中堅産業人

English translation: core industry workers

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Japanese term or phrase:中堅産業人
English translation:core industry workers
Entered by: Anthony Wils (X)

12:19 Mar 23, 2010
Japanese to English translations [PRO]
Education / Pedagogy / industry, vocational training
Japanese term or phrase: 中堅産業人
産業高校ではどんなことが学べますか。
A.商業科においては広く産業界における商業活動や事務および経営管理の知識と技術を習得するとこができます。これらの業務に従事する中堅産業人の育成を目指しています。
I can't decide on a translation for 中堅産業人. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!
Anthony Wils (X)
Local time: 08:29
core industry workers
Explanation:
I can see that it is not easy to convey what the Japanese text is saying. What about this one?
Selected response from:

Yuki Okada
Canada
Local time: 15:29
Grading comment
取り急ぎの翻訳を抱えていた時にご対応を頂いて本当に助かりました。僕も同じような訳語にしようと思っていたし、迅速にConfirmationが出来てよかったなと思いました。こちらの「Core industry workers」 を実際の翻訳の仕事に使わせて頂いてありがとうございました。 四点ではなく三点にした理由は、ほかにもっと詳しく書いてくれた人に対する配慮だけです。ご了承ください。ではよろしくお願い致します。 Anthony Wilson
3 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4the group of highly dependable and productive workforce
humbird
3managers
Yohei Nakamitsu
5 -2leading industrialist(s)
pikachupichu
3core industry workers
Yuki Okada
3leading industry contributors
Yumico Tanaka
3middle-class workforce in various industries
Katsushi Saito
3 -1mid-career professionals
Takeshi Suda
1Elite group of industry professionals
V N Ganesh


  

Answers


33 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
core industry workers


Explanation:
I can see that it is not easy to convey what the Japanese text is saying. What about this one?

Yuki Okada
Canada
Local time: 15:29
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese
PRO pts in category: 43
Grading comment
取り急ぎの翻訳を抱えていた時にご対応を頂いて本当に助かりました。僕も同じような訳語にしようと思っていたし、迅速にConfirmationが出来てよかったなと思いました。こちらの「Core industry workers」 を実際の翻訳の仕事に使わせて頂いてありがとうございました。 四点ではなく三点にした理由は、ほかにもっと詳しく書いてくれた人に対する配慮だけです。ご了承ください。ではよろしくお願い致します。 Anthony Wilson
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
middle-class workforce in various industries


Explanation:
No wonder you are having a hard time coming up with a proper translation for this wording, because even Japanese people, I bet, have much trouble in translating this one. It is obviously a “coined word”. I have never heard of this expression personally. As my suggestion, however, I would say ”産業人” in this context is a collective noun, which can be translated into “workforce, workers or workpeople in various industries”. And as you know, “中堅 …” is equivalent to “middle-class …, middle-ranking …, mid-level …, middle-career …, etc.” in English.

Katsushi Saito
Japan
Local time: 08:29
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear Mr. Saito, Thank you very much for your informative answer. It was helpful. 今後とも宜しくお願い致します。 -Anthony

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21 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
leading industry contributors


Explanation:
The word 中堅者 must have been made from the word 中堅社員.
As shown in the link below, 中堅社員 refers to the employees who have more than 3 years of experiences within the company to execute their strength in their jobs. It often relates to the number of years of their service. They are in the middle rank in terms of performance and position, with a hopeful connotation rather than negative. After 3 years, they know what they are doing and also must hold a position to allow them to deliver their own ideas even to the top management.

However, this doesn't seem to sit comfortably in the context given.

According to the context given, it seems to mean just good employees with potentials, abilities and ambitions to continue to stay with the company at least 3 years, and most likely to stay on to be in the upper position in the industry.

Therefore, I give you my idea as above.

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Note added at 11 hrs (2010-03-23 23:35:02 GMT)
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Just FYI, this is a little topic away from the question.... Japanese people like to pick number 3. Here in this case a 3-year-service is considered to be a time enough to build themselves founded soundly in the organization.
「石の上にも三年」とか。。。

Example sentence(s):
  • Leading Industry Contributors Are Profiled inside New Report \'Analyzing the Chinese Apparel Industry\'.

    Reference: http://shop.jmam.co.jp/data/hrm/sample/mbx_c.pdf
    Reference: http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-167681155.html
Yumico Tanaka
Australia
Local time: 09:29
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese
Notes to answerer
Asker: 田中さん、大変お世話になりました。ご丁寧に訳語の提供も説明も書いて頂いてとても助かりました。3についての話もためになりました。もう少し早かったらこちらの訳語を使ったと思います。 今後ともよろしくお願い致します。 Anthony Wilson

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16 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5
Elite group of industry professionals


Explanation:
Elite/Exclusive/Select group of industry professionals

V N Ganesh
Local time: 04:59
Native speaker of: English
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear V N Ganesh, Thank you for your answer. It was helpful. - Anthony

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2 days 2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
managers


Explanation:
「中堅産業人」 refers to people more important than employees but less important than directors. Then, they should be called managers.

正直、確かな根拠があるわけではありません。けれどマネジメントを学ぶわけですし、それほど的外れでもないかと思います。

Yohei Nakamitsu
Japan
Local time: 08:29
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear KataGatar, Thank you very much for your informative answer. It was helpful. 今後とも宜しくお願い致します。 -Anthony


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  pikachupichu: Managers include administrative people, too. In English, modest terms make the people take them as someone who can do with limitations. 尼崎市立尼崎産業高等学校サイト参照:http://www.ama-net.ed.jp/school/H03/2003/home/qa.htm Young people should be leaders.
4 hrs

agree  Takeshi Suda: ちょっと調べて見たらこれも大正解でした。というかこちらの用法のほうが一般的?
23 hrs
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): -2
leading industrialist(s)


Explanation:
Although 'Chuken' means something middle, in this case, we should consider someone at leading positions in the particular industries、in most cases, small and middle size business owners or management people.

Nucleus meas something core so that this should not be applied.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days6 hrs (2010-03-25 19:11:03 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Leading should be OK, of course top class is not applicable.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days6 hrs (2010-03-25 19:13:46 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

At each school, the students are educated considering the long term success. This is common all over the world.

Example sentence(s):
  • Our students will be leading industrialists someday in future.

    Reference: http://www.nikkan.co.jp/club/
pikachupichu
Japan
Local time: 08:29
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in JapaneseJapanese
Notes to answerer
Asker: Mr. Shimada, Thank you for your answer. I found it helpful. -Anthony


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Yohei Nakamitsu: 原文はもうちょっと謙虚です。個人的にはこっちのほうが好きなんですけどね……
1 day 14 hrs
  -> In case of education purpose, the conerage is a bit wider to make the graduates take the position at the leading pisition at the employers. Chuken should be considered as someone at leading position, although they are supposed not to be a top class.

disagree  Takeshi Suda: KataGatarさんに同感です。: 私の調査ではIndustrialist(産業人)も出て来ましたが、高校卒業そして就職ということを鑑みると、やはりここでは不適だと思います。: 私の父も教授です。Close合意します。
2 days 13 hrs
  -> 日刊工業新聞のサイトのリンクをご覧になってください。一番、シンプルな説明にはなっています。産業高校ということですので、高専、工業・商業高校を前提にけんとうさせていたいた結果の回答です。尼崎市立尼崎産業高等学校紹介サイト:http://www.ama-net.ed.jp/school/H03/2003/home/qa.htm。私は教育者の親の下で育ったこともあり、卒業生への「夢」にら重点に置きますが、一方で、不適との判断もあると理解できます。最初の投稿者も答えを決めたようですし、Closeとします。
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1 day 10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
mid-career professionals


Explanation:
I would like to shed a light on the term by presenting the information on the etymological aspect of the term "中堅."

It originally refers to an elite unit under the direct supervision of a general or admiral.

In kendo (Japanese martial art of sword-fighting,) 中堅 is preceded by vanguards (先鋒・次鋒) and followed by generals (副将・大将) of a team in the fighting order, or the opponent has to defeat the team in the order (i.e. vanguards, 中堅, and then generals.)

In the aforementioned example, it looks like the term originated from the military:
a) is used to represent the expert/core figures in a group, or;
b) analogically used to broadly refer to individuals at the position somewhere between top and introductory levels.

It looks like the description features the versatile or universal aspect of the course as apparently seen in the original: The participant students can acquire a BROAD industrial knowledge and administrative skills, and probably such knowledge and skills are to be broadly applied to various industries at different levels which can be roughly defined as 中堅 (i.e. levels exclusive of management and introductory career levels) to further enphasize the versatile or universal aspect of the course.

Therefore the terget term to be suggested here may be "mid-career" to cover such a broad range of people.

I hope this helps you.


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Note added at 3 days3 hrs (2010-03-26 16:11:34 GMT) Post-grading
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I just found additional information about the term as I did some makeup research.
http://www.tokyo-sangyojin.jp/aboutus/rules.html
東京産業人クラブ会則
第1条 (目的)
本会は中堅産業人の相互の親睦と政治、経済、産業、技術の諸事情について情報を交換し、これを通じて経営者としての資質の向上をはかり、産業会の発展に寄与することを目的とする。

The Article sets out a precondition that 経営者 (≒manager) is a property of 中堅産業人: 中堅産業人 is 経営者; 経営者 may be 中堅産業人, may be not.

In light of this, the phrase 「これらの事業に従事する中堅産業人」represents a conflict because the noun to be modified by 「これらの事業に従事する」(engaging in such tasks) is usually 従業員 (employees,) not managers.

これら refers to 商業活動, 事務 and 経営管理, of which 経営管理 may be quite appropriate for managers.

I haven't reached any definite conclusion, but 産業人 may be managers as well.


    Reference: http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/125718/m0u/%E4%B8%AD%E5%...
    Reference: http://www.kendo.org.vt.edu/starting.html
Takeshi Suda
Japan
Native speaker of: Japanese
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear tony t, Thank you very much for your thorough answer and the interesting reference to kendo, etc. -Anthony


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  pikachupichu: It is senseless to make analogy with 'Kendo'. Stating simply 'disagree' is not enough. Please show us the evidence logically.
20 hrs
  -> That's right, and I did not make analogy to kendo in my note. The term used in kendo is analogically derived from the original meaning, just like the term in the context in question here. Due diligence before degrading people.
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
the group of highly dependable and productive workforce


Explanation:
This online dictionary defines 中堅 as follows:

http://dic.yahoo.co.jp/dsearch?enc=UTF-8&p=中堅&stype=0&dtype=...

〔中心となっている者〕the backbone; the core; the nucleus

Moreover, the following examples in this dic. offer good reference.

・ 中堅の社員〔総称〕
the backbone of a company

・ 彼らは大統領の政策顧問の中堅である
They are central [focal] figures among the President's policy advisers.

・ この人たちは日本経済界の中堅だ
These people form the core [nucleus] of the Japanese economic world.

While above are true, I would like to give a little twist.
What 中堅 essentially mean is a workforce in any industry who are well above novice stage, knowledgeable expert and seasoned worker, who can make independent judgments and decisions, able to lead others in their own sphere of influence, productive and reliable.
Thus my answer.

Please be aware, this is not much to do with classification of workers. What matters here is quality.

HTH

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Note added at 3 days5 hrs (2010-03-26 17:53:30 GMT) Post-grading
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Hi Anthony, I agree that you made a good choice. Yes short word(s) that deliver the gist of the idea is what we seek when we translate.

humbird
Native speaker of: Native in JapaneseJapanese, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear humbird, Thank you for providing such a detailed and helpful explanation of this term and a translation for it that I think really captures the total meaning. I agree with your version, but I decided to use the translation "core industry workers" because of its conciseness and because I feel like "core" captures both the importance of the job itself, as well as that of the worker and his contribution (although having two interpretations makes it a little vague...) Either way, thank you. 今後ともよろしくお願い致します。 Anthony Wilson

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