| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | The translation business is the best! Thread poster: SWEDISH-TRANSLATION.com - your Swedish translation partner (X)
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Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO) (X)
Local time: 00:52
German to English
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| ProZ not the only source | Dec 1, 2001 |
Absolutely correct, Henry.
But I do wonder about those individuals you mentioned, the ones that get all their jobs through ProZ. They must be happy with a low income, then.  If I had to rely on \"ProZ clients\" only, I\'d be in the poorhouse by now (in terms of the rates they are willing to pay).
Here\'s my advice:
- stay away from public bids
- \"market\" your ProZ ... See more Absolutely correct, Henry.
But I do wonder about those individuals you mentioned, the ones that get all their jobs through ProZ. They must be happy with a low income, then. If I had to rely on \"ProZ clients\" only, I\'d be in the poorhouse by now (in terms of the rates they are willing to pay).
Here\'s my advice:
- stay away from public bids
- \"market\" your ProZ profile: it is your best chance of finding work
- co-operate with other ProZ translators: but don\'t let down your guard. Be as careful and prudent in dealing with them as you would be when dealing with agencies. So far, these co-operations have worked well for me (with the exception of one \"rotten apple\").
- and, above all, explore other avenues (eg, your own website, other directories, associations (!), Yellow Pages, \"word of mouth\", networking, etc.)
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| | | | H.A. (X)
English to Russian
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| Good bye, ProZ | Dec 1, 2001 |
Quote:
On 2001-11-30 09:00, Henry wrote:
Ask yourself if investing the $120 will result in finding one or more clients who, over the course of your relationship, will generate that much or more in income.
Henry, I paid my $120 not as an investment - I have my long-term clientele. I paid the fee simply because I do not like free stuff. What I have got in return is: non-stop insults in pidgin E... See more Quote:
On 2001-11-30 09:00, Henry wrote:
Ask yourself if investing the $120 will result in finding one or more clients who, over the course of your relationship, will generate that much or more in income.
Henry, I paid my $120 not as an investment - I have my long-term clientele. I paid the fee simply because I do not like free stuff. What I have got in return is: non-stop insults in pidgin English from an incompetent moderator at KudoZ and the yellow smilies next to each job posting even before I had a chance to read them. My two emails to you were left without response.
I wish you well in your business. No need for refund. ▲ Collapse
| | | | gianfranco 
Brazil
Local time: 01:52
Member (2001)
English to Italian
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| Proz, my personal experience | Dec 1, 2001 |
I would like to publish my personal experience with ProZ.
I started freelancing in May, after 6 years of work in-house, and one of my first steps has been to visit many translators\' directories on-line, to circulate my name and make it visible to potential customers.
I have visited them all and joined quite a few. Well, at least if they were working and appeared to be worth typing in my details as some are definitely a waste of time.
ProZ i... See more I would like to publish my personal experience with ProZ.
I started freelancing in May, after 6 years of work in-house, and one of my first steps has been to visit many translators\' directories on-line, to circulate my name and make it visible to potential customers.
I have visited them all and joined quite a few. Well, at least if they were working and appeared to be worth typing in my details as some are definitely a waste of time.
ProZ impressed me for a number of features, including the Kudoz area, but not only. There were no forums still, they arrived a little later. The site has improved a lot since, and I know there are many more improvements to come.
From the strictly \'business\' side, I can summarize my results in a few points:
1. Acquired 3 new customers (not at low rates) and they are coming back for more projects.
2. Received help by two very expert colleagues when I was in trouble for a very difficult translation.
3. Started to co-operate with four colleagues, with whom I am in constant contact for reciprocal help. I have never met them personally but we feel very close, professionally and personally.
4. Learned a lot
5. Helped several colleagues, and surely they will help me in return when I will be in need.
6. I am considering forming a team, to acquire larger jobs, through ProZ or not, but I have located in ProZ the potential candidates for this project.
7. Finally, I have the feeling of not being alone even when I work all day alone from home. Going back to the start of this thread, ProZ has contributed to make my work the best and most interesting work in the world.
I think that this is more than enough for considering ProZ as a unique resource for translators. Definitely it is very important for me.
And, yes, I have joined as a Platinum member. One hundred and twenty bucks!
The point is that \"each\" and \"every one\" of the points above, if I could put a monetary value on them, is worth more than the membership fee and still, paying is not compulsory or essential for doing all of what I have done.
I just love to support the site.
Gianfranco Manca
[ This Message was edited by: on 2001-12-01 16:16 ] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO) (X)
Local time: 00:52
German to English
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Very good summation of the ProZ experience.
Yes, we have all found some good clients through ProZ, there is no denying that. I only doubt whether anyone could make a living on ProZ clients alone.
But, yes, yes and yes: ProZ makes for an overall good experience, and there will be changes in the new year, which will hopefully address most (all?) of the current problems.
Hafiza: don\'t throw in the towel just yet. I can\'t say anything ... See more Very good summation of the ProZ experience.
Yes, we have all found some good clients through ProZ, there is no denying that. I only doubt whether anyone could make a living on ProZ clients alone.
But, yes, yes and yes: ProZ makes for an overall good experience, and there will be changes in the new year, which will hopefully address most (all?) of the current problems.
Hafiza: don\'t throw in the towel just yet. I can\'t say anything about your negative experience with the moderator you mention, but stay on and try to look past those darker sides. ▲ Collapse
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Maya Jurt
Switzerland
Local time: 06:52
French to German
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| Upgrade your rates - bid with higher rates! | Dec 2, 2001 |
I did not join proZ to get jobs - rates in Switzerland are at $0.15 for a very simple text, up to $ 1.00 for complicated translations.
But I bid whenever I have time and only for jobs I do not want. And 0.15 is the rate I ask for, asking for an answer only if \"quality is more important than price\". I simply do it to tell the potential clients that not everyone works for 0.04 a word.
Surprise, surprise, I got 4 jobs (I did not want) in the last three we... See more I did not join proZ to get jobs - rates in Switzerland are at $0.15 for a very simple text, up to $ 1.00 for complicated translations.
But I bid whenever I have time and only for jobs I do not want. And 0.15 is the rate I ask for, asking for an answer only if \"quality is more important than price\". I simply do it to tell the potential clients that not everyone works for 0.04 a word.
Surprise, surprise, I got 4 jobs (I did not want) in the last three weeks. One of them was turned down first. Then they came back saying that the translator had \"fallen ill\", could I please do 4000 words in two days (awful lnaguage, tricky terms!) I did it and got immediately another job from this client. I may lead to something better...
Some people may continue to bid for very low rates and I understand this. They do not live, eat, pay taxes in Geneva or New York.
But if you are a professional, live in high cost-of-living countries and want to earn your money with translations, bid on as many projects as possible (especially the one\'s you don\'t want)and charge at least 15 cents.
If there are more expensive translators than cheap one\'s bidding, potential clients may ask questions about the experience of the \"dumplings\".
Try it, you may like it, because it works.
Greetings to all
Maya
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| | | | Maya Jurt
Switzerland
Local time: 06:52
French to German
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Here\'s my advice:
- stay away from public bids
How many profiles do you have on proZ? I just discovered that you are G2E. Or do you change your page every week or so?
This is just to say:
DO NOT STAY AWAY FROM PUBLIC BIDS.
Show your colleagues how much you charge. Be the first bidder, the next one will see your rate.
Why not try it?
Greetings
... See more
Here\'s my advice:
- stay away from public bids
How many profiles do you have on proZ? I just discovered that you are G2E. Or do you change your page every week or so?
This is just to say:
DO NOT STAY AWAY FROM PUBLIC BIDS.
Show your colleagues how much you charge. Be the first bidder, the next one will see your rate.
Why not try it?
Greetings
Maya ▲ Collapse
| | | | Werner George Patels, M.A., C.Tran.(ATIO) (X)
Local time: 00:52
German to English
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I see your point. Maybe we should continue to place public bids in order to open outsourcers\' and other translators\' eyes.
However, there is no point in bidding on jobs posted by outsourcers in \"cheap\" countries (e.g., today\'s German-English technical translation: the guy does not identify himself properly, but judging from his name, he is probably located in Hungary - forget about it!. Plus, he gives only a Hotmail address - HELLLLLLLLOOOOOO!).
| | | | Greta Holmer
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:52
Dutch to English
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| I agree: Translation is the best! | Dec 2, 2001 |
I first started work as a translator as an apprentice to my mother and inherited this business when she passed away in 1999.
I always thought I would hate it and briefly tried teaching in a secondary-school in England before returning to translation with my tail between my legs.
My mother in-law particularly feels that I do not have a proper job, especially as my husband and I run the business together from home - she has often said that he does a woman\'s job and should ge... See more I first started work as a translator as an apprentice to my mother and inherited this business when she passed away in 1999.
I always thought I would hate it and briefly tried teaching in a secondary-school in England before returning to translation with my tail between my legs.
My mother in-law particularly feels that I do not have a proper job, especially as my husband and I run the business together from home - she has often said that he does a woman\'s job and should get something \'proper\' - this particularly makes me laugh as she claims to be a feminist!
I really like the fact that I can work from home, organise my own time, am here for the children when they get back from school and can take holidays when I like. In short - I value my freedom.
Naturally, I am not saying that the translation industry is perfect - I often curse the fact that I have to work through the weekend and have to chase agencies for payment, the headache of keeping the accounts, etc. But it is heaven compared to sitting in a traffic jam everyday to work with people you don\'t really like and with whom you have little in common. People say the work is isolating but as the telephone never stops ringing and e-mails and faxes come in constantly I do not really find so. And there are always the dogs and horses to retreat to to get away from it all!
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| Bidding techniques and prices(=our earnings) | Dec 2, 2001 |
Maya, I agree with you.
One comment though. Bidding should always be private unless what one wants is to make prices tumble down. Tenders can be designed to serve several purposes. Punlic bidding will always lead to price cuts. Even if you place the first bid (and you place it high) the following will bid lower to have a place in the sun and the more bids, the more cuts. It follows the pinciple of ice cream sellers on the beach. When there\'s only one and he is at the other ... See more Maya, I agree with you.
One comment though. Bidding should always be private unless what one wants is to make prices tumble down. Tenders can be designed to serve several purposes. Punlic bidding will always lead to price cuts. Even if you place the first bid (and you place it high) the following will bid lower to have a place in the sun and the more bids, the more cuts. It follows the pinciple of ice cream sellers on the beach. When there\'s only one and he is at the other end of the beach, only people around him buy ice cream and the others don\'t bother walking that far. Then another comes up and they divide the beach between them. Then a third etc..., they donøt place themselves on the same spot but spread (likewise in terms of price and quality spread). Then other sellers come (maybe without paying the official costs of having a booth)and walk around selling cheap ice cream with no VAT or taxes. The customers don\'t care, they just want nice tasty ice cream and not to look to far. Then the ice-cream sellers with a booth pying VAT and taxes see their business reduced and maybe consider price cuts.
That\'s the stage where proz is when it comes to open bids.
On the bright side: I think Maya(and others) i/are right when it comes to direct customers and pricing. But I also know that many agencies are making customers believe they have an experienced, inhouse staff bending over thrir text in the back office, while the offices are a facade and the texts are everywhere racing across the wires of the Internet with no data protection. Only the client does not know their patent-pending application has amde it across half the earth back and forth being exposed everywhere it transited and ended (you know, satellite stations and more basic, telephone line interception of transmitted data, hackers etc...) before they received it back in a translated versio and had a chance to deposit it with the patent and intellectual rights authorities.
Interesting? As somebody who applied for the patent regarding a mathematical invention my eyes were opened to these hazards when having to protect my own data. Then I started to think: what about all these contacts, company reports, confidential material handed over and sent across the Internet and ending...God knows where?
I think agencies have a problem, they are simply not yet aware off.
I think agencies have a problem and their clients too.And we have also until clients realize. But WHEN THEY DO and believe me some day they will...
In the mean time, I am new to the site and made a few experiments. I placed bids on jobs I didn\'t want and went for low rates in open bids (10 EURO/word). I even placed a bid on that Human Rights stuff which honestly is really cheating whoever gets it, (the UK agency is offering 6 EURO/ word) and with past translations and simultaneous interpretation for Human rights, you could say I\'m qualified.No results. did not get any replies.
However I got one client who saw my profile and never had the job advertised. It was very encouraging and was not even a paying member yet.
So it seems proz.com offers very different options -some interesting, some no- and it\'s really up to us to try and get what we want to get out of proz.com
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