Glossary entry

Dutch term or phrase:

overkoot

English translation:

knuckling over

    The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2023-05-21 14:54:18 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
May 18, 2023 10:25
1 yr ago
20 viewers *
Dutch term

overkoot

Dutch to English Medical Livestock / Animal Husbandry equine anatomy
A hoof position in a lame horse. If anyone has a link to a Dutch-English horse anatomy / medicine glossary, I'd love to get it please!

Discussion

Barend van Zadelhoff May 18, 2023:
@ Jim We would need to know more precisely what 'overkoot' exactly stands for in your context.
For one thing, there is a difference between 'overkoot staan' en 'overkoot gaan'.
Barend van Zadelhoff May 18, 2023:
Agree.

Hoof pastern angles

'broken forward' corresponds with '[too] upright pasterns' and refers to 'overkoot staan'
MoiraB May 18, 2023:
I'm no expert but looking at images of "overkoot" and then googling hoof position images, I came across "broken forward". See https://veteriankey.com/the-role-of-the-hoof-and-shoeing/ about halfway down, where there are images of various hoof positions. Also http://rockleyfarm.blogspot.com/2012/08/hoof-pastern-angles-...

Proposed translations

7 mins
Selected

knuckling over

https://e-hoof.com/glossary/knuckling-over suggests 'knuckling over' but as it's not my area I cannot make a judgement on whether it's correct.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Yep, Google agrees. Thanks James."
2 hrs

upright pastern / too upright pastern

koot = pastern

overkoot = (too) upright pastern

The Pastern.
The pastern should be of medium length with a slope similar to the shoulder + or - 50o
. Faults are pasterns hich are too long, too short, too upright, too sloping
or over flexible.

The Pastern
The ideal is a pastern of medium length sloping slightly more than the front pastern. Faults are a long or short, or upright or too sloping pastern or one that is over flexible.

https://bapsh.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Magazine-Conf...

Overkoot stand
Wat is….

+ image

Overkoot is een afwijkende stand die voortkomt uit een steile stand en vaak te zien is bij jongen paarden. Er is een duidelijk verschil van het overkoot-gaan en het overkoot-staan. Het is niet te vergelijken met een steltvoet.

Overkoot gaan en overkoot staan zijn twee verschillende afwijkende standen.
1. overkoot staan Dit is een steile kootstand die groter is dan 135 graden en waarbij het pijpbeen in het verlengde staat van de voetas. Wanneer het paard stilstaat en de kogel naar voren knikt, spreken we van overkoot gaan(foto1).
2. overkoot gaan Wanneer een paard bij de beweging en belasting de kogel naar voor knikt, spreken we van overkoot gaan.

http://hoofcare.nl/hoefproblemen/overkoot-stand/

image upright pastern

https://m.facebook.com/ArleneArabian/photos/another-good-pas...

pastern angle
This is a conformational term used to describe the angle of the phalangeal axis. Assuming a straight phalangeal (or hoof-pastern) axis, a normal slope is an angle of 45-58° depending on whether a fore or a hindlimb is being evaluated. A sloping pastern is one which forms a shallower angle to the ground (less than 45°), this may be combined with a short or a long pastern. An upright pastern has a steeper angle (55°+ in the forelimb, 60°+ in the hindlimb) and is generally short. In cases where the phalangeal axis is not straight, the pastern angle differs from the hoof angle. An example of this is the 'club foot'.

https://e-hoof.com/glossary/en/pastern-angle//


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Note added at 5 hrs (2023-05-18 16:22:10 GMT)
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@ Asker

Is it about 'overkoot staan' or 'overkoot gaan' ?

overkoot staan --> upright pastern

overkoot gaan --> knuckling over

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Note added at 7 hrs (2023-05-18 17:30:16 GMT)
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It is even more complex.
'knucking over' is actually a more pronounced form (overkoot gaan) of upright pasterns (overkoot staan):


Knuckling over is a term used when examining the hind legs of horses. It is a condition where the fetlock joint in the horses leg has straightened so much, that the horse risks tripping over its hind hooves.

+ image

When you look at a horse’s regular hind leg, you’ll see the hoof naturally falls at an angle in front of the actual leg. However, when a horse has a tight or short tendon, its leg is at risk of overshooting.

If a race horse is suffering from knuckling then it might stumble over its own hooves while competing. However, horses at the highest level of UK and Irish racing are unlikely to reach a stage where they knuckle. After all, they are trained and examined regularly from foal and are unlikely to be able to run at the required speed if their fetlocks are causing them issues.

https://news.paddypower.com/guides/2023/02/01/horse-knucklin...

Acquired deformity of the fetlock in the forelimb can be seen at different levels of severity, from very upright conformation to “knuckling over” (the fetlock joint will be positioned dorsal to or in front of the foot) at rest only (can lock the fetlock back into an extended position when walked) to “knuckling over” at all times (unable to extend the fetlock joint at all).

https://instrideedition.com/what-to-do-for-horses-that-knuck...

Overshot fetlock ("knuckling over") in the horse.

"Knuckling over", or upright fetlock joints in the horse, is usually caused by a congenital tendon deformity, where the tendons are too short.

https://nl.pinterest.com/pin/490540584382623359/

Flexure involving primarily the fetlock joint is characterized by a moving of the pastern and fetlock joint forward and a knuckling at the fetlock joint, with the sole of the foot remaining level so the heel remains on the ground (Fig. 16–4). The leg may at first appear to be upright or straight at the pastern and fetlock (Fig. 16–3). As the horse walks, the fetlock may occasionally knuckle forward. As this condition worsens, the horse may stand with the fetlock in a knuckled-over position. Prolonged abnormal flexion results in a failure of structures (tendons, ligaments, and joint capsules) to elongate normally with growth so that straightening becomes more difficult with time. Thus, the longer a flexure deformity exists, the less likely it can be successfully corrected.

Fig. 16–4. Acquired leg flexure deformity involving primarily the superficial flexor tendon and fetlock joint. The right fetlock is abnormally straight and the left knuckled forward, but the heel remains on the ground, helping to differentiate the deformity from one involving primarily the deep digital flexor tendon and coffin joint.

https://veteriankey.com/developmental-orthopedic-diseases-in...
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Reference comments

3 hrs
Reference:

refs

oerkeatte, -oerkeattich, adj. 'overgekoot', 'overkootig' is een paard, als de koot (het hielbeen) door verstuiking of anderszins is doorgebogen of verzet, zoodat de hoeven meer naar voren uitkomen. Zie keat. — overdr. Dy âlde mûrre is oerkette , aan den voet uitgezet.

(‘Friesch woordenboek (Lexicon Frisicum). Derde Deel. R-W. by Dijkstra W., Winkler J., Hettema F.B.’)

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OVERKOOT STAAN, (v. paard) be knuckling over

(Huitenga, T.: Nederlands-Engels Woordenboek voor Landbouwwetenschappen)

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Note added at 3 hrs (2023-05-18 14:18:47 GMT)
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I've also archived the whole "Friesch woordenboek (Lexicon frisicum)" @ https://termhotel.com/Friesch_woordenboek_(Lexicon_Frisicum)
Peer comments on this reference comment:

neutral Barend van Zadelhoff : 'knuckling over' would be 'overkoot gaan, while 'overkoot staan' would be 'have upright pasterns' or similar. / 'knuckling over' (overkoot gaan) is a more extreme form of 'overkoot staan'.
2 hrs
You might be right. I wouldn't know. Just posted what I found on my computer but don't have time to delve into it. Huitenga's usually pretty reliable, but I'm definitely no horse specialist.
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