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guêtres de laine sur un knickers

English translation: woollen gaiters worn with (knee-)breeches

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:guêtres de laine sur un knickers
English translation:woollen gaiters worn with (knee-)breeches
Entered by: James Calder

11:47 Feb 6, 2008
French to English translations [PRO]
Textiles / Clothing / Fashion / Ski wear
French term or phrase: guêtres de laine sur un knickers
From a text about a certain French tennis player that has branched off into 1920s ski wear for some reason:

Dans les années folles, une clientèle privilégiée découvre les stations des Alpes et le ski. Le confort des tenues en maille s’impose. Les femmes enfilent des ***guêtres de laine sur un knickers***, un pull, une écharpe, des gants et des bottes.

So far I've only been able to come up with "wool gaiters over shorts". Doesn't sound right, though, does it?
James Calder
United Kingdom
Local time: 19:34
woollen gaiters worn with (knee-)breeches
Explanation:
Looking at pictures of "un knickers" they are what I'd call breeches. Breeches were worn by horse-riders because in the days before lycra they were much more comfortable. (I remember suffering Bedford cord jodphurs as a child, but you had to invest in proper riding boots to wear breeches.)

"VERDANT GREEN] there was a pair of woollen comforters knit by Miss ..... with knee-breeches and gaiters, and a massive watch-seal dangling from under his ..."
www.gutenberg.org/dirs/etext03/verda10.txt - 702k

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Note added at 1 hr (2008-02-06 13:26:44 GMT)
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"Between the days of the goldrush and the late 1920s, typical ski attire advanced to more traditional outdoor clothing. This included woolen hunting clothes which were unquestionably warm but tended to restrict movement, knickers and riding breeches which provided a bit more freedom, and baggy pants that tucked into socks but made wild flapping noises as the skier went down the slopes. "
http://aspenhistory.org/tipchp6.html

This site also refers to skiers wearing "knickers". This may be OK in US English but sounds silly in UK English:
"Tired of their inability to ski in comfort, women began to challenge the standards imposed upon them by society. By the late 1920s they had tossed their skirts aside for good and replaced them with the knickers long worn by men. Not only did this change provide them with more freedom, it also offered them a touch of style. From the mid-1930s on, style would become a standard aspect of all men’s and women’s ski fashions."

"The well-known ski resort of Popova Sapka lies above Tetovo in the Sar ... "chakshiri" - breeches and gaiters which have been retained till now in the man's ..."
www.eurotravelling.net/fyrom/tetovo_culture.htm

"But among their 60 lines are gaiters, over-. breeches, ski-pouches, children’s .... loose fitting woolly shirts, baggy tweed breeches (or jeans) hairy wool ..."
web.bi.no/.../a6cb7066ea59eda6c12567f30056ef4d/$FILE/F2%20-%20Parsons&Rose.PDF

Selected response from:

B D Finch
France
Local time: 20:34
Grading comment
Went with this as "plus-fours" are more commonly associated with golf. Also this is a GB English text and "breeches" sound more appropriate than "knickerbockers".
Thanks to everyone for answering anyway.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +2knitted legwarmers over knee-length (ski) pants
Anne de Freyman (X)
4woollen gaiters worn with (knee-)breeches
B D Finch
3NFG to add to ormiston wollen gaiters over knickerbockers
Melzie
3woollen gaiters worn over plus fours
ormiston


  

Answers


19 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
NFG to add to ormiston wollen gaiters over knickerbockers


Explanation:
I've put medium confidence because when I did a google images 'knickers+ski" there were loads of pictures from English speaking sites with knickers being the correct word for this type of short trousers with gathered into a 'cuff' just below the knee. see alpine-joe.com
However, I think it very much depends on your target, as a GB English one would probably expect to be seeing something a little skimpier!!
so yes, plus fours is a possibility but they are very much associated with golf... or is that just me?

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Note added at 22 mins (2008-02-06 12:10:39 GMT)
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here you go

http://www.answers.com/topic/knickerbockers

Melzie
Local time: 20:34
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  ormiston: sorry here you are;artmam.net/Wholesale_Clothing_In_Los_Angeles-9.htm
18 mins
  -> thanks, ormiston
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9 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
woollen gaiters worn over plus fours


Explanation:
they must overlap a bit below the knees! the dictionary does say plus fours is fore gentlemen so perhaps you could use 'knickerbockers'. Will check further....

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Note added at 40 mins (2008-02-06 12:28:31 GMT)
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to me knickers are frilly and no gaiters could hope to cover them ! but always have to bow to websites....

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Note added at 42 mins (2008-02-06 12:30:16 GMT)
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it seems to be all a questin of a couple of inches ! our 'bible' says:
Plus fours - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia- [ Traduire cette page ]Plus fours are loosely tailored slacks cut 4 inches below the knee (and thus four inches longer than traditional knickerbockers, hence the name). ...



ormiston
Local time: 20:34
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 26

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Sandra Petch: I love the origin of the word "plus fours"!
37 mins
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44 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
knitted legwarmers over knee-length (ski) pants


Explanation:
maille = knitted rather than just woolen.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2008-02-06 13:03:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

If you need retro, I suggest maybe "knitted gaiters over breeches". Breeches seems more general and accurate than plus-fours and not as misleading as "knickers"

Anne de Freyman (X)
United Kingdom
Local time: 19:34
Native speaker of: French
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  ormiston: this does sound nice (but retro enough ?)
4 mins
  -> Thanks. Note added!
neutral  B D Finch: Cosy, but a bit anachronistic.
33 mins
  -> See note
agree  Claire Chapman: with your translation. However, depending on the translation of the entire paragraph, I might say, "woolen leg warmers" because the fact they are knitted is previously mentioned and traditionally, leg warmers are knit garments.
4 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
woollen gaiters worn with (knee-)breeches


Explanation:
Looking at pictures of "un knickers" they are what I'd call breeches. Breeches were worn by horse-riders because in the days before lycra they were much more comfortable. (I remember suffering Bedford cord jodphurs as a child, but you had to invest in proper riding boots to wear breeches.)

"VERDANT GREEN] there was a pair of woollen comforters knit by Miss ..... with knee-breeches and gaiters, and a massive watch-seal dangling from under his ..."
www.gutenberg.org/dirs/etext03/verda10.txt - 702k

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2008-02-06 13:26:44 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"Between the days of the goldrush and the late 1920s, typical ski attire advanced to more traditional outdoor clothing. This included woolen hunting clothes which were unquestionably warm but tended to restrict movement, knickers and riding breeches which provided a bit more freedom, and baggy pants that tucked into socks but made wild flapping noises as the skier went down the slopes. "
http://aspenhistory.org/tipchp6.html

This site also refers to skiers wearing "knickers". This may be OK in US English but sounds silly in UK English:
"Tired of their inability to ski in comfort, women began to challenge the standards imposed upon them by society. By the late 1920s they had tossed their skirts aside for good and replaced them with the knickers long worn by men. Not only did this change provide them with more freedom, it also offered them a touch of style. From the mid-1930s on, style would become a standard aspect of all men’s and women’s ski fashions."

"The well-known ski resort of Popova Sapka lies above Tetovo in the Sar ... "chakshiri" - breeches and gaiters which have been retained till now in the man's ..."
www.eurotravelling.net/fyrom/tetovo_culture.htm

"But among their 60 lines are gaiters, over-. breeches, ski-pouches, children’s .... loose fitting woolly shirts, baggy tweed breeches (or jeans) hairy wool ..."
web.bi.no/.../a6cb7066ea59eda6c12567f30056ef4d/$FILE/F2%20-%20Parsons&Rose.PDF



B D Finch
France
Local time: 20:34
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 112
Grading comment
Went with this as "plus-fours" are more commonly associated with golf. Also this is a GB English text and "breeches" sound more appropriate than "knickerbockers".
Thanks to everyone for answering anyway.
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)



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