| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | Some agencies make you waste so much time Thread poster: Paula Hernández
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Quite often, I see job posts from agencies that have my CV from previous posts. Surprisingly, they post new jobs on my language pairs and specialization (or on general subjects).
At some point I might have worked for them (and received good remarks on my job) or was told that they would keep my CV for future projects, but the fact is that most of the time they either don't really have a database of translators (I assume) or simply don't bother searching for a translator there, even ... See more Quite often, I see job posts from agencies that have my CV from previous posts. Surprisingly, they post new jobs on my language pairs and specialization (or on general subjects).
At some point I might have worked for them (and received good remarks on my job) or was told that they would keep my CV for future projects, but the fact is that most of the time they either don't really have a database of translators (I assume) or simply don't bother searching for a translator there, even when very often we have to take tests to simply become a part of their database.
Honestly, this is why it seems such a waste of time to fill in questionnaires and documents for agencies and such a fail in terms of marketing your experience as a translator with them.
Done with the ranting. Now I will move forward to better marketing techniques. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Barbara Toffolon (X)
Italy
Local time: 04:54
Italian to English
+ ...
| Bad management | Dec 14, 2012 |
I have to agree with Paula. Each time I am asked to fill in forms, provide CV, sign Confidentiality Agreements and then I see those same agencies advertising work in my language pairs and specialization....even after receiving complimentary remarks on the work I provide. I often feel like I'm wasting my time. I often look for jobs that come straight from outside clients and not from agencies. Much better. And they also pay quickly while agencies always have a sad excuse for delaying payme... See more I have to agree with Paula. Each time I am asked to fill in forms, provide CV, sign Confidentiality Agreements and then I see those same agencies advertising work in my language pairs and specialization....even after receiving complimentary remarks on the work I provide. I often feel like I'm wasting my time. I often look for jobs that come straight from outside clients and not from agencies. Much better. And they also pay quickly while agencies always have a sad excuse for delaying payments. ▲ Collapse
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I read that tests were ALWAYS a waste of time. Can`t really remember where.
At first I treated this remark with some portion of doubt. Now I can tell you I totally agree with this statement.
| | | | | Then they make you do extra work to invoice them... | Dec 14, 2012 |
Some agencies turn up again after a long interval - maybe they don't have work in my language pairs so often...
What really infuriates me is when thy ask you to log in at intervals to see if they have posted any jobs. (Forget it as far as I am concerned!!!)
Or else when it comes to invoicing, they ask you to log in, reset your password (as the last one has expired if you have not forgotten it anyway), and type in strings of figures, job numbers, PO numbers, internal ref... See more Some agencies turn up again after a long interval - maybe they don't have work in my language pairs so often...
What really infuriates me is when thy ask you to log in at intervals to see if they have posted any jobs. (Forget it as far as I am concerned!!!)
Or else when it comes to invoicing, they ask you to log in, reset your password (as the last one has expired if you have not forgotten it anyway), and type in strings of figures, job numbers, PO numbers, internal reference numbers .....
Meanwhile none of this produces an invoice that the accountant or tax authorities will accept, so you have to do that pro-forma.
After all that extra work, you have no proof whatsoever that you have even sent an invoice, unless the agency sends a mail to acknowledge receipt.
I feel tempted to add an extra half hour to my fee for general hassle.
Probably we should send mails to agencies who do that instead of just complaining here - if enough of us did it, a few might listen. ▲ Collapse
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| so-called cottage industry approach - good or bad? | Dec 14, 2012 |
These giants of our industry - with their invoicing systems, etc. - are not the best ones to cooperate with.
I prefer to work with so-called cottage industry agencies where you usually contact the only owner of the agency, or at least a person who is in direct contact with the boss.
They usually pay more, provide clear instructions, do not require piles of documents to be printed and signed, etc.
When I see a huge form on a website of an agency, I usually... See more These giants of our industry - with their invoicing systems, etc. - are not the best ones to cooperate with.
I prefer to work with so-called cottage industry agencies where you usually contact the only owner of the agency, or at least a person who is in direct contact with the boss.
They usually pay more, provide clear instructions, do not require piles of documents to be printed and signed, etc.
When I see a huge form on a website of an agency, I usually close the tab. My experience tells me that they mostly look for low-rate translators. the logic is that if you have time to spend on completing their form, you do not have work, because if you had had one, you would`t have spent your precious time on completing the from. No work = you may agree to work for ridiculous rates. ▲ Collapse
| | | | neilmac
Spain
Local time: 04:54
Spanish to English
+ ...
Vadim Kadyrov wrote:
These giants of our industry - with their invoicing systems, etc. - are not the best ones to cooperate with.
I prefer to work with so-called cottage industry agencies where you usually contact the only owner of the agency, or at least a person who is in direct contact with the boss.
They usually pay more, provide clear instructions, do not require piles of documents to be printed and signed, etc.
When I see a huge form on a website of an agency, I usually close the tab. My experience tells me that they mostly look for low-rate translators...
This is also my experience. Big, faceless companies tend to be an irritating, demanding waste of time, no matter how slick their websites and jazzy their "goals" (cringe) and "mission statements" (wince) may be designed to sound. I call them 21st century "slavers".
| | | | Elías Sauza 
Mexico
Local time: 20:54
Member (2002)
English to Spanish
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I completed a translation for an agency about two years ago, receiving positive comments on my work. Yesterday, I received an email message (to undisclosed recipients) from the same agency asking to complete a translation test. It sounded to me like they wanted a free translation in many languages.
| | | | Phil Hand
China
Local time: 10:54
Chinese to English
| Even more insulting | Dec 14, 2012 |
I did a very tough test a couple of months ago for an agency that does a lot of difficult, technical work. I passed the test, and did one job for them, with no complaints. Then I heard nothing until a few days ago, when I suddenly got a mass email from them to all their Chinese translators, saying "we're desperately short of people, can you recommend anyone?" I thought, well, I could recommend myself... but you know what, I won't recommend myself, because I don't fancy working with you that much... See more I did a very tough test a couple of months ago for an agency that does a lot of difficult, technical work. I passed the test, and did one job for them, with no complaints. Then I heard nothing until a few days ago, when I suddenly got a mass email from them to all their Chinese translators, saying "we're desperately short of people, can you recommend anyone?" I thought, well, I could recommend myself... but you know what, I won't recommend myself, because I don't fancy working with you that much any more. ▲ Collapse
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| The good and the bad | Dec 14, 2012 |
Barbara Toffolon wrote:
I have to agree with Paula. Each time I am asked to fill in forms, provide CV, sign Confidentiality Agreements and then I see those same agencies advertising work in my language pairs and specialization....
That may be actually good news: they might be searching actively for jobs to assign to you.
Anyway, I've had a lot of this (CVs, tests, posting diploma copies etc.) in the recent past, and this has gone so far that I have decided to introduce a fee for these tasks for new "clients". I've put "clients" between inverted commas because often they just need your details and diplomas to take part in a tender, and when they win you are likely to have absolutely nothing from that.
On the other hand, I have absolutely no problem doing a test, sending my diploma etc. for a regular client of mine who is competing for a big contract.
[Upraveno: 2012-12-14 13:40 GMT]
| | | | Paula Hernández
United Kingdom
Local time: 03:54
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Stanislav Pokorny wrote:
Anyway, I've had a lot of this (CVs, tests, posting diploma copies etc.) in the recent past, and this has gone so far that I have decided to introduce a fee for these tasks for new "clients".
That is a great idea!
I am even questioning the good in sending my CV each time. I think I will simply make an e-mail template with my Proz or LinkedIn profile, there is more than enough information there...
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 04:54
French to English
| paying for tests | Dec 14, 2012 |
As a PM, I remember a (brilliant) translator telling me that he always invoiced tests, on the grounds that if the agency didn't get the job it was bidding for, it would not be because of the quality of his translation. My boss threw a wobbly, but ended up paying, and we got the job. He wanted to make the translator sign a paper to say that he would refund us if we didn't get the job because his test was not good enough, but I managed to persuade him that it wouldn't happen.
| | | | Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 22:54
Spanish to English
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| Preferred providers | Dec 14, 2012 |
Several years ago when I suggested the availability calendar (cannot find the post now), part of the idea was that agencies who are ProZ members would be allowed to create a folder within ProZ of their preferred suppliers (those they have worked with in the past, tested, or whose profile they find interesting and whose rates they accept - a kind of "like" button if you will).
When the agency posts a project, they will be given the option to initially send the job to only those trans... See more Several years ago when I suggested the availability calendar (cannot find the post now), part of the idea was that agencies who are ProZ members would be allowed to create a folder within ProZ of their preferred suppliers (those they have worked with in the past, tested, or whose profile they find interesting and whose rates they accept - a kind of "like" button if you will).
When the agency posts a project, they will be given the option to initially send the job to only those translators listed in their preferred folder (who have the availability set at available). After a period of time the job would then be posted for the general ProZ population.
[Edited at 2012-12-14 15:57 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 04:54
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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| It comes with the territory | Dec 14, 2012 |
Paula Hernández wrote:
Quite often, I see job posts from agencies that have my CV from previous posts. Surprisingly, they post new jobs on my language pairs and specialization (or on general subjects).
I think this is just something you have to accept as a business person.
Even if the reason for this is that the client is disorganised, you should take it in stride. You can use the opportunity to remind the client of your previous contact, e.g. my rate is still the same as the last time I did work for you. If you remind the client that he was happy with your previous job, he might be more likely to hire you again. See this as your opportunity to stand out from the crowd, yet again.
However, I can think of another reason why clients prefer to use the jobs posting system, and that is because it takes less time to invite new applications than to try to see if any of the existing contacts are available to take the job.
| | | | Shai Navé
Israel
Local time: 05:54
English to Hebrew
+ ...
| We just need to know our industry and choose the right opportunists | Dec 14, 2012 |
I can only echo the impression of others in this discussion. Generally speaking, from I experience I have learned that there are two types of potential business partners:
1) Those who have work - they usually know what they want, usually need nothing more than a simple NDA and the entire collaboration and relationships are hassle free, nice, concise and professional.
2) Those who don't seem to care about wasting their own and other people's time with endless paperwork, cumbersome onl... See more I can only echo the impression of others in this discussion. Generally speaking, from I experience I have learned that there are two types of potential business partners:
1) Those who have work - they usually know what they want, usually need nothing more than a simple NDA and the entire collaboration and relationships are hassle free, nice, concise and professional.
2) Those who don't seem to care about wasting their own and other people's time with endless paperwork, cumbersome online system and procedures, and general lack of any real personal contact. Oh, and on top of that, one usually doesn't get any work out of it.
Type 2 agencies are usually the big ones. Some of their repeated and duplicate postings and contact attempts is due to their complex structure (divisions and regional sub-divisions), high PM turnover (so all the knowledge and information accumulated by one PM go down the drain when they leave) and what seem as lack of internal resource sharing and management. I don't even bother with them because even if one invests 1-2 hours of their time to go through their bureaucracy, they usually find out that it never did materialize into something, was just a one time project (so deduct the administrative work time from the total pay) that due to the above mentioned reasons won't see any continuation, or that the terms agreed (mostly rates) are ignored, or the opposite situation, they expect you to work according to the "rates in our system" that could be accurate as of 5 or more years ago (and sometimes even simply made up).
The question of translation tests in general and paid vs. free in particular, is a topic for another discussion (and there are plenty of them as it is). Although there are valid arguments for and against free tests, I think that in the context of providing a free sample(s) just to be included in someone "database" or "pool" there shouldn't be any question, and they should be avoided. It just doesn't make any business sense even if one thinks in general that providing free translation samples for a SPECIFIC project has some merits.
@Jeff,
This is a good idea, with one shortcoming - the human element.
Those who manage their resources efficiently don't really need such a system (although they may benefit from it at times), and it will probably not change the organizational culture of those who don't.
[Edited at 2012-12-14 16:51 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | I get peeved from... | Dec 14, 2012 |
... agencies that contact me saying that they need my services. They sound eager to have me working for them ASAP. Then they put me through a whole routine of entering my data on a slow-responding and infamously complex e-forms system, have me fill in, sign, scan, and e-mail (and sometimes snail-mail) their NDAs, service agreements, and other documents, and upload my CV and diplomas.
Some quibble about my rates. Others don't bother, I never hear from them again. A few of these send ... See more ... agencies that contact me saying that they need my services. They sound eager to have me working for them ASAP. Then they put me through a whole routine of entering my data on a slow-responding and infamously complex e-forms system, have me fill in, sign, scan, and e-mail (and sometimes snail-mail) their NDAs, service agreements, and other documents, and upload my CV and diplomas.
Some quibble about my rates. Others don't bother, I never hear from them again. A few of these send me an e-mail 2-3 years later, asking me to re-enter all my data, because they have changed to a new database system.
And yet there are some that suddenly, out of the blue, write me an e-mail to the tune of, "We have 4,000 words that must be translated within the next two hours. Can you do it?" Most add the cherry on the topping with "We'll pay our top urgency rate of USD 0.04/word in 60 days." My question: Who is in a rush here?
[Edited at 2012-12-14 18:55 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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