betrays etc
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
to outlive itself/to outlast itself


Explanation:
Iy might work

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2012-02-05 22:04:30 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

iy=it

Example sentence(s):
  • They wrote of their intentions for their diaries to outlive themselves and defy any Nazi future cover up. Herman Kruk illuminated this in his astoundingly detailed diary from the Vilna Ghetto

    Reference: http://dtl.unimelb.edu.au//exlibris/dtl/d3_1/apache_media/L2...
texjax DDS PhD
Local time: 22:35
Native speaker of: Native in ItalianItalian
PRO pts in category: 22
Notes to answerer
Asker: grazie. mi piace molto la tua proposta, non se se userò questa o "perpetuate itself".


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Michael Korovkin: that was what I thought of even before you had posted yours, but then it gave me a persistent (perhaps wrong) impression of becoming somewhat obsolete... I don't mean me (not yet!), I mean the Ghetto! :)
10 hrs
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
sustain itself


Explanation:
another option, similar to your own "preserve".

They wanted to keep hope alive and so sustained themselves as well as possible by protecting and maintaining as many of those character traits which would help them survive as they could...

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sustain

sustain - lengthen or extend in duration or space; "We sustained the diplomatic negotiations as long as possible"; "prolong the treatment of the patient"; "keep up the good work"
keep up, prolong
keep on, retain, continue, keep - allow to remain in a place or position or maintain a property or feature; ..."We kept the work going as long as we could"; "She retained her composure"; preserve, uphold, carry on, continue, cause to remain or last; "continue the family tradition"; "Carry on the old traditions"

Gallagy
Ireland
Local time: 03:35
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: thanx. maybe i'll use "ti perpetuate itself"

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

14 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
to leave a legacy


Explanation:
Not an exact translation by any means, but possibly appropriate in the context?

Kari Foster
Local time: 04:35
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
Notes to answerer
Asker: pretty good, actually. maybe i'll use it, or "to perpetuate itself"

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

13 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
to hand itself down to the future


Explanation:
Somewhat wordy but, in my view, a more straightforward alternative. Other versions that come to mind strike me as though they either may connote becoming obsolete or sound too paradoxical.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2012-02-10 10:00:22 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

To tell you honest truth, "to perpetuate" was the first thing I thought of too. But then (giuro, in tempi non-sospetti!) I reconsidered. Perpetuation denotes existential contunuiity. And yet a particular ghetto may die physically but hand itself down to the future (or, at least, to history) through some of the individuals of whom it was comprised. For example, the Warsaw ghetto was eliminated altogether and yet it has handed itself down to both the future and history; and through that legacy had started anew in more places than just one.

Michael Korovkin
Italy
Local time: 04:35
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in category: 29
Notes to answerer
Asker: i like your suggestion, the only problem is that it's too long. i think i'll use "to perpetuate itself". cheers

Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)




Return to KudoZ list


KudoZ™ translation help
The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.



See also:



Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search