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Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

Œufs de ponte au sol

English translation:

Cage-free eggs or barn eggs

Added to glossary by Mark Nathan
May 5, 2017 12:39
7 yrs ago
11 viewers *
French term

Œufs de ponte au sol

French to English Other Food & Drink Food Production
The problem here is not so much the translation "floor-laid eggs" as the marketing implications.

I am translating the packaging for some madeleines, and they state (seemingly positively) that their pastries only contain "Œufs de ponte au sol".

What is confusing me is that research suggests that "Œufs de ponte au sol" are to be avoided!
(risk of rolling/breakage/contamination with poop).

So my question is, is there some suggestion (perhaps incorrect) that "Œufs de ponte au sol" are somehow better in terms of being free-range, open-air etc ?

And the bottom line, is "floor-laid eggs" the best translation, given its negative connotations?
Proposed translations (English)
3 +5 Cage-free eggs
4 +1 Barn eggs
2 +2 free-range eggs
3 Free range enggs
3 indoor; deep-litter indoor housing
References
https://www.ciwf.fr/animaux-de-ferme/pou...
cf.

Discussion

Rachel Fell May 5, 2017:
@Mark: the term "barn eggs" has been around in the UK for ages - https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/barn-eg...
Herbmione Granger May 5, 2017:
Also not "floor-laid," since Code 2 corresponds to 2 "les œufs issus de poules élevées au sol" (merely from Wikipedia.fr though)
Herbmione Granger May 5, 2017:
I would say "barn eggs" or "cage-free eggs" but certainly not "free range." "Au sol" corresponds to Code 2 of the EU system. I have not been buying free-range eggs because of the bird flu in Germany this winter, but I don't think that this was the reason for marketing this way. The classic picture of chickens laying eggs is in a cozy barn with fresh hay and many lofty spaces to choose from.
philgoddard May 5, 2017:
What an interesting question! I've learned a lot, and will look more closely at packaging from now on. (What they do to male chicks doesn't bear thinking about.)
Mark Nathan (asker) May 5, 2017:
I think it's for the European market.
writeaway May 5, 2017:
Keep in mind the use of the term It's an ingredient on packaging. Barn eggs can conjure up the image of dead and injured hens in some tightly-packed barn. Free-range is not wrong and imo is more marketing-friendly.
Alison Wedley May 5, 2017:
Who is the target market? USA, UK, Australia? Guess all these countries have different words and welfare standards.
Mark Nathan (asker) May 5, 2017:
Thanks Sheri "Barn eggs" appears to be the European term, although I must admit I had never heard of it.
Sheri P May 5, 2017:
@Mark "Barn eggs" or "cage-free eggs", depends on your audience. I've never seen/heard the former in the U.S., so that might be a factor for consideration. The important thing to note is that "au sol" is not the same thing as "free range", since hens who lay "au sol" eggs do not necessarily have access to the outdoors.
Alison Wedley May 5, 2017:
I would say barn-laid eggs. Or simply barn eggs.
Mark Nathan (asker) May 5, 2017:
I guess you're right. But there are definitely negative connotations to the French term.
Mark Nathan (asker) May 5, 2017:
Free-range in a restricted area? Given that "free-range" can mean not in cages, but in barn containing thousands of other chickens.
writeaway May 5, 2017:
this idea is to show that the eggs stem from chickens who flew the coop/or weren't cooped up.
Mark Nathan (asker) May 5, 2017:
Yes, that's my point Why put "ponte au sol" on your packaging if it is a problem?
mrrafe May 5, 2017:
outdoors Free range usually means that the chicken can walk outside the barn. Au sol seems to mean laying outside the individual coop - not necessarily on the floor, but possibly on the ground outdoors - and I've never seen it advertised in US. In my experience a chicken may hide eggs outdoors, perhaps so the farmer won't take them. You may have read this: http://basse-cour-et-voliere.over-blog.com/article-pour-evit...

Proposed translations

+5
35 mins
Selected

Cage-free eggs

Compare the tables below in EN and FR. "Au sol" does not imply "free range."

http://www.humanesociety.org/issues/confinement_farm/facts/g...

https://www.l214.com/marquage-des-oeufs-et-etiquetage
Note from asker:
Thanks, I also found this, which would suggest "barn eggs" http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink/foodanddrinkadvice/11411975/What-are-the-most-ethical-eggs-you-can-buy.html
Peer comment(s):
agree Alison MacG : or barn eggs (other refs https://www.ciwf.fr/alimentation/quels-oeufs-choisir/ https://www.ciwf.org.uk/media/5235012/How-you-can-help-Layin... http://www.elliotteggs.co.uk/the-eggs )
9 mins
agree nweatherdon
14 mins
agree philgoddard : Good references. And Jennifer (below) is wrong, though this is not about the UK anyway: http://www.fwi.co.uk/poultry/all-major-retailers-committed-t...
1 hr
neutral Jennifer White : not a term commonly used on UK packaging./ Wrong? Have never seen this on packaging. Checked madeleine ingredients this morning. Not used.
1 hr
agree Michele Fauble : For US
1 hr
agree Nikki Scott-Despaigne : Yes, this is not "free-range" which is "élevé en plein air". As "cage-free" also involves indoor hen-keeping then yes, this works (best for US?). "Barn eggs" works for the UK/Europe.
4 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thanks everyone."
+2
8 mins

free-range eggs

as guess of sorts...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free-range_eggs

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Note added at 9 mins (2017-05-05 12:48:42 GMT)
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pls read "a" guess of sorts

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Note added at 15 mins (2017-05-05 12:54:57 GMT)
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"élevé en plein air" would apply to the chickens (see that all the time in supermarkets).

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Note added at 18 mins (2017-05-05 12:57:48 GMT)
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C'mon Marc. You know the rules. Post that under a new Kudoz question...
Note from asker:
Yes, it would be nice to be able to put that on the packaging, but wouldn't that be "élevé en plein air" (which apparently also gets abused as a term)?
So which came first, the chicken or the egg?
Peer comment(s):
agree Tony M : Yes, that's essentially what it means; MORE than 'just' 'free range', they are also 'free-laying' — but no need to go into such niceties of detail for Asker's purpose.
2 mins
neutral mrrafe : I guess "free range" can be used in any context because it's meaningless anyway
14 mins
whatever
neutral nweatherdon : "free range" has diverse uses, and sometimes means almost nothing. Needs to be more specific
41 mins
agree Rachel Fell : f.r.e. from hens free to roam outdoors
58 mins
agree Jennifer White : for the context, this is fine IMO
2 hrs
neutral philgoddard : I hate to disagree, but this is not correct :-) And it's not a nebulous term - it has a clear legal definition, in the EU at least.
2 hrs
cage free eggs would make me smile if I saw that as an ingredient.
disagree Nikki Scott-Despaigne : A reasonable guess, but "free-range" is not correct here. Egg termino is very specific. There's a genuine pecking order. Lots of well-meaning TV items about avoiding the "3" is you want a "real" egg. I'd love 'care-free" egg to have been right!
4 hrs
or cage-free as opposed to caged eggs. love it..... have you actually ever seen it listed as an ingredient on a pastry wrapper? EU correctness or not, it's going to make amusing reading
Something went wrong...
18 mins

Free range enggs

I think this is the same thinking as raw milk in Canada. It is illegal but people still get it from local farms because it is considered better for you. I noticed on Linguee that in some places 'Œufs de ponte au sol' has been translated as Free range eggs.
It seems that 'floor laid eggs' has a negative connotation in English, but free range (though deceptive) is positive.

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Note added at 19 mins (2017-05-05 12:58:52 GMT)
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oops. typp. That should read 'free range eggs'
Example sentence:

Farine de froment, huile végétale non hydrogéné (palme, colza, coco), sel, oeuf en poudre (oeufs d\'élevage au sol).

heat flour, vegetable oil non-hydrogenated (palm, colza, coconut), salt, egg powder (free range eggs).

Something went wrong...
+1
2 hrs

Barn eggs

As this is for the European market I would suggest barn eggs as the most appropriate term. Or you could say 'contains eggs laid by hens housed in barns'.
Reference:

https://www.l214.com/marquage-des-oeufs-et-etiquetage

https://www.egginfo.co.uk/egg-facts-and-figures/production/barn-egg

Peer comment(s):
agree Nikki Scott-Despaigne : http://www.ukip.org/eu_rules_threaten_free_range_egg_farmers
2 hrs
Something went wrong...
4 hrs

indoor; deep-litter indoor housing

https://www.economie.gouv.fr/dgccrf/Publications/Vie-pratiqu...

(or https://www.economie.gouv.fr/files/files/directions_services...

"Direction générale de la concurrence, de la consommation et de la répression des fraudes.

Produit de consommation courante, les œufs sont soumis à une réglementation qui permet d’en assurer la traçabilité et de fixer les normes de commercialisation qui leurs sont applicables."

[...]


"Désignation du mode d'élevage.
Elle est obligatoire sur les emballages et se limite à quatre expressions : « œufs de poules élevées en plein air », » œufs de poules élevées au sol », « œufs de poules élevées en cage », « œufs de poules élevées selon le mode de production biologique » ou « œufs biologiques » ou terme dérivés tel que « œufs bio » (cf. règlements CE n°834/2007 et n°889/2008."

The idea behind posting this source is to indicate that this there are distinctions to be made between the various production methods. Check out CE n°...



http://www.volaillesoeufsbio.com/fr/quest-ce-quun-oeuf-bio/
Note the categories here. And compare with the Wikipedia entry below.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Egg_marking

roducer code[edit]

German organic eggs with only the EU egg code
The European Union has defined an egg code that consists of[2]
a number indicating the method of production
a two letter code for the country of origin
a registration number indicating the hen laying establishment
The egg stamp is required in the EU on all class A eggs unless these are sold directly on the farm.
Method of production[edit]
The first number of the egg code defines four levels of production quality in decreasing order - the requirements on organic farming eggs extend on the requirements of free range eggs.
0 = organic egg production
1 = free-range eggs
2 = deep litter indoor housing
3 = cage farming
In the European Union these levels have strict minimum requirements:[3]
caged: this had a requirement of 550 cm² minimum space per hen. However the EU has banned battery cages by 2012 through an update of EC Directive 1999/74/EC. The new minimum is 750 cm² in furnished cages.
indoor: the minimum space per hen is increased to 1100 cm² (or 9 hens per square meter). No cages are allowed and instead the hens may sit on an elevated porch in large barn that has a floor covered with sawdust or better.
free-range: in addition to the barn (with 1100 cm² indoor space per hen) there must be an outdoor space for the hens with continuous daytime access. There is a minimum of 4 m² of outdoor space per hen.
organic: the indoor space is increased to 1667 cm² (or 6 hens per square meter); the available outdoor space has a minimum of 4 m² with grown pasture for the poultry, and the remaining food must come from organic production.


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Note added at 4 hrs (2017-05-05 17:05:25 GMT)
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http://www.ukip.org/eu_rules_threaten_free_range_egg_farmers

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Note added at 4 hrs (2017-05-05 17:10:24 GMT)
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So, as I understand this, we can safely rule out "free-range" and "cage farming". It would appear to be a form of "indoor walk-free (my term) farming, with 9 hens/m².

In the table of the http://www.volaillesoeufsbio.com/fr/quest-ce-quun-oeuf-bio/ website, they are clearly indoor ("en claustration") and the hens/m² match ("9 poules/m², avec 4 niveaux superposés possibles").

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Note added at 4 hrs (2017-05-05 17:11:38 GMT)
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The eggs "élevés au sol" are one grade below free-range eggs.

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Note added at 4 hrs (2017-05-05 17:17:17 GMT)
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http://www.plamondon.com/wp/deep-litter-chicken-coops/

https://hencam.com/henblog/2013/12/why-i-dont-use-deep-litte...

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Note added at 4 hrs (2017-05-05 17:31:49 GMT)
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Yeah, looks like folk are running around like headless chickens with relabelling even having to be done!

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-39037406
Note from asker:
Thanks for the research Nikki, I like the UKIP reference, it illustrates the love-hate relationship so many farmers must have with the EU.
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

4 hrs
Reference:

https://www.ciwf.fr/animaux-de-ferme/poules-pondeuses/elevag...

Les différents modes d'élevage des poules pondeuses

Accès à l’extérieur Non



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Note added at 7 hrs (2017-05-05 20:18:56 GMT)
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Indeed. I have to say I always understood free-range to mean that the hens were scratching around outside. In England at least. Not just in a barn or whatever.
Note from asker:
Thanks Wendy, confirmation that it's worth buying organic eggs.
Something went wrong...
1 hr
Reference:

cf.

Poplars Farm Eggs produce only free range eggs from hens that have the freedom to roam on Cheshire grassland which are fed a high quality grain diet.
Eggs are produced and packed on the farm and delivered directly.

http://www.foodnw.co.uk/membership/directory/m36851/

free range eggs from hens raised in the open air, as it says here -

Egg farming methods

Organic farming (code 0) : the hens are fed with organic feed (at least 95%). They have access to open-air runs where they have shelters and vegetation. The AB (Agriculture Biologique) label certifying organic farming and the EU Organic logo are displayed on the packaging.
Free range egg farming (code 1) : the hens have access to open-air runs during the day. The wording "free range eggs from hens raised in the open air" is written on the packaging. The Red Label eggs originate from this type of farming.
Barn eggs (code 2) : indicates that the hens move freely indoors. The wording "Barn eggs from hens roaming freely indoors" is displayed on the box.
Standard farming (code 3) : it represents 70% of French egg production. In compliance with the new European standards, the hens are in groups of 20 to 60, are provided with perches, nest boxes and a carpet litter to scavenge and peck on. These collective housings meet the behavioural needs of the hens whilst at the same time offering cheap eggs to the consumers.

http://www.fermedupre.fr/main/en_GB/the-egg.html

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Note added at 1 hr (2017-05-05 14:00:25 GMT)
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Certified Humane in the US (in case of interest):

http://certifiedhumane.org/free-range-and-pasture-raised-off...

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Note added at 8 hrs (2017-05-05 21:16:35 GMT)
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in the UK -
Barn systems

In barn systems hens have freedom and space to move around within a building. Perches are provided for roosting, as well as material to dustbathe and forage in, and nest boxes. Some systems are ‘multi-tier’, providing additional levels to use above the ground.

https://www.rspca.org.uk/adviceandwelfare/farm/layinghens/fa...



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Note added at 11 hrs (2017-05-05 23:58:48 GMT)
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bit more egg info.:

https://www.ciwf.org.uk/farm-animals/chickens/egg-laying-hen...

https://www.ciwf.org.uk/our-impact/food-business-programme/g...
Note from asker:
Thanks Rachel, "oeuf de ponte au sol" are code 2, which would make them barn eggs. I guess it's an example of EU regulations being useful for a change.
Peer comments on this reference comment:
agree Michele Fauble
1 hr
Thank you Michele :-)
agree Nikki Scott-Despaigne
3 hrs
Thank you Nikki :-)
agree writeaway : does say free range eggs. oh, the shame.......
5 hrs
Thank you writeaway :-)
Something went wrong...
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