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Dec 12, 2019 19:53
4 yrs ago
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French term

obligation garantie

French to English Law/Patents Law: Contract(s)
Amending legal instrument to do with backers of a loan (XXX is the name of the group):

"Par l’effet (i) de la promesse d’emploi figurant à l’article 4 (Promesse d’emploi – PROMISE TO USE THE INTRA-GROUP LOAN FACILITY), du Nouveau Prêt Intragroupe XXX (ii) de la quittance ci-dessus et (iii) de la déclaration d’origine des deniers, et conformément aux dispositions de l’article 1346-2 du Code civil, l’Emprunteur subrogeant, à la sûreté et garantie du paiement et du remboursement des Obligations Garanties à l’égard du Nouveau Prêteur Intragroupe, subroge expressément le Nouveau Prêteur Intragroupe (tant pour son compte qu’au nom pour le compte tout ayant cause, ayant droit ou successeur, qui viendrait à prendre la qualité de prêteur aux termes du Nouveau Prêt Intragroupe XXX), qui l’accepte, et ce, à due concurrence de la fraction de l’encours du Prêt Intragroupe Préexistant remboursée par lui, dans la créance et les accessoires (incluant les droits, actions, privilèges et sûretés bénéficiant au Prêteur Intragroupe Préexistant et notamment dans le bénéfice du Privilège de Prêteur de Deniers Préexistant inscrit à son profit."

Again, this expression has come up before: https://www.proz.com/kudoz/french-to-english/finance-general...

There, the learned rkillings correctly identifies these as "obligations" rather than "bonds".
But here it is more tricky: can you "pay and reimburse/repay" an obligation? On the other hand, the likelihood that these are "bonds" seems to me to be virtually nil, as they are said to be secured "à l'égard de" the new lender.

My suspicion is that this might be a particular type of obligation in law, the details of which are not given explicitly in this document, which can indeed be "paid".

Anyone got a hunch?
Proposed translations (English)
4 secured bonds/secured obligations

Discussion

Mpoma (asker) Dec 15, 2019:
Thanks @Eliza thanks for the input from a juriste ... but you still haven't quite covered the oddity here: how can an obligation be "paid" or "repaid"? It seems pretty bad drafting at best: at its simplest, don't these specifically have to be obligations to pay?
Eliza Hall Dec 14, 2019:
In EN a mortgage is an obligation "In its original sense, the term obligation was very technical in nature and applied to the responsibility to pay money owed on certain written documents that were executed under seal. Currently obligation is used in reference to anything that an individual is required to do because of a promise, vow, oath, contract, or law. It refers to a legal or moral duty that an individual can be forced to perform or penalized for neglecting to perform....

In its general and most extensive sense, obligation is synonymous with duty. In a more technical meaning, it is a tie which binds us to pay or to do something agreeably to the laws and customs of the country in which the obligation is made. Just. Inst. 1. 3, t. 14. The term obligation also signifies the instrument or writing by which the contract is witnessed."

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/obligation
Mpoma (asker) Dec 12, 2019:
Register... @Timothy. Thanks, but a home mortgage is not an obligation, it is a loan. You can "easily" repay a loan (if you have enough thunes). You would fulfil/satisfy/meet an obligation to repay a loan. The very loose usage you are instancing here is something you would never find in a FR legal document: completely out-of-register. Legal documents in any language have to be accurate and precise. Hence the question.
Timothy Rake Dec 12, 2019:
@Mpoma Why would it be strange to repay a secured obligation? Happens all the time. For instance, a home mortgage is a secured obligation. People pay those back on a monthly basis
Mpoma (asker) Dec 12, 2019:
Thanks OK but doesn't it sound distinctly odd to you, "pay/repay an obligation"? At best this is surely infelicitous drafting in the French... and I'm not sure how I'd go about putting it in English. How about you?
philgoddard Dec 12, 2019:
Thus time, I do agree with the previous answer.

In my opinion it means secured/guaranteed obligations/liabilities, and doesn't need to be discussed again.

Proposed translations

36 mins

secured bonds/secured obligations

just as proposed in the kudoz terms previously
Note from asker:
Er... the point is that it can't be both.
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