Pages in topic:   [1 2] >
Windows 7 Ultimate / Windows XP
Thread poster: Francoise Perigaut
Francoise Perigaut
Germany
Local time: 07:01
German to French
+ ...
Nov 19, 2010

I'm going to buy a new system and I'm not sure if I should go for Windows 7 Ultimate or if a good old Windows XP with 3 GB would be enough.
I don't want to spend too much money on it because my systems usually don't last long, there's always something going wrong after only a couple of years, and I prefer to buy a new system then and take a fresh start.

My main reasons to go for Windows 7 Ultimate would be the possibility to switch the interface language and the possibly increased speed.
Contra: the price, as Windows XP would cost nothing. And I have a lot of very old devices and software, especially an "ancient" Laserjet, I'm afraid to have trouble getting it to work with Windows 7.

What is your experience with Windows 7? Does the added RAM really make the system noticeably faster? Is the language switching feature helpful for us translators or actually not so convenient? Is the Windows XP modus reliable and is it sure then that I will get everything to work first go? I have a lot of work at the moment and can't afford to spend my week-ends fixing this kind of things.

I would use the system only for translation purposes, so I'm not sure if it's worth having loads of RAM. I have 3 GB right now, which should be enough, but Studio especially is so sloooow, I was wondering if more RAM would help in that regard.

I know it has already been discussed before, but more people have been using Windows 7 by now and I'd like to know what they think. Is it worth upgrading in my case?

[Edited at 2010-11-20 08:57 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Anton Konashenok  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 07:01
English to Russian
+ ...
Not too much difference, but try it yourself Nov 20, 2010

Francoise, neither operating system will be noticeably faster than the other on 3 GB RAM, and I seriously doubt you'll ever need more RAM for translation tasks. Your performance bottlenecks are definitely elsewhere. Furthermore, any additional RAM beyond 3 GB will only be visible to the system if you have a 64-bit version of Windows, which is well known for poor support of old hardware. With 32-bit Win 7, drivers for old hardware are more likely to be available, you can just look at the specific devices you have and check their manufacturers' web sites for drivers.
The language switching feature seems totally irrelevant to me. I have used English versions throughout my life and always feel awkward when I have to work on someone's computer with a localized version of Windows.
In your situation, the only serious advantage of Windows 7 is having a lot more protection against various troubles - anything from viruses to accidentally deleting important system files by mistake. In particular, Windows 7 has its own malware protection - Windows Defender (built-in) and Security Essentials (to be downloaded for free). Given that many third-party antivirus programs (especially Kaspersky) are known to slow the system down a great deal, this may well be the reason why your current system is so sluggish.
On the other hand, you may or may not like Windows 7 user interface. Some people do, some don't.
The bottom line: the best you can do is try Windows 7 (unlike XP, you can install and run it for 30 days without entering an installation key) and see whether you like it. If you do - activate it, if not - install XP. Maybe you can just borrow a computer with Windows 7 somewhere?


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Francoise Perigaut
Germany
Local time: 07:01
German to French
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Language switching feature Nov 20, 2010

Thanks a lot for your answer!
I know about the RAM limitation, I was thinking about a 64 bits system if I go for Windows 7 - which I doubt more and more since I really want to be able to use some of my old devices and you say it might be a problem.

As for the language switching thing, I thought it might be useful for translation purposes. Since English is not a working language of mine, it's a bit tricky to always go the roundabout way with the Microsoft glossaries (first look up the English term and then translate the English term into the target language). I was hoping I could easily switch to the French interface when I need to check how something is called in the French version of Windows. For the rest I would always work in the same environment too, it would really be only for translation purposes. But you seem to say it's not realistic?


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Oliver Walter  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:01
Member (2005)
German to English
+ ...
XP mode in Windows 7 Nov 20, 2010

Something that may be of interest: there are some programs that will run under Windows XP but not under Windows 7 (I don't know which ones they are). They can be run in "XP mode" on some editions of Windows 7, including Ultimate but not Home Premium. There is some information about that here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_7_editions

Oliver


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Philippe Etienne  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 07:01
Member
English to French
Windows 7 Home and language switching Nov 20, 2010

If switching languages is the only reason for getting Ultimate, you may be able to switch languages using Windows 7 Home (usually already preinstalled on new computers and less expensive than Ultimate) and donateware called Vistalizator (http://www.froggie.sk/).

I learned about this tool 2 weeks ago after a desperate Internet search: My wife bought a laptop in Spain with Windows 7 Home 64 bits preinstalled, but... the interface is in Spanish, and she hardly read Spanish at the moment. So it was either upgrading to Ultimate, struggling for weeks learning the Spanish Win7 interface (we're both XP users) or getting a full French Windows 7 Home and losing the preinstalled Office 2007 Family Edition during the clean install. Or find something that would save my day.

My experience about it is very limited, so read carefully the info on the web site to make sure it meets your needs. There is something about Service packs, and depending on the languages you want, this tool might not be able to install them all.
Apparently I couldn't install French on top of an Spanish pack on this Windows Edition.
However, the process was fairly straighforward, it's now all in English and I assume I can switch back to Spanish. And there doesn't seem to be malware since.

I didn't understand why you want to be able to switch interfaces for Microsoft UI translations, but the workaround above may be the cheaper way, even with a donation to the programmer.

I can't tell about speed/compatibility, I am still on XP (without SDL Studio) because of these software compatibility concerns.

Good luck,
Philippe


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Zoltán Kulcsár  Identity Verified
Local time: 07:01
English to Hungarian
actually... Nov 21, 2010

you don't have a choice, if you really buy a new PC, as Windows XP OEM sale ended on October 22th. I recommend choosing a suitable version of Windows 7, you don't need the Ultimate just for using another language interface, as other have already pointed out

Direct link Reply with quote
 
Francoise Perigaut
Germany
Local time: 07:01
German to French
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
@ Zoltán Nov 21, 2010

But my computer shop sells PC without any operating system installed, why can't I install Windows XP since I already have it? Is that forbidden? I'm not buying a complete PC at Saturn & Co.

Thanks a lot for all your answers which confirm I don't need to go for 7 Ultimate 64 bits for now.

I actually don't have speed issues with my current 3 GB RAM system except for Trados Studio (a few other programs are slow to start, but it's not that big a deal), so I thought it was maybe due to the new programs requiring as much RAM as possible and having 4 GB might improve my experience with Studio. But if you say it can't be the problem, I'll happily stick with XP for now.

[Edited at 2010-11-21 13:00 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 07:01
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
Yes, you can unless... Nov 21, 2010

Francoise P. wrote:
But my computer shop sells PC without any operating system installed, why can't I install Windows XP since I already have it?


... Windows XP you own is and OEM version that is sold with new computers only. In this case installing it at another computer would be illegal.

[Edited at 2010-11-21 17:42 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Oliver Walter  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:01
Member (2005)
German to English
+ ...
Windows licencing Nov 21, 2010

You can find out whether your windows XP licence is an OEM (Original Eqjuipment Manufacturer) version: Start - Settings - Control Panel - System - "General" tab. The registration number there will, or will not, contain the letters OEM: for example, mine is
764xx-OEM-0011xxx-00xxx (I've replaced some of the digits by "x").
If it's an OEM version the licence is only for the computer on which it was first installed. You can replace some components of the computer and still keep the licence, but if you replace the motherboard or the whole computer, Microsoft won't transfer the licence to the new system unless you can persuade them that it is the original computer.
In London (and possibly elsewhere - I don't know) you can obtain new OEM CDs for XP (Home or Professional) for about 20 - 50 pounds from some dealers and at a "computer fair", for installation on a new computer.
If you have the full retail (more expensive) version, I think you can transfer it to another computer but might need to go through some process to uninstall it first from the first computer.
Oliver


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:01
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Thinking of switching myself, eventually, and so I am following this thread avidly. Nov 22, 2010

My question would be: can anyone tell us, from personal experience, if the 64-bit version of 7 is:
1. faster, because of the ability of addressing much more RAM, and
2. able to handle ALL old XP programs via XP-mode in Ultimate?

I am quite happy with XP, but am starting to do text editing of files of up to 1GB, and so am wondering if there is any point switching.

Francoise: an XP OEM CD should be very easy to locate. (e.g., http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=oem%20windows%20xp%20sp3&_sacat=0&_dmpt=UK_Computing_Software_Software_SR&_odkw=oem%20windows%20xp&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313)

Michael


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Anton Konashenok  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 07:01
English to Russian
+ ...
To Michael Nov 28, 2010

No, the 64-bit version won't be any faster unless your program needs more than 3 GB RAM, which is extremely unlikely, even if you are editing a 1 GB file. Furthermore, in the interactive editing mode this is irrelevant anyway, because it's YOUR speed of work that is the bottleneck. Just about the only disciplines where you really have to have a 64-bit system are 3-D CAD, 3-D visualization, complex editing of high-definition video, and various scientific and engineering simulations.
The XP mode is supposed to run virtually any old applications, but not drivers. So, if your software needs to install a custom driver, it won't run.

[Edited at 2010-11-28 12:29 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
FarkasAndras
Local time: 07:01
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Not really Nov 28, 2010

Anton Konashenok wrote:

No, the 64-bit version won't be any faster unless your program needs more than 3 GB RAM, which is extremely unlikely, even if you are editing a 1 GB file.

Not at all. The issue isn't if a single application uses 3GB of RAM, it's whether the whole system uses 3GB of RAM. With heavy multitasking involving several memory-hungry applications (such as webbrowsers and apsic xbench), it is quite possible to use up all 3 gigs in "normal use". Plus the OS can always benefit from extra memory, preloading frequently used apps and data into memory to speed up their retrieval etc.
Few people need more than 3GB of memory, but that doesn't mean it won't be useful if you do get more.

[Edited at 2010-11-28 17:16 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Anton Konashenok  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 07:01
English to Russian
+ ...
Yes and no. Dec 1, 2010

Farkas, theoretically, you are right. However, in routine desktop computer use in the office, even if many tasks are open, they are hardly ever executed simultaneously. Therefore, most of the allocated virtual memory can be easily paged out to disk. We'll only experience a short delay when switching from one task to another. Furthermore, why do you call web browsers memory hungry? On the 3 GB scale, they are fairly modest. Right now, for example, I am running Firefox 4.0 beta 7 - its working set (essentially, real memory requirement) is about 150-160 MB.
I am currently using Windows 7 with 2 GB RAM and have on the average about 6-10 desktop applications open. I observe very little paging. Caching of I/O data does naturally provide some benefit, but not too much, either - essentially, only a small portion of the cached data gets actually reused. If I see any bottlenecks in the system, it's probably in the processor power rather than memory size. Maybe, as an old IT guy, I intuitively refrain from doing things overloading the operating system, but this remains to be proven

[Edited at 2010-12-01 23:53 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
FarkasAndras
Local time: 07:01
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Because they sort of are Dec 2, 2010

Anton Konashenok wrote:

Farkas, theoretically, you are right. However, in routine desktop computer use in the office, even if many tasks are open, they are hardly ever executed simultaneously. Therefore, most of the allocated virtual memory can be easily paged out to disk.

Perhaps. I'm not sure how often say, Win7 does that. I really don't think the OS writes out to disk everything that's not being used at the moment, so your total memory use will always be made up of a lot of stuff that's not related to the active window, and that's how it should be.
In fact, I'd imagine that the OS doesn't use the pagefile at all unless it's starting to run low on free RAM. I'd rather have 4GB or RAM and not have it write stuff to disk at all if possible. Memory isn't that expensive (especially if it came with your computer and it's just a matter of using an OS that can see all of it) and I don't like waiting for my computer to access data:)

Anton Konashenok wrote:
why do you call web browsers memory hungry? On the 3 GB scale, they are fairly modest. Right now, for example, I am running Firefox 4.0 beta 7 - its working set (essentially, real memory requirement) is about 150-160 MB.

If you have, say, 10 tabs open with various large pages open with lots of media (not unusual for me), the browser does eat up a lot of memory. YMMV, of course... if you only have 2 tabs of pure text, that won't take up much RAM.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Ulf Samuelsson  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 00:01
Member (2007)
English to Swedish
+ ...
Speed of Win 7 compared to Win XP Dec 2, 2010

I got a new laptop in February, and it had Win 7 installed, but I changed it to a dual boot system with my old XP installation disc.

Why?

I found that while Win 7 is nice to look at and does perform better than Vista, it doesn't beat XP when it comes to speed in Trados. (Reorganizing a memory with 500,000 TUs took 4 ½ minutes in Win 7, but only 3 minutes in Win XP.)

I still haven't found any specific reason for using Win 7 rather than Win XP. There isn't anything that I need to do that I cannot do faster in XP than in 7, and on top of that, I have an old Termdok database that use full-screen mode in DOS. My Win 7 graphics driver for nVidia refuse to allow full-screen mode, which is another reason for my preference for XP. (I can circumvent this problem by temporarily switching to the MS standard graphics driver and then switch back again after having used the database, but it isn't very workable if I need to use the database many times per day.)

Has anyone else found any really useful feature that is only found in Win 7?


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Windows 7 Ultimate / Windows XP

Advanced search






memoQ translator pro
Kilgray's memoQ is the world's fastest developing integrated localization & translation environment rendering you more productive and efficient.

With our advanced file filters, unlimited language and advanced file support, memoQ translator pro has been designed for translators and reviewers who work on their own, with other translators or in team-based translation projects.

More info »
BaccS – Business Accounting Software
Modern desktop project management for freelance translators

BaccS makes it easy for translators to manage their projects, schedule tasks, create invoices, and view highly customizable reports. User-friendly, ProZ.com integration, community-driven development – a few reasons BaccS is trusted by translators!

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search