argumento de fuerza

English translation: to lay down the law

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Spanish term or phrase:argumento de fuerza
English translation:to lay down the law
Entered by: Justin Peterson

16:05 Sep 4, 2018
Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general)
Spanish term or phrase: argumento de fuerza
"Las autoridades alegaron diversos pretextos o simplemente utilizaron "argumentos de fuerza", denunció la CCDHRN."

This has got to have a standard English translation...
Justin Peterson
Spain
Local time: 23:41
to lay down the law
Explanation:
This might work in context

lay down the law
phrase of law
issue instructions to other people in an authoritative or dogmatic way.
Selected response from:

ormiston
Local time: 23:41
Grading comment
This is the idea, in this case
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +2"a fortiori" argument
Rebecca Jowers
3 +3authoritarian/dogmantic argument
Sofia Bengoa
4went ahead
David Hollywood
4Forceful arguments
Steven Huddleston
3to lay down the law
ormiston
3brute force "rationale"/the "reasoning" of the law of the strongest/"argument" of the most powerful
JohnMcDove
3steamrolled an argument
Luis Rey Ballesteros (Luiroi)
Summary of reference entries provided
Context
philgoddard

Discussion entries: 9





  

Answers


3 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Forceful arguments


Explanation:
Sic. Common American English usage.

Steven Huddleston
Mexico
Local time: 16:41
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 78

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  philgoddard: I don't think this is the meaning, though it's not your fault as there was almost no context.
10 mins
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28 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
"a fortiori" argument


Explanation:
As used in legal contexts, “argumento de fuerza” is perhaps more than just a “forceful argument.” As you will see from the texts copied below, “argumento de fuerza,” (in Latin “argumentum a fortiori”) is called “a fortiori argument” in English.


Argumento de fuerza: “con mayor razón”: argumento por el cual se extiende una disposición legal a hipótesis que ella no ha previsto y en las cuales el motivo al que ha legislado se encuentra en un grado mas alto que en la que ha enunciado formalmente. Se llama también “argumentum a fortiori” y tiene dos variantes: “ad maiore ad minus” (quien puede lo mas puede lo menos) y “ad minoris ad maius” (aquello que no puede lo menos, tampoco podrá lo mas).
https://www.monografias.com/trabajos89/argumentacionjuridica...

A fortiori argument means an argument from a strong source. This term is derived from the Latin legal maxim “argumentum a fortiori.” A fortiori argument is applied by following the logic that a point to be proved is followed from a stronger claim. This principle is applied in situations where:
1. a proposition previously given or proven in the argument contains and implies a variety of "weaker" or less contentful materials ; and
2. a proposition being proven is only one of the propositions contained and implied.
There are mainly two types of a fortiori argument. They are:
1. a maiore ad minus, that means from greater to smaller; and
2. a minore ad maius, that means from smaller to greater.
https://definitions.uslegal.com/a/a-fortiori-argument/



Rebecca Jowers
Spain
Local time: 23:41
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 2210

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Robert Forstag: It seems likely that the term would indeed have this specific meaning, especially since it would be unusual to express the idea of “forceful/strong/convincing argument” in this way.
6 mins
  -> Thanks, Robert. This is the "legalese" term, but it may not fit in the context of Justin's text.

disagree  philgoddard: You make this sound like some kind of civilised philosophical discourse. It's not - it's government oppression.
17 mins
  -> Thanks, Phil. Justin asked whether there was a leglese equivalent and that's what I provided. Whether it fits the context is another matter.

agree  MPGS: :-)
1 hr
  -> Thanks, MPGS

neutral  AllegroTrans: As others have said, this is OK for a legal text/pleading etc. but not here
1 hr
  -> Thanks, but as I've said several times here and above, I provided this translation because Justin asked for the "legalese" expression

agree  Yvonne Gallagher: yep, in legalese as seemed to be the question at first
8 hrs
  -> Thanks, Yvonne

neutral  JohnMcDove: While it is great to get this data, in the context, it seems to be "the argument of the guy(s) who have the power and dominance by force of arms, violence, oppression, you name it...
8 hrs
  -> Thanks. As I've repeated several times here and above, I provided this translation because the asker asked for the legalese equivalent.
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33 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
authoritarian/dogmantic argument


Explanation:
I understand they give their dictates as arguments.

Sofia Bengoa
Spain
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  philgoddard: I'm not sure "argument" is appropriate, since there doesn't appear to be any dialogue involved. I think the word is being used ironically. Maybe "stance" or "response".
10 mins

agree  AllegroTrans: dogmatic not dogmantic
1 hr

agree  JohnMcDove: Maybe, authoritarian "arguments", with quotation marks for "arguments" (There is no such thing as an "argument", but brute force...)
8 hrs
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9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
brute force "rationale"/the "reasoning" of the law of the strongest/"argument" of the most powerful


Explanation:
Some other ideas.
The "reasoning" of the power...

The rationale of whoever is the strongest...

The "reasons" supported by power and force...


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Note added at 9 hrs (2018-09-05 01:12:22 GMT)
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Also, it could be something "the rule of force-power-dominance"

As we have the established expression "the rule of law" a variation such as "the rule of the strongest" "the rule of tyrant" or "the arguments of sheer force" or some such, might work in the context.

JohnMcDove
United States
Local time: 14:41
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 43
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9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
went ahead


Explanation:
"simply went ahead" is the idea in this context and register

David Hollywood
Local time: 18:41
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 1197
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12 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
steamrolled an argument


Explanation:
.... or a decision. It seems to fit the context. Hope it helps.

https://socenv.org.uk/blogpost/1617513/291429/BEIS-Brexit-an...

The Gun Control Laws--Portents of Tyranny - Karen Selick
www.karenselick.com/FI9503.html
Their arguments are usually just steamrolled over with the patently false rejoinder that the police can handle this sort of thing, or the irrelevant observation that ...

Luis Rey Ballesteros (Luiroi)
Local time: 16:41
Native speaker of: Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 248
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1 day 9 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
to lay down the law


Explanation:
This might work in context

lay down the law
phrase of law
issue instructions to other people in an authoritative or dogmatic way.

ormiston
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 23
Grading comment
This is the idea, in this case
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Reference comments


12 mins
Reference: Context

Reference information:
It's the final paragraph of the page. I think the idea is "put their foot down".
http://www.diariodecuba.com/derechos-humanos/1535997430_4163...

philgoddard
United States
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 741
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