時計を無くす ｖ 時計を無くしてしまう ｖ 時計を無くしてしまったん
English translation: lose, will lose / (have lost), will have lost / have (already) lost, had (already) lost
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| 00:12 Jan 28, 2003 |
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|  Selected response from: jsl (X) Local time: 01:17 | ||||||
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| 4 +2 | 下記参照 |
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| 5 | To lose a watch, to have a watch lost, to have had a watch lost |
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| 3 | lose a watch / [go and] lose a watch |
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Answers
9 mins confidence: 
To lose a watch, to have a watch lost, to have had a watch lost Explanation: The basic difference lies in the mode of time. You are right. There are in fact subtle differences in nuance depending on the situation, which is hard to generalize. |
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40 mins confidence: 
peer agreement (net): +2
peer agreement (net): +2下記参照 Explanation: 無くす: lose or will lose 無くしてしまう: have lost or will have lost 無くしてしまった: have (already) lost or had (already) lost The basic form, "nakusu", has a non-future/non-past meaning of "losing". However, as the present forms of English verbs can express the near future events (i.e., "He comes to Tokyo tomorrow"), that of Japanese verbs can also refer to such events. e.g.) ポケットに入れていたら、時計をなくしますよ (If you put it in your pocket, you (will eventually) lose your watch. -- kind of warning, e.g., from your mother) "te shimau", on the other hand, is one of two aspectual expressions in Japanese. The other one is "te iru". The aspect refers to the way that a certain activity is conveyed. "te shimau" refers to the perfective aspect (i.e., the completion of action), which is parallel to "have + part participle" in English, whereas "te iru" refers to the continuative aspect (i.e., the continuation of action or state), which is close to "be + doing" in English. "te shimau" does not have a temporal feature, so this can be translated as "have lost" or "will have lost", the latter of which is one of the examples of "near future meaning". So, "時計をなくしてしまう" is "have lost a watch", but this specific expression often refers to a possible future event. "ごはんを食べてしまう" is "have eaten a meal", and this usually means this only. So, the meaning of "te shimau" is pretty much decided by what kind of vert you are going to use. I mean, this meaning difference is determined by the type of verb. "食べる" can be continued as long as you can, but the act of "なくす" cannot be continued; rather, it is almost instantaneous. This difference in verb type yields the difference in the meaning of "te shimau". 無くしてしまった is expressed either by "have lost" or "had lost", and this difference is determined in the actual context, since Japanse uses "ta" for both past tense and perfective aspect. So, it may be "present perfect", or it may be "past perfect". "te shimatta" may involve a kind of denunciation. If you just want to talk about the event of losing your watch, you may use "なくした", but, if you use "なくしてしまった", you may be still regretting that you have lost your watch, and you may be blaming yourself. This difference is very difficult for non-native speakers of Japanese to understand, and we can see some errors even among very fluent non-natives. This is just an explanation, and you will learn the difference according as you encounter these expressions. Good luck. -------------------------------------------------- Note added at 2003-01-28 05:13:04 (GMT) -------------------------------------------------- More comments on ¥"てしまう¥": I may have to revise the meaning of ¥"時計をなくしてしまう¥", since it actually does not mean ¥"have lost a watch¥". As I explained above, this is because of the type of verbs, whether the action is condinued or not. For ¥"時計をなくしてしまう¥", specifically, it would mean ¥"will lose a watch¥" or ¥"will have lost a watch¥". However, *as a generalization*, I would say that the general meaning of ¥"... てしまう¥" is ¥"have + past participle¥". This is true of the vast majority of verbs whose action can be continued, such as ¥"(手紙を) 書いてしまう¥" (have written a letter), ¥"(その映画を) 観てしまう¥" (have seen that movie), ¥"(雑誌を) 読んでしまう¥" (have read the magazine), ¥"(バーンスタインの CD を) 聴いてしまう¥" (have listened to Bernstein¥'s CD), and so on. These meanings are crystal clear and not ambiguous. |
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9 hrs confidence:
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