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French term

AllegroTrans

United Kingdom

472 questions

sous statut néarlandais

French to English Law/Patents Law (general) Birth certificate (Belgium)

This is in a birth certificate issued in Belgium.

...fils de XXX (father's name) né a YYYY (in France) résident a (ZZZ)(address in Belgium), sous statut néarlandais, et de AAA (mother's name)
...

Something tells me that this is something to do with the French/Flamish language divide in Belgium, but how to express it in English?

Maybe "subject to Dutch-speaking jurisdiction"?
Any improvement would be welcome

Proposed translations (English)

4 +3	of native Flemish speaker status	Andrew Bramhall
3 -1	residing at [...], in the Dutch speaking region	Daryo

Discussion

Daryo Oct 1, 2019: you could always "phone a friend" in some Registre d'état civil in Belgium, best in Brussels as it's a bilingual region. It they don't know, who will? Take it from a self-confessed Internet addict: talking to live people on a landline might seem out of fashion, but when you manage to get hold of the right people it can do marvels ... Or try to get hold of the relevant legislation, where everything regarding how to keep a Register of Births should be explained ... this mention "sous statut néarlandais" most probably wasn't added at someone's whim, there must be some law / regulation / directive / instructions on the basis of which it was done. @ Germaine the WHOLE OF [fils de] XXX (father's name) né a YYYY (in France) résident a (ZZZ)(address in Belgium), sous statut néerlandais [ et de AAA (mother's name)] is ONLY about the father - the father was born in France and is a resident of Belgium - can't see why would THAT make him a Dutch national? OTOH couldn't agree more about: je ne vois toujours pas comment résider dans le quartier chinois de Montréal (Québec, Canada) me donnerait (ou à ma fille!) un "native Chinese speaker status"
AllegroTrans (asker) Sep 25, 2019: How good it would be.... to have some input from a Belgian! Any Belgians out there?
Germaine Sep 25, 2019: Il me semble que vous confondez FR "statut" (EN - status) with EN "statute" (FR - loi) (à ne pas confondre non plus avec statuts et statutes). So, should you read the various meanings of "statut" in a French dictionnary, I think that you'll find that the most literal meaning of "sous statut néerlandais" (in this context) is "as a national of Netherlands". Alors papa serait effectivement un ressortissant néerlandais vivant en Belgique dont l'enfant est né en France et pour ce que j'en ai lu (qui n'est pas grand chose!), il semble que le parent doit déclarer sa nationalité pour la conférer à l'enfant au lieu de la nationalité française qui lui est attribuée par défaut. Mais à supposer que tout ça n'ait absolument rien à voir, je ne vois toujours pas comment résider dans le quartier chinois de Montréal (Québec, Canada) me donnerait (ou à ma fille!) un "native Chinese speaker status" ni ce que la langue parlée là où résident les parents vient faire sur un certificat de naissance.
Daryo Sep 25, 2019: the most literal meaning for "sous statut néarlandais" would be "subjected to the laws of Netherlands" - which makes no sense whatsoever, and is not quite the same as this French born father being "a national of Netherlands" [= "un ressortissant des Pays-Bas", NOT "sous statut néarlandais"]... must be something else.
Germaine Sep 25, 2019: AllegroTrans, Avec toutes ces virgules et insertions, qu'on lise né en France... sous statut néerlandais ou résidant au 00, tellerue, telleville (Belgique), sous statut néerlandais j'entends "avec/sous la nationalité néerlandaise". Quoi qu'il en soit, pour ma part, je clarifierais avec les intéressés avant de faire intervenir la langue dans un certificat de naissance.
Daryo Sep 24, 2019: OK .. although if you go into more details, you get this: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/82/Language... Still doesn't change the key point: "sous statut néerlandais" is far more likely / makes far more sense to be seen as a reference to the geographical location [i.e. the region where the official language is Dutch/Flemish Dutch], not as being applicable to this person (born in France!) having any kind of "under Dutch authority" personal status official enough to be included in a birth certificate.
writeaway Sep 24, 2019: The official language in Flanders is Dutch Flemish people speak Dutch, NOT Flemish
Daryo Sep 24, 2019: That could simply mean that the place of residence [of the father] is "sous statut néarlandais" The person that happened to be living in a part of Belgium "sous statut néarlandais" wouldn't be given any choice whatsoever - any official communication would have to be in Flemish. Not exactly "a personal choice" (once you made the choice to reside there)... Frontière linguistique en Belgique La frontière linguistique en Belgique est une frontière administrative fixée en 1962 qui partage géographiquement le pays en trois régions officiellement unilingues (les régions flamande, wallonne et allemande) et une région bilingue (la région de Bruxelles). https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontière_linguistique_en_Belg... If you are desperately looking to end up with a thumping headache, try to understand the language politics of Belgium ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Belgium https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flanders https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Language_legislation_in_Belgiu... https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Législation_sur_l'usage_des_la... https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontière_linguistique_en_Belg... etc etc [who needs Balkans ...]
writeaway Sep 24, 2019: Dutch-speaking jurisdiction would work The people are Flemish, the language is Dutch. At least that's what a Flemish neighbour here in Belgium once told me (in Dutch.....)

Proposed translations

27 mins

Andrew Bramhall

United Kingdom

4959 answers

Native in English

of native Flemish speaker status

In other words, the subject is a walloon; your instincts are correct. Nothing to do with citizenship per se;

Note from asker:

Many thanks; I've actually used "of Flemish-speaking status" just in case this person has Flemish as his second language and has opted for it as a preference

Peer comment(s):

agree	Lara Barnett 16 mins
	Thanks
agree	Yolanda Broad 27 mins
	Thanks
agree	EirTranslations 2 hrs
	Yhanks
neutral	writeaway : The people are Flemish, the language is Dutch. 2 hrs
	Yes, thanks;
disagree	Daryo : Walloons speak FRENCH // someone born in France to have "native Flemish speaker status"(if that exists at all as a legal category in Belgium)??? // Looks like you wrongly assembled the Belgium's linguistic puzzle... 3 hrs
	Whatever;
agree	GILLES MEUNIER 2 days 23 hrs
	merci;

-1

4 hrs

Daryo

United Kingdom

4921 answers

Native in French

French term (edited): résident à [adresse], sous statut néarlandais

residing at [...], in the Dutch speaking region

"sous statut néarlandais" would refer to the adresse, i.e. the region of Belgium where the father is residing.

"sous statut néarlandais" wouldn't have anything to do with his personal status - it would be the status of the territory where he's residing.

As far as I know ALL citizens of Belgium have the same personal status - what language they speak is their private business but the official language imposed on them depends on where they live - in which region.

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Note added at 4 hrs (2019-09-24 18:49:59 GMT)
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Frontière linguistique en Belgique

La frontière linguistique en Belgique est une frontière administrative fixée en 1962 qui partage géographiquement le pays en trois régions officiellement unilingues (les régions flamande, wallonne et allemande) et une région bilingue (la région de Bruxelles).

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontière_linguistique_en_Belg...

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Note added at 9 hrs (2019-09-24 23:56:40 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

most literally "sous statut néerlandais" would mean "subject to Dutch laws / the laws of Holland" - [you do get few ghits in that meaning] but for this text it makes no sense whatsoever - not applicable to someone born in France and residing in Belgium - can't be that.

Absolutely no ghits for "sous statut néerlandais" used in a birth certificate - so what's left is trying to find out what could make sense.

Peer comment(s):

agree	Ben Gaia 33 mins
	Thanks!
disagree	Andrew Bramhall : Interesting that you believe " néerlandais" refers to an address in Belgium; this is incorrect; it's a language distinction; FYI, Wallons speak Walloon, Flamandes speak Flemish Dutch, a variant of normal Dutch . Get your facts straight before disagreeing 2 hrs
	I don't have to and I'm not in the habit of just "believing" anything (I leave that to you) I just follow known facts - what I know already about Belgium and what relevant additional facts I can find. Where have you found this "native status" idea?
disagree	GILLES MEUNIER : Traduction littérale peu inspirée..... 8 days
	boring ...

French term

sous statut néarlandais

Discussion

Proposed translations

of native Flemish speaker status

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residing at [...], in the Dutch speaking region

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French term

sous statut néarlandais

Discussion

Proposed translations

of native Flemish speaker status

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residing at [...], in the Dutch speaking region

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