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defunti non collocati

English translation: unburied dead

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Italian term or phrase:defunti non collocati
English translation:unburied dead
Entered by: Giles Watson
Options:
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18:35 Feb 2, 2009
Italian to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature / slovenian legends
Italian term or phrase: defunti non collocati
I think I get the idea but can't think of how to translate it... The phrase has appeared in two passages about mythical creatures. here is one example:

" La cultura popolare ha domesticato l’ambiente dando nomi ai luoghi e legando storie ai punti più salienti. Storie tanto più vive quanto più i luoghi erano carichi di suggestione. E come la Krivapekno čelò, una grotta nei pressi di San Leonardo, così non c’è jama che non possedesse richiami ad esseri mitici (le Krivapete, le Vile o il dispettoso piccolo Škrat che secondo molte leggende è la creatura non voluta e sepolta di nascosto dalla madre o il neonato morto senza battesimo), storie di violenza e di defunti non collocati, riunioni di streghe o di briganti, presenza di tesori nascosti e custoditi con cura da spiriti o da mostri".

The word 'jama' is in italics and I guess it's Slovenian.
manducci
Local time: 11:40
unburied dead
Explanation:
This looks as if it is referring to what happens when you leave bodies unburied, a common theme in folk tales all over the world.

"Jama" is the Slovene word for "cave" or "grotto". If you ever get the chance, the cave system - complete with train ride - at Postojna is stunning!

Giles
Selected response from:

Giles Watson
Italy
Local time: 11:40
Grading comment
Thanks, Giles (also for the link and recommendation!). Thanks too to Michael and Fiorsam. I liked Michael's alternative but agreee with you entirely concerning the need for a concise noun phrase here. Besides, I am under strict instruction to keep to the original word limit!! Thanks again.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5graveless dead
Michael Korovkin
4 +1unburied dead
Giles Watson
4the dead who had never been laid to rest
Michael Korovkin
2deceased unburied
Fiorsam


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


46 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
unburied dead


Explanation:
This looks as if it is referring to what happens when you leave bodies unburied, a common theme in folk tales all over the world.

"Jama" is the Slovene word for "cave" or "grotto". If you ever get the chance, the cave system - complete with train ride - at Postojna is stunning!

Giles


    Reference: http://www.postojnska-jama.si/
Giles Watson
Italy
Local time: 11:40
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 40
Grading comment
Thanks, Giles (also for the link and recommendation!). Thanks too to Michael and Fiorsam. I liked Michael's alternative but agreee with you entirely concerning the need for a concise noun phrase here. Besides, I am under strict instruction to keep to the original word limit!! Thanks again.
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks, Giles. Why didn't I think of that? I was off on another track, thinking 'non collocati' referred to 'spirits in limbo' between heaven and hell.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Jim Tucker
2 hrs
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14 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
deceased unburied


Explanation:
or not buried - just another guess

Jul 30, 2000 ... It is considered a matter of great shame and discourtesy to leave the deceased unburied -- his soul has returned to God, but his body is ...
www.aish.com/literacy/lifecycle/The_Jewish_Way_of_Death.asp

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Note added at 3 hrs (2009-02-02 22:05:02 GMT)
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Thank you for your comment. You're absolutely correct - I just lifted the phrase without reflecting on the grammatical ramifications.

Fiorsam
United States
Local time: 05:40
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Italian
PRO pts in category: 19

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Jim Tucker: This involves a misapplication of the text that you quote: "to leave the deceased unburied" - here "unburied" is predicative (after "leave") - you need it in attributive position: "the unburied dead"
2 hrs
  -> Thank you for your comment. You're absolutely correct - I just lifted the phrase without reflecting on the grammatical ramifications.
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4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
the dead who had never been laid to rest


Explanation:
"the unburried dead" is right, of course, but appears to be too dry for the context... and smacking of corpses srewn around... And yet I'm saying basically the same thing except beating about the bush... as does, and I think requires, the entire text.

Michael Korovkin
Italy
Local time: 11:40
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in category: 36

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Giles Watson: Hi Michael. We already have enough information. "Morti non collocati" here one element in a list of eight different kinds of folk tale. A concise noun phrase is absolutely necessary to avoid "translation bloat"! Giles
6 hrs
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22 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
graveless dead


Explanation:
Hey, sorry for repeat entry but I've just had this idea and think it's too suitable to omit.
Short (as you require) and yet a bit vaguer and spookier than the, I repeat, semantically excellent "unburried dead".



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Note added at 22 hrs (2009-02-03 17:09:00 GMT) Post-grading
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not to be confused with the Grateful Dads... who are by now all dead, but, one hopes, not graveless

Michael Korovkin
Italy
Local time: 11:40
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in category: 36
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Changes made by editors
Feb 3, 2009 - Changes made by Giles Watson:
Created KOG entryKudoZ term » KOG term


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