https://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/law-contracts/4175273-prima-extra-legal.html
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Glossary entry

Spanish term or phrase:

prima extra legal

English translation:

extra-legal payment/bonus

Jan 7, 2011 16:17
13 yrs ago
35 viewers *
Spanish term

prima extra legal

Not for points Spanish to English Law/Patents Law: Contract(s) labor rights
Hola, foreros.

Vengo a preguntar algo sobre Derecho Laboral. Es un texto sobre empleados de un cultivo floral -en Colombia- a quienes les atropellan sus derechos a salarios dignos y demás prebendas laborales. Esta traducción será leída por empresarios holandeses.

Contexto: " ... sancionar a la mayoría del personal para robarles la prima extra legal, argumentando ..."

Mi intento:
" ... sanction most of the staff in order to avoid the extra bonus payment, arguing that ..."

¡Necesito ayuda URGENTE!

Agradezco de antemano la ayuda que me sea brindada.
Proposed translations (English)
4 extra-legal payment/bonus
4 legal salary addition
Change log

Jan 7, 2011 16:31: changed "Language pair" from "Spanish to English" to "English to Spanish"

Jan 7, 2011 16:31: changed "Language pair" from "English to Spanish" to "Spanish to English"

Discussion

Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
Inconsistency: 1. It refers to payments over and above the employees legal entitlement.
2. However, the ST refers to a situation in which the employer is side-stepping his contractual obligations by...

Reconcile??
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
Final thought. I think our difference may lie in the meaning of 'extralegal' in Spanish. You assume it is something 'not specifically laid down by law'. I assume it is something for which there is no legal obligation. The Real Academia interestingly does not list the word so we might as well leave it there anyway.
mediamatrix (X) Jan 7, 2011:
The question is closed. So too is my participation in this 'discussion' which is irrelevant in the context of Asker's question.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
Mediamatrix. Sorry, you seem to be contradicting yourself. We are discussing whether these payments are legal or extra-legal. You affirmed they are extra-legal, i.e. discretionary. Now you say the employer is sidestepping CONTRACTUAL obligations. If they are extra-legal payments there is no contractual obligation. You can't have it both ways. With respect.
mediamatrix (X) Jan 7, 2011:
@Bill The question is not whether payments/bonuses are due by law, and collective agreements are irrelevant here since it is the employee's individual contract (which may of course include terms agreed in collective bargaining) with has force of law vis a vis the employer.
However, the ST refers to a situation in which the employer is side-stepping his contractual obligations by sanctionning employees without cause, thus rendering them uneligible to benefit from the payments. The ST refers to 'robbery', but that word is clearly being used emotively, not literally.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
Mediamatrix and for prima, eg.
En el caso del salario variable no sabemos cuanto va a percibir el trabajador en todo el año, porque puede
ser que en otro mes gane el doble o más de lo que ganó en este mes, por lo tanto solo sabemos cuanto en
exactitud le corresponde de prima vacacional y de aguinaldo, por lo que su salario es variable, es decir, está
integrada por elementos que no sabemos si se van a obtener o no en el mes siguiente
http://www.elprisma.com/apuntes/administracion_de_empresas/d...

This prima is not discretionary, it is a legal entitlement.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
mediamatrix If they are in a collective agreement they are due by law and are not discretionary.
http://www.todoexpertos.com/categorias/negocios/recursos-hum...

Las pagas extras: El trabajador tiene derecho a dos pagas extras, una en Navidad y otra cuando se fije en convenio. La cuantía de las pagas las fijará el convenio colectivo , siendo su tope mínimo el salario mínimo interprofesional vigente. Salvo acuerdo entre las partes, las pagas extras no se devengarán durante el periodo de incapacidad temporal, ya que durante este periodo el salario se sustituye por una prestación, para cuyo cálculo se computa la parte proporcional de las pagas extras.
http://www.ciberconta.unizar.es/leccion/der004/200.HTM
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
mediamatrix re you question to wendy. Let's distinguish bonus from payment. A bonus is usually extra-legal and discretionary, although not always. Read any convenio colectivo and you will find a host of 'conceptos salariales', legally payable, under the heading of primas, extras etc.
Wendy Cummings Jan 7, 2011:
I can't give specific examples no. But I could imagine for example that the law allows companies to pay employees an extra amount for overtime, or for living in a certain area (cf London weighting). It is not a compulsory payment, but an "extra payment" that is codified in law.
mediamatrix (X) Jan 7, 2011:
@Wendy Can you think of any kind of 'bonus or payment' which is simultaneously 'extra' and 'allowed (or provided for) by law'? Laws, as a general rule, define minimum payments; 'extras' are, by definition, a matter for individual or collective bargaining and are set out in employee contracts.
Wendy Cummings Jan 7, 2011:
I'm with Bill as regards interpretation... but I don't like using"legal" as an adjective in this way; I would expand and say "...the extra bonus/payment allowed [to them] under law"
mediamatrix (X) Jan 7, 2011:
@Bill The text is not about Spain.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
mediamatrix In Spain, pagos extras are common. a pago extra legal would not be the same thing as a pago extralegal.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
mediamatrix That would be extralegal, not extra legal. May be a misprint though. The fact that they are being 'robbed' would suggest, IHMO, that the payment is in fact legally due, is thus an extra payment of the many types found in hispanic labour law, otherwise it would be a discretionary or 'extralegal' payment and thus would need resort to robbery by way of imposing penalties in order to elude it.
mediamatrix (X) Jan 7, 2011:
@Bill It is quite precisely NOT 'their legal extra payment'; extra legal means 'over and above the entitlement defined in law'.
Bill Harrison (X) Jan 7, 2011:
I think your answer will do just fine. Or, penalise the majority of the personnel in order to deprive them of their legal extra payment.

Proposed translations

25 mins
Selected

extra-legal payment/bonus

It refers to payments over and above the employees legal entitlement.

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Note added at 30 mins (2011-01-07 16:47:23 GMT)
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Reading between the lines of the context we haven't seen, it suggests that the employees have some extra-legal perks under the terms of their contracts, but that that these perks are conditioned by the employees having a 'clean' record; so, to avoid having to make the payments, employees are being sanctioned without due cause, hence deprived of the extra-legal payments.
Note from asker:
Hola, soy Banheza. Me remito a ti para agradecerte tus aportes en este hilo. Han sido fabulosos y tú eres la única que ha captado la idea pues eres nativa y vives en Sur América, lo que hace de tus ayudas, algo bastante acertado. Gracias mil por argumentar válidamente tus aportes. Eres un sol.
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1 hr

legal salary addition

In my view.
Peer comment(s):
neutral Jennifer Levey : Google says, confirming my own serious doubts: No se ha encontrado ningún resultado para "legal salary addition".
3 hrs
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