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дышловая лошадь, дышловики

English translation: pole horse, poler; shaft horse; thill horse, thiller; if proximity to carriage wheels is stressed, wheel horse, wheeler

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
Russian term or phrase:дышловая лошадь, дышловики
English translation:pole horse, poler; shaft horse; thill horse, thiller; if proximity to carriage wheels is stressed, wheel horse, wheeler
Entered by: Tim Sergay

02:33 Oct 25, 2011
Russian to English translations [PRO]
Livestock / Animal Husbandry / 19th-century Russian draft horse harnessing terms
Russian term or phrase: дышловая лошадь, дышловики
From contemporary historical novel by Chudakov, "Lozhitsia mgla na starye stupeni" (2004, p. 461): Напрашивался разговор о самой запряжке цугом. Лошадь, на которой сидел форейтор, называлась подседельная (понятно: на остальных были чересседельники), справа от него— подручная; первая, ближняя к экипажу пара — кони дышловые, или дышловики.

Is there an English term for the ДЫШЛОВАЯ лошадь, or ДЫШЛОВИК?

Thank you, esteemed colleagues!
Tim Sergay
Local time: 00:56
дышловая лошадь = pole horse
Explanation:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pole horse

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Note added at 2 days13 hrs (2011-10-27 16:06:46 GMT) Post-grading
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my pleasure, Tim
Selected response from:

Alexey Suspitsyn
Russian Federation
Local time: 09:56
Grading comment
Dear Alexey, Thank you very much for this answer, which certainly had eluded me. I will use it in the book with great confidence. Please read responses to Rachel Douglas and Jack Slep as well. I think the full glossary entry should include the variants "shaft horse," "thill" and "thill horse" as well. Best wishes, --Tim
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
5thill horse
Jack slep
4 +1дышловая лошадь = pole horse
Alexey Suspitsyn
3the wheelers (here)
Rachel Douglas


  

Answers


1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
the wheelers (here)


Explanation:
I know the dictionaries say pole-horse, and these may indeed be hitched to either side of a pole, but in your context where it's contrasting this pair to the leader pair (the postillion's horse, aka the near horse) and the one on the right, the off horse, it might make sense to call them the wheelers.



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Note added at 1 hr (2011-10-25 04:10:54 GMT)
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Here's a guy explaining how to hitch up a team to drive four-in-hand (without a postillion, but that's OK), talking about leaders and wheelers.
http://www.frogmusic.com/drivingpairs/articles/the-road-to-d...

Or, since your original gives the term two ways, you could use two in English, saying, "the two pole-horses, or wheelers".

Rachel Douglas
United States
Local time: 00:56
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear Rachel, It agree that it makes sense to distinguish "leaders" from "wheelers," but as I mentioned to our colleague Jack Slep, it seems I need to reserve "wheeler" for коренная лошадь and коренник. Yermolovich allows for synonymy of "wheeler" and "shaft horse" in English, and this seems to correspond satisfactorily to коренник и дышловик. I am very pleased with your suggestion about reflecting in English the two-stroke presentation of the term in Russian (кони дышловые, или дышловики), but I will try to reflect the cognate relationship between the two synonyms as well, which English allows me to do: "the pole horse, or the poler."

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1 day 11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
thill horse


Explanation:
a horse that goes between the shafts and supports them

Jack slep
Local time: 00:56
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 12
Notes to answerer
Asker: Dear Jack, Thank you for this fantastic second term! The translation could very legitimately go "thill horse, or thiller" rather than "pole horse, or poler." The only reason I'm preferring "pole" to "thill" is the greater frequency and familiarity of the morpheme for English-speaking readers. "Thill" must go into the glossary entry for дышловик and indeed for оглобля and дышло, which is almost always encountered in the phraseologism закон, что дышло.... LingvoPro gives коренник for "thiller," which confuses me: it seems дышловик is a better match for both thiller and shaft horse. I have looked into dividing Kudos points between responses, but as I recall it's not possible. Please accept my thanks and best wishes. --Tim

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14 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
дышловая лошадь = pole horse


Explanation:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/pole horse

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Note added at 2 days13 hrs (2011-10-27 16:06:46 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

my pleasure, Tim

Alexey Suspitsyn
Russian Federation
Local time: 09:56
Native speaker of: Russian
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
Dear Alexey, Thank you very much for this answer, which certainly had eluded me. I will use it in the book with great confidence. Please read responses to Rachel Douglas and Jack Slep as well. I think the full glossary entry should include the variants "shaft horse," "thill" and "thill horse" as well. Best wishes, --Tim

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  cyhul
3 days 5 hrs
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