Jul 22, 2003 11:03
20 yrs ago
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English term
Hungary
TRANSLATOR AND INTERPRETER SINCE 1989
Native in: Russian 
Works in: English to Russian, Hungarian to Russian, Russian to English, and 3 more.
Please help me find a rule
English
Other
Linguistics
Grammar
Problems with editing. The phrase goes:
"Advisers finalized traning materials incorporating both: policy as well as technical elements of sound budget review."
I just do not like this "both" and "as well as" together. I suggested to put either "incorporating both: policies AND technical elements" or "incorporating policies AS WELL AS technical elemets". The author does not agree with me.
What do you think is it correct to say "both: policies as well as technical elements"?
"Advisers finalized traning materials incorporating both: policy as well as technical elements of sound budget review."
I just do not like this "both" and "as well as" together. I suggested to put either "incorporating both: policies AND technical elements" or "incorporating policies AS WELL AS technical elemets". The author does not agree with me.
What do you think is it correct to say "both: policies as well as technical elements"?
Responses
+3
5 mins
Selected
You are right
You should either use "incorporating BOTH policies AND technical elements" (no colon after both) or "incorporating policies as well as technical elements".
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Note added at 2003-07-22 11:11:42 (GMT)
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Correlative conjunctions join parallel grammar structures. Here are some correlative conjunction pairs.
Ex: both--and, either--or, neither--nor, whether--or, not--so much as, not only--but (also)
Subordinating conjunctions introduce dependent clauses.
http://www.write.armstrong.edu/gm1.html
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-07-22 11:11:42 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
Correlative conjunctions join parallel grammar structures. Here are some correlative conjunction pairs.
Ex: both--and, either--or, neither--nor, whether--or, not--so much as, not only--but (also)
Subordinating conjunctions introduce dependent clauses.
http://www.write.armstrong.edu/gm1.html
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Mario Marcolin
9 mins
|
| agree |
mportal
: to use 'as well as' as well as 'both' in this context is tautology and, therefore, sounds clumsy
11 mins
|
| agree |
Derry
6 days
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Thank you for the correlative conjunction pairs, this is what I was looking for. I felt I was right, just could not prove it. "
+5
3 mins
Dan Dascalescu
United States
United States
United States
As specialized as IT gets
Native in: Romanian
Works in: Romanian to English, Moldavian to English, English
incorporating policies AS WELL AS technical elemets
OR, "incorporating both policies AND technical elements" (without the colon after "both").
In other words, I agree with Olga.
In other words, I agree with Olga.
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Enza Longo
: I agree with Olga as well
6 mins
|
| agree |
JudyK
: ditto, and yes, definitely without the colon
7 mins
|
| agree |
Henrique Magalhaes
10 mins
|
| agree |
tazdog (X)
: yes, I agree, and also agree that the colon is not needed
21 mins
|
| agree |
ghassan al-Alem
: Either one should be used, not both. I agree.
2 days 7 hrs
|
+3
3 mins
Cilian O'Tuama
Germany
Germany
Native in English
&
English
Germany
Quality Translations since 1986
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, English, German, and 6 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
16
below
it's fine with 'as well as' if there are two policies
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Note added at 2003-07-22 11:14:05 (GMT)
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i.e. if the \'both\' refers to \'policy 1 and policy 2\' and not to \'policies and technical elements\'
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Note added at 2003-07-22 12:41:13 (GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks for answering my question, Olga. Very nice!
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Note added at 2003-07-22 11:14:05 (GMT)
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i.e. if the \'both\' refers to \'policy 1 and policy 2\' and not to \'policies and technical elements\'
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Note added at 2003-07-22 12:41:13 (GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks for answering my question, Olga. Very nice!
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
vixen
: You're right. If "both" refers to two particular policies, the combination of "both" and "as well as" would be grammatical. Once again, it depends on the context.
19 mins
|
|
finally someone understands the point I'm trying to make :-)
|
|
| agree |
DGK T-I
: Yes, it does make a difference to the answer, whether it's policy or policies.
2 hrs
|
|
thanks, but the asker doesn't care
|
|
| agree |
yolanda Speece
: I have to agree with vixen and your observation. Your phrasing makes more sense and it just "sounds" better.
2 hrs
|
|
Thanks.
|
9 mins
Michael Powers (PhD)
United States
United States
Native in English
&
English
Works in field
United States
US Court Cert. 1980 Ph.D. 1981
Native in: English
Works in: Spanish to English, Portuguese to English, English to Spanish, and 2 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
136
both policy (policies) and technical elements ...
Looking at the examples in the Random House Dictionary, please note number 3, as a conjunction, meaning "alike:"
both (b$th), adj.
1. one and the other; two together: He met both sisters. Both performances were canceled.
–pron.
2. the one as well as the other: Both of us were going to the party.
–conj.
3. alike; equally: He is both ready and willing.
[1125–75; ME bothe, bathe, influenced by Scand (cf. ON b!thir both; c. G, D beide, Goth ba tho skipa both (the) ships, OHG bêde < *bai thai); r. ME bo, ba, OE b!; c. Goth bai; akin to L amb$, Gk ámph$, Lith abù, Skt ubháu]
both (b$th), adj.
1. one and the other; two together: He met both sisters. Both performances were canceled.
–pron.
2. the one as well as the other: Both of us were going to the party.
–conj.
3. alike; equally: He is both ready and willing.
[1125–75; ME bothe, bathe, influenced by Scand (cf. ON b!thir both; c. G, D beide, Goth ba tho skipa both (the) ships, OHG bêde < *bai thai); r. ME bo, ba, OE b!; c. Goth bai; akin to L amb$, Gk ámph$, Lith abù, Skt ubháu]
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