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dealing with poor source texts | It does not always have to end badly

IrinaN (X) — Thu, 05 Jul 2018 14:41:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: IrinaN (X)
Post title: It does not always have to end badly

I think that poor writing and errors are two different species. I wouldn't lecture a client on his poor writing but simply do my best, if the text is understandable. This part comes with the territory. I can't imagine anyone carrying the mess into the target text "as is".

An actual line from Force Majeure clause:
… flood, fire, earthquakes, hurricanes, government regulations and other natural disasters …

I wrote the author that even though I agree with the notion wholeheartedly, I still need his advice on how to proceed.
The guy (a lawyer) called me almost immediately, still laughing, thanked, I asked him if he had another minute and wouldn’t mind clarifying a couple of other things, he agreed, and, in the end, he also agreed with two of my three comments and told me not to hesitate to contact him any time with questions or “caught mistakes” (quote). The last remark felt sweet, I took it as a sign of trust from the professional lawyer.

No bidder, having 2 pages of anti-corruption slogans in their bid, would blame you for catching "...the entire team can be BOUGHT together..." :-)

The worst offenders are non-native inventors of non-existing technical terms and processes or, as it has been rightfully mentioned before, second and third translations. Just imagine an original filled with some answers given in Kudoz:-) and try to back-translate it! Apparently, the answers infiltrate answerers' own translations or writings, and then we get cordially invited to translate it into our language. I would reject even if I were capable of fixing a thing or two. I have 25+ years of experience but I know my limitations - I can produce a good technical translation in my fields, stand behind it and offer explanations, I've learned a lot but I am still not an engineer to undertake recreation of the entire technical document. The last thing that would be needed there is another amateur. I am not contradicting my previous statements regarding education and specialisms but nothing I have ever said in that regard relates to editors - a technical editor without engineering education is an absurd, IMHO. I wouldn't work with such editor at a gun point.

Maybe my situation is different and, in a way, much easier as I rarely have faceless end clients. Most of the time I work both as a translator and an interpreter for the same major agencies and major projects that last for years. It just happens so that it takes time and practice for people to adapt to the international business environment in person, so to speak, and understand what it takes to communicate through translation and interpretation. They don't swim in it as naturally as we do, yet my experience has taught me that most people, however poor writers they might be, are sane, reasonable and adaptable. In case of errors, there is no need to act on a premise of their overreaction - negativity, especially a harsh one, is certainly not a given, though not entirely impossible.

The insane, unreasonable and inadaptable are free to run their lives without us.

dealing with poor source texts | Wording it

Marcia Neff — Tue, 03 Jul 2018 22:38:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Marcia Neff
Post title: Wording it

[quote]Guillemette Koning wrote:

I also have to deal a lot with poorly written source texts. As many of my translations are of legal texts, I can't just "improve" the text in the target language, as I'm supposed to give a literal translation. My clients frequently haven't written the text themselves either. If they have I sometimes ask them to explain what they wanted to say. Very delicate, as people are easily offended.
If the clients haven't written the text themselves, I explain that the source text is not very clear and that this affects the translation.
And I definitely try to get rid of clients who frequently send me these kind of documents...
[/quote]

That's great advice, thank you. Could you give me specific wording you would use to delicately communicate that to the client? I assimilated to long into the German culture. I am too direct, trying to 'unlearn' it.

dealing with poor source texts | 'Improving' the target text makes the translator look good

Robert Frankling — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 19:35:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Robert Frankling
Post title: 'Improving' the target text makes the translator look good

I humbly disagree with those who say, 'Garbage in, garbage out'...as if we don't have a responsibility to make our customer look good in the target language!

I think that any 'garbage out' makes the translator look like a poor translator or someone who can't write well in his mother tongue. Neither option is good for us.

IMHO, the issue is this: Can I understand the meaning of the sentence enough to translate it understandably in the target language? If so, I'll make the target sentence easy to understand. I take that to be my main job. My translation professor said, 'A translator cannot translate a text until he(she) understands it PERFECTLY.'

Over the years, I've thought a lot about the diplomacy of pointing out errors or opacities. How would YOU react if someone sent an email and said your writing is full of mistakes? Most of us wouldn't know what to do...it's our reputation at stake, isn't it? So what about the source text author's potentially 'hurt feelings' if I point out his(her) mistakes? What do I get from drafting a two hour letter to the author explaining exactly what is wrong with the source text and what I did? Usually, nothing...maybe even resentment! Maybe they won't care.

I finally decided I would just 'do my best' with the text and get 'er done as fast as possible and I've found the customers usually say 'Great translation'.

dealing with poor source texts | A legal approach

Umberto Steindler (X) — Fri, 03 Apr 2015 10:31:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Umberto Steindler (X)
Post title: A legal approach

Legally speaking the translator is a contractor who executes an order placed by a customer, who in turn can be defined as contractee, principal or orderer.
In most civilized countries the contractor (and not only the customer) is protected by the law.
Example. The German Civil Code, (paragraphs 642 – 645) contains provisions to protect a contractor who received faulty or defective “raw” material to carry out his job. These provisions are about 150 years old and they foresee the corresponding indemnification.
The origin of this legislation is obvious. It refers to cases like that of a customer, who orders from a tailor a suit and gives him a bad piece of textile. I assume that most civilized countries have similar provisions.
I am aware of this law, therefore I never had a problem with bad source texts.

dealing with poor source texts | Dealing with poor source texts

Deby Novitz — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 16:19:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Deby Novitz
Post title: Dealing with poor source texts

The first time this happened to me was when I was asked to translate a screenplay from Spanish to English. It was written in Argentine Spanish. The issue I had was badly spelled words and situations that were impossible to reproduce properly.

In the first case, I had to ask the client what he meant. He used the word "valla" in his text which is a word. However it did not fit into the context. What he meant to write was "vaya". Throughout the document he used the "spoken" version of the word, rather than how it is actually written.

The second case, the screenplay written by an Argentine was for the U.S. market. It took place in the U.S. The author ironically had never lived in the US. When I called to his attention the "boss cannot kiss his employees good morning" he was shocked. This happens all the time.

I discussed both situations with my client. He agreed to pay me for my time to rewrite properly the few scenes that were impossible and to pay a surcharge for the bad spelling and grammar.

Each time this situation comes up I am upfront about it with my clients. I cannot spend time on Spanish that is badly written without being compensated. I hope this helps.

dealing with poor source texts | Thank you all for your input!

Maria Popiel — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 14:16:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Maria Popiel
Post title: Thank you all for your input!

This thread has become a great source of possible solutions! Thank you for participating :)

Personally, I don't translate legal documents so reading about problems related to it was very interesting (like intended ambiguity!!!).

In general, I've realised I have two approaches.

When I translate medical documentation I do not allow myself to be (too) creative. Those texts can be poorly written and that's OK. They are not meant to be literature. They are meant to be useful and to deliver important information. What is at stake is someone else's health or even life. That's why I try to be accurate and VERY careful. If in doubt, I do a profound research and ask people who may understand the topic better.

(Well, I do need to be linguistically careful and creative if the text is both medical and literature at the same time!)

But apart from medical translations, I have translated or proofread/edited many articles or semi-literary texts, testimonials, etc. In this kind of jobs, on several occasions I have been lucky to work for some very brilliant people.

And just because they were so brilliant, they were sometimes not very good at conveying their message. They assumed that everyone would understand their mind's shortcuts, I guess.

In such situations, I don't believe the rule "crap in, crap out" would be of benefit to anyone. Or at least I am not able to adopt this attitude even if I have to spend more time translating such texts. I like the final version of translated text to be something that flows nicely and sounds natural in the target language. Sometime it means "crap in, but NO crap out".
I want the final reader to forget - at least while he's reading - that what he's dealing with is a translation.

dealing with poor source texts | Three kinds of poorly written source text

Brian R Mossop — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 13:42:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Brian R Mossop
Post title: Three kinds of poorly written source text

In my experience, there are three very different kinds of poorly written text. First, some texts have bad grammar and spelling but you can tell what the author means. This is easy to handle: you just write the translation in good English, Chinese, Russian or whatever the target language is, and if the client so desires, you supply a list of language errors present in the source text. You don't try to imitate bad writing, for two reasons. First, you are likely to produce a very literal, even a word-for-word translation, which will not be similar to poor writing by native speakers of the target language. Second, translation is not a good way for clients to find out how well the source text is written: all they are seeing is your own ability to write (well or poorly) in the target language.

The other kind of poorly written text is one in which you cannot tell what the author means, not because the subject matter is too difficult for you but because the author is such a bad writer. Here the main problem is just figuring out the meaning. About 20 years ago, I led some workshops here in Canada and wrote an article about methods for figuring out meaning, which you can find here if interested: [url removed] Or just enter "understanding poorly written source texts" in Google.

The third kind is source texts written in the author's second (or third) language. The author may or may not speak the source language well but cannot write it well (because they were not educated in that language). There's a small literature on editing this kind of writing. For instance: Burrough-Boenisch, Joy (2013) Righting English That’s Gone Dutch (3rd edition), Voorburg: Kemper Conseil Publishing. But it is best if you know the author's first language, since they may be mentally translating from that language as they write.

dealing with poor source texts | Been there...

Paul Knox (X) — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 11:24:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Paul Knox (X)
Post title: Been there...

We all share this pain; the finished translation will usually be better than the original text. I am generally surprised when I receive a document that is well-written, makes consistent use of terminology - and has actually been spelling-checked. This will probably remain the exception and not the rule. We grit our teeth, do our best, and point out at least the most egregious errors in translation notes. What is more than annoying, however, is when the customer later complains about the quality of the translation. It is not always possible to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

dealing with poor source texts | A method

Vlad Maccoohin — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 09:49:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Vlad Maccoohin
Post title: A method

I use this method again and again, it works fine in some cases of obscure source texts. I mean, translator's questions to their clients to get explanations from them. In most cases, we often have a translation agency between us and our client, so we ask questions to the translation agency and they transmit the questions to their client. Yes, it works, and not so bad.

Another thing, when the agency's clients themselves didn't understand to the end what they had meant in some sentences written down by them, for example, on the screen of their machine. But it's another story... The stories like mentioned one are really terrific, no words can explain your feelings and wasted time. I exactly know I haven't got magician potions to read client's thoughts

dealing with poor source texts | No-on here has mentioned the main reason

Chaya Cohen — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 06:41:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Chaya Cohen
Post title: No-on here has mentioned the main reason

In my experience, most badly written texts are poor translations - clients and agencies receive a text in one language and translate it into English before sending it on to be translated "professionally" into several target languages - sometimes it appears they've done this using Google Translate...

dealing with poor source texts | Experience

Roberto Quintero-Domínguez — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 03:24:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Roberto Quintero-Domínguez
Post title: Experience

About 15 years ago I was hired by a museum to translate the captions of a photography exhibit coming from LA, CA to Mexico. The author of such captions was the artist himself, and surely enough, he tried to pour his artistic talents into his texts as well. What he ended up with was really awkward, something hard to follow. I had a really good time translating that, doing my best to maintain the register because I thought the author had done that intentionally. I turned my work in, got paid and a few months later I found out they had absolutely hated it and resent it to another translator without saying a word to me.

As many of you have said it, active communication with the client, knowing who the final user of the translated text will be and consideration of potential consequences of faulty writing are all factors to keep in mind before doing the work.

More recentely I translated a book on rural sociology. When I first read the book and realized how poorly written it was I talked to the author and made him see the need to improve the original text, all in a very respectful and illustrating way. He decided to hire me to edit and correct the style of the original and then to translate it.

I find my clients enjoy when I explain to them the importance of a well written text and also when I show them the problems in their originals, mention the possible consequences and tell them how we can correct them. I take them by the hand and they like that.

dealing with poor source texts | Sort it out with your client

Chau Nguyen — Thu, 02 Apr 2015 03:18:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Chau Nguyen
Post title: Sort it out with your client

I would contact my client right away for clarification. If client's response is unsatisfactory or ambiguous, I will reject the job. I had a case where I continued with the poorly written source text and then the client complained why the translation was so bad. Better safe than sorry then.

dealing with poor source texts | And then there are fraudsters...

Nils Andersson — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 23:01:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Nils Andersson
Post title: And then there are fraudsters...

A couple of time, I have been given a source text that is odd insofar
as the translation is e.g. German to English on how to do home schooling.
This is odd as home schooling is illegal in Germany.

Then it turns out they send me a cachier's check (i.e. written by the bank)
with about twice the fee, and tell me to return the overage. Trouble is,
the cashier's check is fake, and would bounce sooner or later.
This happened to me twice, at which point the quality of the "source"
is irrelevant. WARNING!

At another time some private individual sent me a text in German,
I think it was about foreign adoptions. And she kept emailing me
that a check was in the mail . NOTE people who talk overmuch
about payment probably won't pay you. I looked at the German
text and did not think it looked right - often the main point seemed
to be missing. So I wrote the woman, asking what she wanted me
to do.

At the same time, I sent the text to a native German-speaker, asking
for a general opinion. Her opinion was BAD GERMAN. Between us,
we figured out that my prospective client
1) Was a college or high-school student needing to write a report
2) Knew that submitting a downloaded text might backfire - teachers
are wise to this method will Google the submitted material.
3) Had figured out that translation plus backtranslation would
probably mask the source.
4) Had run the English text through Google Translate or similar
5) Wanted me to do a backtranslation (without telling me that)
6) Had no intention of paying me.

OH, and she never answered my email wondering what she
wanted me to do.

dealing with poor source texts | very funny

Mark Possemiers — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 20:57:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Mark Possemiers
Post title: very funny

just had a dutch text like that - full of errors (I stopped at number 150 out of 10,000 word text) and informed the agency. No reply.
I told him that I supposed the text (technical blogs) were probably written with errors so as to make them more "realistic". No reply.
Then I delivered the text and got from the agency following reply:
are you an idiot - didn t they tell you that you have to correct the errors?

Hmmm Simply issued a writ in court for my fees.

dealing with poor source texts | I try to be true to the source...

Eric Wood — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 17:18:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Eric Wood
Post title: I try to be true to the source...

It does not happen often, but I have had to translate some very poorly written recorded statements, and in those cases I end up trying to be as verbatim about it as I can be. One of my main reasons for doing this is to avoid adding my own interpretation to a text the intended meaning of which I cannot be entirely certain about! (Yes, they can be that bad) It also preserves the original communication in the purest form possible.

Of course, your mileage may vary. Mine might also if a text isn't quite as poorly written as those I have in mind. For those with only minor mistakes, I will usually either correct them or preserve it with a [sic], depending on the specific circumstances involved.

Probably the best advice to offer is to #1 listen to your client! If they have an opinion on the matter, take heed of it. But if they would rather leave it up to you, then by all means do what you feel is best and don't let others dictate what is 'correct' and what isn't to you. This is ultimately a judgment call and there's no objective right or wrong answer to govern all situations.

:)

-Eric

[quote]Maria Popiel wrote:

I've been thinking about asking this for a while. I tried to look for a similar topic in the forum, but couldn't find anything, so here I go.

How do you deal with texts that you are supposed to translate but once you get started, you realise that they are full of syntax errors, plagued with strange and non-existing idioms, with thoughts and concepts linked illogically, with gerunds appearing where they shouldn't be, etc., in short, poorly written texts?

How do you translate such texts?

Do you leave the source text intact and just do your best with the translation, eliminating all possible mistakes in the target text (and thus changing quite a lot of details)?

Or do you translate the same way the source text was written? Or maybe you simply refuse to translate them?

Just to be sure we all mean the same: let's assume that you are sure that the author of the source text did not make all those mistakes on purpose. He believes his text is OK and that it conveys the meaning in an adequate way.

So what is your modus operandi in such situations? :) [/quote]

dealing with poor source texts | What type of text are we talking about?

Roy Oestensen — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 15:21:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Roy Oestensen
Post title: What type of text are we talking about?

I have not checked all the comments, but I don't think this question has a clearcut answer. Is this a work of fiction? If so, it would normally be important that the style of the author comes through in the translation. One translator translated Mein Kampf from German to Norwegian, and he would, of course, want to show how badly Herr Hitler did express his thoughts in the original.

If the text is a user manual, on the other hand, it would be imprerative that the translated text is without errors and easy to understand. I would not edit the source, but would send queries whenever there would be unclear statements in source. If I am told that the terminology database has to be followed for consistency's sake, I would follow it, but send a note to the customer whenever I discovered errors in the TM (resently I translated a user manual for a watch with a lot of functions, where both the plug and the outlet both were called "contact". I did follow this, but pointed out the error, as this would be the customer's responsibility.

In other instances my goal would probably be to create a text that did not appear translated, but could have been written by a Norwegian, but where I would point out bad expressions in the source whenever it would be too bad.

dealing with poor source texts | It depends on the text.

Thierry Bourguet (X) — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 14:44:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Thierry Bourguet (X)
Post title: It depends on the text.

I hate loosing my time trying to get and restitute the author's mind.

1/ Before dealing with a new client, I ask 2-3 excerpts in order to estimate the good style of the text.

2/ a/ I find an excuse to refuse the proposed job if it's full of errors.

b/ Once the job accepted, I ask for a longer deadline or a better rate if the text is interesting and counts only 2 or 3 rotten paragraphs. (Generally the deadline is extended).

dealing with poor source texts | Problems with legal texts

Tom in London — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 13:45:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Tom in London
Post title: Problems with legal texts

[quote]Vladimír Hoffman wrote:

I, too, frequently translate legal texts [/quote]

I was recently given a very big job translating the Italian legislation on gambling with machines (those colourful machines I glimpse through the door of gaming rooms, without ever having gone into one; nor do I have the slightest intention of ever doing so).

This legislation proved to be interesting reading; I learned, for example, that with the new digital control systems the gaming room operator can track the behaviour of each individual gamer on each machine and can remotely change the odds on that machine so that a particular gamer can be given a small win to keep them playing and encourage them to waste more and more money, and can then make them lose it all.

But the most intriguing aspect of doing the translation was the fact that this legislation appears to have been intentionally written to be ambiguous at various points.

This gave me the difficult task of identifying the ambiguity and preserving it in the translation. It was one of the most difficult jobs I've ever done, because the ambiguity was buried in torrents of legalistic prose that I had to read again and again and translate many times until it embodied just the right degree of doubtfulness.

I rather suspect that a great deal of legislation is intentionally written so that it creates a lot of interpretative work for the lawyers who write it. This is a nightmare for the translator.

[Edited at 2015-04-01 13:46 GMT]

dealing with poor source texts | Three levels of tackling poor texts

Ronald Matthyssen — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 12:21:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Ronald Matthyssen
Post title: Three levels of tackling poor texts

As someone already stated: most people writing texts are neither skilled nor professionals (except for most copywriters in the marketing business). And many texts are actually not passed on in their original state but in a first translation version. So they may come with flaws already.

I have a three-level approach to this:
- outright mistakes in terms of incorrect information (which I am able to corroborate, of course) are corrected and reported to the client
- incomplete sentences, impossible idiom, one-page sentences (or 5-word ones, for that matter) are edited in the mind but reported beforehand, as the client can demand a literal translation (it's their business)
- anything else linked to spelling, grammar, syntax and any other obvious mistakes in the source text which does not affect its contents, is corrected as if it were written without mistakes and is not reported.

And of course, I invest in a text if I can spot that the author did so too. If it's just a number of words slammed down on a keyboard, I don't feel the urge to turn them into a piano sonata. Accuracy is one, literature is another.

A much bigger problem I have encountered is horrible translations by colleagues which I have to proofread for half the money they got for doing a lousy job. In one case, it was done by someone claiming to be a trained translator with 23 years of experience and he completely dismissed all my comments and changes. I was lucky the agency had another translator in the same language pair to confirm I was right. So rather than looking at source texts, I'd prefer to look at texts to be proofread.

Good luck to you all and keep them words coming!

dealing with poor source texts | Definitely depends on the situation

Phil Hand — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 11:53:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Phil Hand
Post title: Definitely depends on the situation

[quote]Vladimír Hoffman wrote:

I am of the opinion (although it always depends on specific conditions) that my task is not only to help my audience to understand a text originally written in foreign language (English in my case), but also to help an author if it happens that his/her command of English is poor (as can be seen in the case of many non-natives). Actually, I feel obliged to restylize a text into a fluent Slovak, since I am not of the opinion that the poor English was intentional.
[/quote]
As you say, it depends.

If the situation is that the client wants to know what the legal document says, then I agree with the above, and I try to translate based on what the author meant.

But the point with legal documents is that they don't just have meaning, they have legal force. If there is any chance that the client wants to understand the legal force of the document, then they need to know not just what the author meant, but what a judge might interpret the document to mean. If the document is badly written, the client needs to know, and exactly what the flaws are.

dealing with poor source texts | Marylin Monroe?

Samantha King — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 08:12:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Samantha King
Post title: Marylin Monroe?

I do feel comforted by this thread, knowing I am not alone! I also know I am not paid as much as John Sweeney as my word rate does not enable me to indulge in so much research for each translation.

I think there is ample advice here to pick and choose from, just thought I would share my fun with one client who edits a regular magazine that I translate into English. I can guarantee that every issue Ms Monroe will come up and every issue her name will be spelt Marylin at least once.

One issue included interviews with two Hollywood stars and both of their surnames were misspelt. In the end I sent a fairly strong email highlighting a number of errors (in the original) and explained she could either pay me to sub edit as well as translate or sort the crap out herself (a little more politely than that naturally!). She sent me back revised versions with her apologies (one revised version still had a misspelling of the name of the restaurant she was reviewing!).

I agree, not everyone is a born writer but I do get very cross when the client cannot even be bothered to run a spell check on their work.

However, if I really can't grasp the meaning of a sentence I always send it back to the client and politely ask for an explanation. Better they realise it is unintelligible than me try to second-guess the meaning and get it wrong.

dealing with poor source texts | This is very interesting question

Vladimír Hoffman — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 08:03:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Vladimír Hoffman
Post title: This is very interesting question

I, too, frequently translate legal texts, but I am not so sure that they should be translated literally. I am not talking now about sworn translations where literal translating is explicitly required, but about a common, non-sworn texts like agreements, internal regulations etc.
I am of the opinion (although it always depends on specific conditions) that my task is not only to help my audience to understand a text originally written in foreign language (English in my case), but also to help an author if it happens that his/her command of English is poor (as can be seen in the case of many non-natives). Actually, I feel obliged to restylize a text into a fluent Slovak, since I am not of the opinion that the poor English was intentional.

[quote]Guillemette Koning wrote:

As many of my translations are of legal texts, I can't just "improve" the text in the target language, as I'm supposed to give a literal translation...
[/quote]

dealing with poor source texts | Literary texts

J A Lawrence — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 07:54:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: J A Lawrence
Post title: Literary texts

If my client is hoping for his/her work to be published in English, it's a whole different ball game. Experienced professional writers produce work that is sometimes challenging, but basically well written, sometimes brilliant These I translate as closely as possible, sometimes offer alternative words, highlight anything that I've changed - such as idioms -- and so far, happily, my clients know English well enough to understand what and why I may have changed something. I also fact check when I see need.
But some clients are new at writing, know nothing of the requirements of English language fiction publishers, and bring texts that need a lot of doctoring. Tactful negotiation is required, because what I must do is basically become a collaborator so we can end up with a viable manuscript. If the work is any good at all, it can be great fun to do this. It's the author's original story, but I offer various plot, characterization and pacing suggestions and we discuss them. It does mean establishing mutual trust.
In this case, our contract terms are that I am paid a fee up front, and if it gets placed with a publisher later, author gets that amount and we divide the rest.
It's risky, but so is submitting my own work to publishers.

dealing with poor source texts | Put a clause in your client agreement.

Hugo De Zela — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 04:34:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Hugo De Zela
Post title: Put a clause in your client agreement.

I actually have a clause in my agreement that deals specifically with this;

The CLIENT certifies that the SOURCE has been proof-read and is the ultimate and correct version of the document to be translated; as such, any errors, mistakes, obfuscations, lack of clarity or phrasing shall be reflected directly in the TRANSLATION. Any corrections, amendments or changes resulting thereof shall be entirely under the responsibility of the CLIENT and will be included in the invoice as "CLIENT-REQUESTED MODIFICATIONS".

More than one company, after reading the agreement has told me to hold off on the translation so they can give it a once-over before letting me get at it.

dealing with poor source texts | My Translation

Rebecca Viezel Ortega — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 04:04:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Rebecca Viezel Ortega
Post title: My Translation

I sent my Client the translation done exactly as the source read and then called his paralegal that had originally sent it, and asked her to print and have him read it immediately. Then to inform me as to whether or not he wanted that or a "corrected" translation. The reaction was swift and definite: "No! What was she thinking when she wrote this! It makes no sense! We will have the person redo this correctly. Thank you. Your check is in the mail"
(His paralegal and I had a good laugh over it.) and yes, my check arrived on time.

dealing with poor source texts | It depends on how poorly the text is written and what consequences there may be

guillemette — Wed, 01 Apr 2015 02:56:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: guillemette
Post title: It depends on how poorly the text is written and what consequences there may be

I also have to deal a lot with poorly written source texts. As many of my translations are of legal texts, I can't just "improve" the text in the target language, as I'm supposed to give a literal translation. My clients frequently haven't written the text themselves either. If they have I sometimes ask them to explain what they wanted to say. Very delicate, as people are easily offended.
If the clients haven't written the text themselves, I explain that the source text is not very clear and that this affects the translation.
And I definitely try to get rid of clients who frequently send me these kind of documents...

dealing with poor source texts | Believe it or not,

Vladimír Hoffman — Tue, 31 Mar 2015 18:44:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Vladimír Hoffman
Post title: Believe it or not,

but this is almost sure road to exhaustion and burn-out (especially in combination with lower rates). Long-term continuous dealing with badly written texts is tedious and laborous and, in my opinion, it can destroy you as a translator. I know that many people every day perform tedious and laborous jobs, but I think that you can not do it and remain creative.

[quote]Marcelo da Luz wrote:

My first client/proofreader used to say "Don't loose your time, 'crap in, crap out', we don't get paid to recreate rubbish-like source texts".

I aggree with him, all I do is telling the client about the low quality source text, but I usually follow suit the source text. [/quote]

dealing with poor source texts | Ambiguity

Joan Teller — Tue, 31 Mar 2015 17:59:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Joan Teller
Post title: Ambiguity

I've sometimes found that a passage that isn't clear to me in a source text is clear to another reader. Or a passage that has one meaning to me has a different meaning to someone else. Asking someone else to read a questionable passage is often helpful.

In general, though, I'd stick to the source text but without duplicating obvious grammatical errors. If a source text seems like gibberish to me because it's so badly written, I would send it back and refuse to translate it.

But if a text has a lot of repetitions that I find tiresome and redundant, I just translate the text as it is, without comment. If an entire sentence or paragraph is repeated verbatim for no apparent reason, I'd include a note about that.

dealing with poor source texts | You get what you pay for

Marcelo da Luz — Tue, 31 Mar 2015 17:03:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Marcelo da Luz
Post title: You get what you pay for

My first client/proofreader used to say "Don't loose your time, 'crap in, crap out', we don't get paid to recreate rubbish-like source texts".

I aggree with him, all I do is telling the client about the low quality source text, but I usually follow suit the source text.

dealing with poor source texts | Offering corrections as "added value"

Peter Newton-Evans — Tue, 31 Mar 2015 14:48:00 +0000

Forum: Translation Theory and Practice
Topic: dealing with poor source texts
Poster: Peter Newton-Evans
Post title: Offering corrections as "added value"

When a source text is well written but has few mistakes, I often keep a running email open for when I send in the translation, and place the source error and suggested change in a two-column table. Clients receive this as an "added value" service and, in appreciation for my going the extra mile, tend to use my services more often. When a well-written source text has several mistakes, I sometimes keep the original open on my desktop and insert the corrections directly with "track changes" activated, but still as an "added value" service.

However, when the original has many problems and is just poorly written, I often offer the client to correct it for a fee. Sometimes they do not plan to use the text in the source language, but only the translation, in which case they decline. In these cases, I gently suggest that they have the original reviewed prior to translation, in order to improve the final product. Doing this by email increases the chance of hurt feelings, so it is important to discuss this kind of thing in person or over the phone.