| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Which University? Thread poster: Sarah Truesdale
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I am from NZ and need to choose between doing my Masters in Translation at the Uni of Manchester or the Uni of Edinburgh. They are both top universities, but ...
Ed has more expensive fees and living costs, but offers a 2 year work visa if you graduate in Scotland ...
Manchester's course appeals more to me and is cheaper and seems friendlier, but there is no guarantee that I can get a visa to work there afterward...
Has anyone studied at either Uni or li... See more I am from NZ and need to choose between doing my Masters in Translation at the Uni of Manchester or the Uni of Edinburgh. They are both top universities, but ...
Ed has more expensive fees and living costs, but offers a 2 year work visa if you graduate in Scotland ...
Manchester's course appeals more to me and is cheaper and seems friendlier, but there is no guarantee that I can get a visa to work there afterward...
Has anyone studied at either Uni or lived in one or both cities?
I am just about at my wit's end as each place has as many advantages as the other. It is hugely expensive for a New Zealander to go to the UK to study, so I need to make the right decision. Any advice? ▲ Collapse
| | | | sarahl (X)
Local time: 06:08
English to French
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If I may ask? Your second language is French, how about a French-speaking country, eg France or Belgium?
I don't know about Belgium but if you're in France on a student visa you are allowed to work, full-time during vacations and part-time during the semester.
| | | | RobinB 
United States
Local time: 08:08
German to English
| Heriot-Watt more practical | May 15, 2006 |
Sarahbis wrote:
I am from NZ and need to choose between doing my Masters in Translation at the Uni of Manchester or the Uni of Edinburgh. They are both top universities, but ...
I assume that by "Edinburgh" you mean Heriot-Watt, which has a good reputation for practical all-round courses.
The Manchester MA (ex-UMIST) is much more theoretical and not necessarily suitable for people wanting to work as a translator.
I think you should look less at the cost, and more at the respective benefits of the two quite different courses.
| | | | Williamson
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:08
Flemish to English
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or in other words: what is your Return on Investment of time, effort and money?
Bear in mind that outside the translation-market, a degree is languages is not highly valued in terms of financial recompensation.
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| Why not the UK? | May 16, 2006 |
I've done the research and some of the best Uni's are in the UK, plus studying in a francophone country seems often to only allow you to do English to French and not the other way around. Also, Anglophone qualifications seem to be more widely recognised.
PLUS, Edinburgh and Manchester are the ones I have applied for and been accepted to: it's kinda too late to apply for more, since I have already deferred twice while trying to get funding (which I still don't have).
sarahl wrote:
If I may ask? Your second language is French, how about a French-speaking country, eg France or Belgium?
I don't know about Belgium but if you're in France on a student visa you are allowed to work, full-time during vacations and part-time during the semester.
| | | | | Not Heriot-Watt | May 16, 2006 |
No, I mean the University of Edinburgh itself. I had a friend who went to HW and detested it. It's all a bit too politically-oriented for my tastes at HW, I think. I am more focused on and interested in the literary side. Both Ed and Man cover this and technical translation.
Both Man and Ed courses are very theoretical I gather.
RobinB wrote: Sarahbis wrote:
I am from NZ and need to choose between doing my Masters in Translation at the Uni of Manchester or the Uni of Edinburgh. They are both top universities, but ... I assume that by "Edinburgh" you mean Heriot-Watt, which has a good reputation for practical all-round courses. The Manchester MA (ex-UMIST) is much more theoretical and not necessarily suitable for people wanting to work as a translator. I think you should look less at the cost, and more at the respective benefits of the two quite different courses.
| | | | | We are in the translation market aren't we? | May 16, 2006 |
Thanks for your advice, but why would I be thinking in terms of industries outside the translation market? That's the business we're in, isn't it? Or have I misunderstood you?
I also have a degree in Diplomacy and International Relations with Languages, so I'm sure that that combined with a Masters in Trans will stand me in good stead.
Time, effort and money are required for both courses, but unfortunately I think I will probably have to go for Edinburgh simply becaus... See more Thanks for your advice, but why would I be thinking in terms of industries outside the translation market? That's the business we're in, isn't it? Or have I misunderstood you?
I also have a degree in Diplomacy and International Relations with Languages, so I'm sure that that combined with a Masters in Trans will stand me in good stead.
Time, effort and money are required for both courses, but unfortunately I think I will probably have to go for Edinburgh simply because of the work visa I can get by graduating there (2 years, no strings - Fresh Talent Scheme)... despite the fact that Manchester seems to have a course that is better suited to me.
I just wish there was some way to do the Manchester course, but have the Scottish work visa. Oh well. You can't have everything I guess.
Williamson wrote:
or in other words: what is your Return on Investment of time, effort and money?
Bear in mind that outside the translation-market, a degree is languages is not highly valued in terms of financial recompensation. ▲ Collapse
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| Part-time work in France vs UK | May 16, 2006 |
Oh and you can work part-time during term time and as much as you want in the holidays in the UK as well, so that's not really an issue. Thanks though.
sarahl wrote:
If I may ask? Your second language is French, how about a French-speaking country, eg France or Belgium?
I don't know about Belgium but if you're in France on a student visa you are allowed to work, full-time during vacations and part-time during the semester.
| | | | skport
Brazil
Local time: 10:08
Portuguese to English
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| mountains, city, sea AND literary culture. | May 16, 2006 |
If you still have not made up you mind, my vote is for Edinburgh.
To me, Edinburgh is without a doubt the most beautiful city in Europe, and a wonderful place to study.
I would say that the decision comes down to where you want to live when you are studying rather than the course, as it sounds like both courses have advantages and disadvantages. The post study visa aspect in Scotland sounds like a great opportunity as well.
Here's what Robert Burns had to s... See more If you still have not made up you mind, my vote is for Edinburgh.
To me, Edinburgh is without a doubt the most beautiful city in Europe, and a wonderful place to study.
I would say that the decision comes down to where you want to live when you are studying rather than the course, as it sounds like both courses have advantages and disadvantages. The post study visa aspect in Scotland sounds like a great opportunity as well.
Here's what Robert Burns had to say on the issue:
Address to Edinburgh
Edina! Scotia's darling seat!
All hail thy palaces and tow'rs,
Where once, beneath a Monarch's feet,
Sat Legislation's sov'reign pow'rs:
From marking wildly scatt'red flow'rs,
As on the banks of Ayr I stray'd,
And singing, lone, the lingering hours,
I shelter in they honour'd shade. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Williamson
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:08
Flemish to English
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I will not be around any more within 25 years, so it will be none of my concerns, but within now and about 20-25years, the translation-market will be reduced to retyping/redictating texts.
Word-processing, voice-recognition, CATs, machine-translation and huge database swill all be integrated into one (machine/robot) linked to another alike system.
The only task of the translator will consist in fine-tuning rough sentences.
What you choose today, will have an implication on wha... See more I will not be around any more within 25 years, so it will be none of my concerns, but within now and about 20-25years, the translation-market will be reduced to retyping/redictating texts.
Word-processing, voice-recognition, CATs, machine-translation and huge database swill all be integrated into one (machine/robot) linked to another alike system.
The only task of the translator will consist in fine-tuning rough sentences.
What you choose today, will have an implication on what you do tomorrow. Unless at the international and some national institutions in mulitilingual countries, there is no career path waiting for you with translation.
By the way, you translate into the language you master upto an adequate level to do so. If you learnt that language outside a school by living in a country where it is the every day language, why bother to get a translation degree. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Why be a translator at all? | May 16, 2006 |
I am sure that you are trying to be helpful, but you seem to have a very negative opinion of your own field!
While it is true that machine translation is progressing in leaps and bounds, I think that we are still a LONG way away from them replacing humans. Currently, machines can not always (or at least not accurately) convey subtleties of emotion, nuances within humour, cultural idioms and slang. Humans are needed for that.
Why get a translation degree at all?? Becau... See more I am sure that you are trying to be helpful, but you seem to have a very negative opinion of your own field!
While it is true that machine translation is progressing in leaps and bounds, I think that we are still a LONG way away from them replacing humans. Currently, machines can not always (or at least not accurately) convey subtleties of emotion, nuances within humour, cultural idioms and slang. Humans are needed for that.
Why get a translation degree at all?? Because some of us choose to study what we enjoy and THEN try to make a career out of it. Some of us have faith that humans will not be overrun by machines, a la The Matrix or War of the World, because humans are what make society what it is. Human are still needed to control/direct/programme the machines and so, we will always be needed.
I disagree that there is no career path waiting for me and I think that that is a really irresponsible and cynical thing to say to someone just starting into this career. Have you no faith??
Also: why bother to get a degree? Because, like it or not, qualifications are needed to get jobs, as is experience. Why not do it for the love of languages? Perhaps you have lost this?
S
Williamson wrote:
I will not be around any more within 25 years, so it will be none of my concerns, but within now and about 20-25years, the translation-market will be reduced to retyping/redictating texts.
Word-processing, voice-recognition, CATs, machine-translation and huge database swill all be integrated into one (machine/robot) linked to another alike system.
The only task of the translator will consist in fine-tuning rough sentences.
What you choose today, will have an implication on what you do tomorrow. Unless at the international and some national institutions in mulitilingual countries, there is no career path waiting for you with translation.
By the way, you translate into the language you master upto an adequate level to do so. If you learnt that language outside a school by living in a country where it is the every day language, why bother to get a translation degree.
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| Positive advice about which university | May 16, 2006 |
Thank you so much for a positive (and poetic) response! That's great advice and I think that it does come down to the work visa and the beauty of the city. Even tho the course at Man may be broader, Ed is a more prestigious Uni and, in the end, both will give me a good grounding in Translation.
If you are still in Ed when I get there in August, I'll shout you a coffee (or a beer!)
Merci encore!!
| | | | Williamson
United Kingdom
Local time: 14:08
Flemish to English
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| Where do you want to go today and tomorrow? | May 17, 2006 |
I guess I am some 20 years older than you. Been there, done that –FWIW, I have a yellowish piece of paper which says that I have earned an M.A.in Translation-,
In translation, you can only enhance volume and make good money with it, but unless an additional education or a twist of luck, there is no classical career ladder to climb with a degree in Translation.
How can you apply for a job in a marketing, finance, accounting, ITC-department if you do not know anything about these s... See more I guess I am some 20 years older than you. Been there, done that –FWIW, I have a yellowish piece of paper which says that I have earned an M.A.in Translation-,
In translation, you can only enhance volume and make good money with it, but unless an additional education or a twist of luck, there is no classical career ladder to climb with a degree in Translation.
How can you apply for a job in a marketing, finance, accounting, ITC-department if you do not know anything about these subjects?? A company consists of management, finance, sales, marketing, itc, specialised departments.. and female translators, well, they become executive assistants (euphemism for "secretaries of the big boss")..
Whether or not you have a degree in Translation remains the same...
Many present on this site don't have one and yet they translate.
“Armed with dictionaries we attack all texts”only to end up asking for and offering money to the specialist who provided the correct terminology.
An M.A. in Translation is a basis, but at the end of 4 or 5 years study you are a generalist, specialised in languages and with those languages, you will have to make a living for the rest of your working life.
I wonder whether you will still be so enthusiastic about translation when you have had the experience of chasing invoices, discussing with a client whether words and terminology are correct or not, requests for rate reduction for whatever new productivity enhancement tool that comes on the market, having been paid after 60-120 days instead of the convened 45 or not having been paid at all. What will you learn about the fiscal aspects of the profession???
Translation schools are good at word, but lousy at "money". And money is what it is all about, isn't it.
Where was I.T. when you were born (16Kb processor) ? Where is it today (4.3 Ghz) and where will it be in say 10 years from now…. Today Babylon 6, Translation @ a click. Not yet linked to the dictionaries which come with Babylon. That will be version Babylon 7.0... linking with databases 8.0 and voice-integration 9.0??? By the time you are about 40, technology will be so advanced that translation will only consist in rewriting texts. This will most certainly be true in the major languages.
With the Bachelor/Master-structure valid Europe -wide, where in Europe you are going to study remains the same. However, it does not remain the same in the sense that as a native of English, imho, it would be better to live into an environment where you have to use your other language instead of remaining in an English language-speaking environment.
Whatever your life-path may be, good luck…
[Edited at 2006-05-17 07:10]
[Edited at 2006-05-18 06:49] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jeff Allen
France
Local time: 15:08
Multiplelanguages
+ ...
| studying at French universities | May 20, 2006 |
sarahl wrote:
If I may ask? Your second language is French, how about a French-speaking country, eg France or Belgium?
I don't know about Belgium but if you're in France on a student visa you are allowed to work, full-time during vacations and part-time during the semester.
Sarahbis wrote:
I've done the research and some of the best Uni's are in the UK, plus studying in a francophone country seems often to only allow you to do English to French and not the other way around. Also, Anglophone qualifications seem to be more widely recognised.
PLUS, Edinburgh and Manchester are the ones I have applied for and been accepted to: it's kinda too late to apply for more, since I have already deferred twice while trying to get funding (which I still don't have).
Sarah,
Studying at a French university doesn't necessarily limit you to English to French. You make of it what you put into it. You can start by that and just simply do both throughout your coursework. Be creative. Be ambitious. Don't just stick to the mould that the course program statement might indicate. I've completed several degrees at French universities and always pursued innovative ideas and completed them.
Some French universities are a bit stickler on their program.
One of the ways to get around this is not to specifically pursue a degree in Langues Etrangere Appliquees (LEA) but to do one in Sciences du Langage (SDL) and simply focus on the applied aspects of translation in your coursework and thesis/dissertation.
It is also possible to combine a Francais Langue Etrangere (FLE) with the SDL program which give you the French language teaching credentials (FLE is the equivalent to TEFL/TESL/TESOL for English).
Angophone qualifications are not necessarily more widely recognized. They might just be more known. My French university degrees have never been an obstacle to getting jobs in the language industry. In fact, it did the contrary and helped a lot. Just have to have English translations of them.
As for costs, studying at a French university will cost you a fraction of the tuition at UK universities. It's about 200 Euros per year (but probably not for ESIT and ISIT programs). Not great services and the secretary's office is closed half the time, but 200 Euros is quite affordable.
The books and housing will cost you more than than tuition.
As for getting registered, it is not too late to apply to all the French universities you want to. You have until Sept/Oct (except for ISIT and ESIT programs).
Sarah L: As for working in France as a student, it is a bit more complex that holiday periods and school periods. The foreign student must usually be enrolled in a 3eme cycle degree program to have access to a work permit. So this would be for DEA/DESS/Doctorat programs. However, that has been changing and they are now shifting it to Licence/Masters/Doctorat.
The work permit allows a foreigner to work up to half-time during the school year. But this depends on the French local dept that you live in. When I lived in the Lyon area, I could only work up to 10 hours per week. But in the Paris area, I could work up to 20 per week. That was back in the early to mid-90s when I had student work permits.
In certain depts, you have to renew the work permit every 3 months (in Lyon) and in the Paris area, I only had to renew it every 6 or 9 months if I recall correctly.
Jeff
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